SPOILERS FOR CHAPTERS 7-12

I'm not sure what the next chunk of Finn is supposed to be, but I'm assuming it'll include chapter 8, right? I just finished reading 8, and wow. Up until then, I had been enjoying the book. Dark, yes, disturbing, sure, but Clinch can weave a spell and then I hit upon a paragraph that completely nauseated me. The "preacher", the boat, the poor, poor kid... I guess there is someone worse than Finn out there.

I had to stop reading for the night. Again, it speaks volumes to Clinch's ability as a writer that he can cause such a visceral response to a paragraph, but ugh.

Message edited by its author, Jul 17, 2008, 8:42pm.

I'm up to chapter 11, trying to finish 12 before I stop to think about what I want to say. But the scene with the "preacher" on the river was definitely disturbing. I don't know if he is worse than Finn, but just as bad. I was interested by Finn's reaction. He definitely wanted to part company with the man and have nothing more to do with him because of what he'd done, yet he didn't come out and condemn him. Just as we might do with an acquaintance who cheats on a spouse, or engages in petty thievery - we might not report it to anyone, but we distance ourselves from the person.

I think the plan (my plan?) was to try to make it through the end of Chapter 12 this week. I'm not quite there, but I'll be back.

Thanks for posting another thread. I didn't remember until just now!

Sounds good! I'm not at chapter 12 yet either (obviously) -
I just wanted to whine about how icky chapter 8 was.

I thought Finn's response to the preacher was interesting, too. My immediate reaction was "good for you, Finn!" but then after thinking about it - why didn't he stop it? Then he goes home and draws the whole scenario on his wall? Methinks that is going to come back to haunt him, but maybe not.

I got through chapter 13 - I got carried away when I was reading 12, next I knew it was chapter 14!

My overall impression of Finn in this section is that he seems more human than in the first 6 chapters. He is disgusted by the "preacher" in chapter 8, he enslaves the girl from the river boat, but then proceeds to live with her as a husband for several years and even has tender words for her when he returns from prison. He seems very fond of the child. (Did we know from Twain that Huck was mulatto?) On his way home from prison, he repays the woman who fed him by chopping wood and doesn't take advantage of her in any way - even when he thinks she is giving him a "come hither" look.

I feel like something isn't quite right, though, with the family - the judge and the brother, even the mother. That is one strange family.

Despite Finn not being so creepy in this section, the book still has a very dark feeling. I'm glad we're reading it together, else I'd be tempted to put it aside for something easier. This book isn't hard to read, but it's hard to keep reading. Clinch has really done an excellent job of making us feel the emptiness of Finn's life. It's still jarring to me whenever he skips through time, but I think that is helping us focus on Finn. He surely isn't "all there" - I don't think he can view his own life with any rationality. We already know he can't tell right from wrong or good from bad, can he tell past from present? The drawing on the walls thing is weird - do you think he only does that at the time when something happens, or do you think he does it when he remembers something that happened earlier? Jfetting, I agree with you that this may be a bit of foreshadowing.

Anxious to hear everyone else's thoughts.

I agree with the idea that Finn starts to see more human. With the preacher and the boy we see that there is some sort of line that Finn seems unwilling to cross... however far out from normal it may be. (Though I too kind of wonder why he didn't stop the preacher or at least kick him out of his skiff.)

Then the tenderness with Mary and Huck. It seems clear to me that he really cares for his family. And while I would've expected him to treat Huck as some sort of inferior child (and wonder how things might have been different if his skin was darker) Finn actually defends him, albeit extremely violently.

I remember reading a review of the book before we began that mentioned that the story is not a who-dun-it but a why-dun-it -- a mystery about motive. However, I didn't feel this at all until we get a way's into Mary's story. Now, I find myself feeling confused because I don't understand why Finn would murder Mary.

The drawing on the wall surprised me because it seems to imply a level of emotional awareness and affectedness I didn't think Finn possessed. It's actually the first detail in the book that struck me as unbelievable, but maybe we'll see a reason for it later on.

As for knowing Huck is mulatto, I'm near certain that's not known in Twain's books. I don't think it's ruled out, either. What has been confusing me is that I seem to remember Huck having no memory of his mother and/or that she was gone before he was living with the Widow, which doesn't seem to be likely in Clinch's narrative. Of course, it's been a long time since I've read Huckleberry Finn so I could just be misremembering.

He does appear more human thanks to his flashbacks. I'm surprised - I was sure nothing could make me have any sympathy for him. I agree with both of you, his relationship with his family is surprisingly sweet given his stated prejudices. No, I don't think that Twain ever stated that Huck was mulatto but Clinch's explaination makes sense to me - the very name "Huckleberry" could suggest "non-white" back pre-Civil War.

The only part that rang a little hollow was the quickness with which Mary becomes attached to Finn. After all, he did basically kidnap her from her family. Stockholm syndrome, maybe? She thinks about leaving once, and that's it. I can't imagine why Finn would murder Mary, either. Maybe he had something bad happen, and he wanted to get back in the Judge's good graces?

Oh, I hate the Judge. Completely appalling, the way he takes over Finn's trial. What a sham. Not that Finn didn't deserve it.

This book is making me want to go back and re-read Huck Finn.

twomoredays - so far, the writing on the wall does seem a bit unbelievable but it is something mentioned in Huck Finn. Jim finds Finn's body, and mentions the drawing on the walls in the room, and the clothes. What I think is cool is Clinch's interpretation of what the drawings could be.

Message edited by its author, Jul 17, 2008, 8:53pm.

#7 I thought the same thing about the way Mary became so attached in what seemed like such a short time. Maybe Stockolm syndrome, or maybe more time is passing than it seemed. I'm still really struggling with the time thing - jumping back and forth, I just don't feel like I have any feeling for just how long anything is taking. I guess that's how I would respond to twomoredays' comment about Huck not remembering his mother - I didn't get the impression he was really very old - maybe 3 or 4 - when Finn gets out of prison. At that age, he wouldn't remember much. I wonder how much longer before Mary is killed.

7 - Ah, well that does explain the drawing scene more. It's been so long that I didn't remember that at all. I really do need to go back and read Twain's book, now. Of course, it's trapped in Denver...

I didn't really think of Mary as being attached to Finn so much as resigned to her fate, but I guess Finn's return from prison does imply an attachment. Perhaps it is a bit of Stockholm syndrome, but it does at least partly seem to me as if Finn does love her and that her attachment sprang from that. I'm not sure.

As for time, I think I may be getting lost, too. It seemed to me that Mary's murder had occurred right before Finn learns about Huck's money. When he goes to the judge it doesn't seem like all that much time has passed. I'm really not sure.

I have to admit that the Judge's decision to send Finn away was infuriating. That was probably the first time I actually felt pity for Finn. It made me view Will in a bit of a negative light, too. I guess I felt that as nasty a character as Finn can be, he still deserves justice like anyone else and justice certainly wasn't being served in that courtroom.

On an administrative note, do you want to keep doing the six chapter sections, or do you want to just finish the book next week? I noticed that the last six chapters only account for about thirty pages, so it be easy to just tack them on and finish it next week. I know I'm likely to anyway, since I tend to work up speed toward the end of a book. I was wondering what your thoughts were.

I say we try to finish it. I also tend to pick up speed toward the end of the book, especially when (like now) I really want to know what happens.

Time-wise, I'm under the impression that all the "present-day" events are occurring within the space of several months. It's winter at the beginning of the book, and by chapter 12 it is spring.

I had another thought regarding Huck's mixed-race status. Both Tom Sawyer and Huck Finn are essentially from the point of view of children. Aren't they even written in first person? It's been so long since I've read them. But that could explain why Twain didn't feel any need to mention Huck's parentage - kids don't care about that sort of thing the way adults do.

#9 - Re: pace of remaining reading. I could make an argument either way. Donna828 hasn't posted here this week - I saw her post elsewhere the other day where she commented that she was on vacation and needed to catch up on Finn for this group. For her sake, we might want to draw it out. Also, even though the last 6 chapters are short (I had also noticed this), that might allow extra time for introspection about the book as a whole after it's finished without shortchanging the 3rd section. But, like you, I am anxious to finish a book once I get close to the end, so I will likely read the last 30 pages along with this next section. After finishing the whole thing, it'll be hard to talk about only chapters 13-18, pretending to ignore 19-24.

How thoughtful of you, sjmccreary. I am back home now and only slightly jetlagged. I will dive into Finn over the week end and be ready to discuss the book in its entirety. I must say, I needed a break after the first part. I'm glad to know Finn has shown a bit of humanity.

I've jumped ahead quite a few chapters so I'm ready for the next installment of Finn. After reading your guys' comments I seem to agree with most of you, I was glad Finn showed some true emotion like that of a human instead of an animal. He's very caveman-like to me, and the preacher scene disturbed me greatly. I think Finn is just as guilty however because he did nothing to stop either the rape or murder...
Also, glad to hear I'm not the only one getting lost as far as time goes in this book. I'm getting a little confused, but I'm on chapter 18 right now and I think it's about ready to all come together...

There's a new thread now for the discussion of the final part of the book. See you all there and last one out don't forget to grab the cheese and wine!