To all the Twilight haters out there: what would you recommend as an alternative? What book would a literary snob give to an almost-15-year-old girl who reads mostly Meyer, Meg Cabot, The Clique and Gossip Girls? My daughter does read better stuff occasionally, but I'm getting tired of seeing all this trash around the house. I bought the Twilight series for her, but she gets the other books from the library and her friends.

I continually bring home "good" books to tempt her, but most of them end up collecting dust on the shelves, returned to the library, or read by her younger sister who has broader tastes. She generally dislikes sci-fi and fantasy ("Please, Mom, no talking animals," but vampires are OK, I guess), and she prefers modern settings. So Jane Austen and historical fiction are out, though several of her friends enjoy these books.

Surely there must be some good writing in the teen romance category, or are these terms incompatible?

Phillip Pullman's Sally Lockhart series (which preceded the much more well known his dark materials. An excellent mystery/detective series, with an orphaned Victorian young lady as the protagonist. The ruby in the smoke is the first, i think.

Bram Stoker's Dracula, the ur-text that started it all. It's an epistolary novel and is like a darker version of Pride and Prejudice

the house of the scorpion, Nancy Farmer. Margaret Mahy's memory or the catalogue of the universe. Memory about the friendship between a teenage guy and an lady suffering from Alzheimer's is v. moving. Mahy writes for all ages and many of her earlier books are fantasy/sf ish, but these are "normal" novels set in present day New Zealand. Thirsty by MT Anderson isn't his best - but it is a different sort of modern vampire story. Sarah Dessen Someone like you has a number of good YA romance novels.

Do you think she might like short stories? How about a collection of Borges. Labyrinths, maybe. Do you think his quirkiness might tap her imagination?

If she likes adventure stories about dogs (and what young girl doesn't) try her out on White Fang or Call of the Wild.

I have no clue what a disinterested soon-to-be-fourteen year old girl would be interested in. It's a hard age, especially for girls. Who was that lady got in all that trouble over the grownup stories she told for pre-teen girls. I'm sure someone here knows to whom I refer. Maybe some of her stuff. Judy Blume? How about Nancy Drew or are girls beyond that sort of thing these days?

I'd go with the Borges first. If she doesn't like it, give it to her sister, or read it yourself.

Anne Rice's INTERVIEW WITH A VAMPIRE; Richard Matheson's I AM LEGEND and HELL HOUSE; Stephen King's 'SALEM'S LOT. Someone on the "Unreliable narrator" thread reminded me of Shirley Jackson's WE HAVE ALWAYS LIVED IN THE CASTLE. Creeepy.

Best Young Adult book I've read in a decade (and I know I've mentioned this one before), Rich Wallace's WRESTLING STURBRIDGE. One YA offering my wife howled her way through was THE BOOK OF RALPH (John McNally)...

Perhaps, her preference for modern settings aside, you can sucker her into reading Jane Eyre by telling her that it was a big influence on Twilight. (You'll find plenty of documentation via a Google search, if she's skeptical. ;)

When I was her age, I was reading a lot of crap YA series, with considerably less good literature in the mix. There may be hope for her yet. :) At the time I did like Edgar Allan Poe, Jack London, Snow Falling on Cedars (modern story with a romantic component, but some sex, so you may not want her reading it), and a host of 19th century love stories that, as you mentioned, may not float her boat.

If I had known at the time that Haruki Murakami's novels existed, I probably would've loved them. Norwegian Wood is his most approachable (no magical realist-y elements), but again, some sex.

When I was a teenager I really liked coming of age lgbt fiction. Not many vampires, but Annie on My Mind is a great book.

As mother of an almost 14 year-old reader (who is a hater of Twilight and who wouldn't even consider Gossip Girls), I'll second Dark Materials Trilogy, though it doesn't sound like something your daughter would enjoy. Take a look at anything by John Green (An Abundance of Katherines, Looking for Alaska, and Paper Towns come to mind. (I haven't read these, but my daughter did and liked them). I notice that The Hunger Games and Catching Fire are in your library. My daughter loved them both and wants me to read them. A couple of years ago she enjoyed Life As We Knew It, which may be a bit young for your daughter now (I think they're aimed more at a middle school audience), but you might take a look at The Year Without Michael by the same author.

Some of her other recent choices were: Thirteen Reasons Why, Elsewhere, Memoirs of a Teenage Amnesiac, Crank, Bound, etc. Of course, she's also been willing and ready to read more and more "adult" and "classic" stuff and less and less YA stuff. Right now she's reading A Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy (never knew how many times "42" pops up in one's life, but I certainly do now) Hope some of this helps.

Message edited by its author, Sep 29, 2009, 6:51pm.

#8 inaudible: Looks interesting. Do you think it'd work as a first-time read for an adult? Or did that ship sail a decade ago for me?

Thanks to all for the terrific suggestions. I'm going to check them out. Even if she ends up not liking them, I probably will.

2> I loved the Dark Materials series myself but Sally Lockhart sounds more her style.

5> She's already read most of the Judy Blume books and the (original) Nancy Drew mysteries. She still likes to reread the old NDs. Borges sounds good.

6> Great ideas, but unfortunately she doesn't handle scary well. I should try these myself, though.

7> Yeah, I read a lot of crap myself during my teen years, so maybe there is hope. It's my belief that you have to experience the bad to appreciate the good.

9> I had to push to get her to read Hunger Games but she loved it and begged me to buy Catching Fire as soon as it came out. I originally banned Gossip Girls from my house but then told her she can borrow it from the library and I'll hold my nose and pretend I didn't see. My parents let me read anything I wanted when I was a teen. I stumbled across some inappropriate stuff, but I'm glad I had that freedom.

Thanks again for the recommendations. Keep 'em coming, please!

10> It's been a while since I read it, but I think an adult would enjoy it. Of course, as far as coming of age lesbian stories go, you would probably enjoy The Chelsea Whistle even more.

You might take a look here http://www.librarything.com/bookaward/AL... for a list of the American Library Association's best books for young adults.

Message edited by its author, Sep 29, 2009, 8:42pm.

Try these sites. This first one will allow you to type in the title and find books from there. (This is similar to what you can do here at LibraryThing or at Amazon but specifically for kids.)

http://bookwizard.scholastic.com/tbw/hom...

http://www.teenreads.com/features/ultima...
http://www.atyourlibrary.org/recommended...

Message edited by its author, Sep 29, 2009, 10:47pm.

>5 - If she's interested in the books described by the OP, then I'm not sure she'd be interested in Borges - hopefully, though.

>6 - I've heard Anne Rice isn't a good writer... is she? Though the subject matter interests me not at all, anyway.

Marho Lanagan's new novel, Tender Morsels, is said to be good. As is The Forest of Hands and Teeth by Carrie Ryan.

I think your daughter might enjoy Alyson Noel's Immortal Series..

It does have paranormal aspects to it, but the main Character is Ever Bloom.. (yes, that is her name) and she's 16 years old and in high school. So far, and to my knowledge, there is only 2 books out in the series and a new one coming out soon.

1st one is called Evermore
2nd one is called Blue Moon

I loved them!

The first Anne Rice novel, INTERVIEW WITH A VAMPIRE, is a good read and quite well-written, certainly far better than anything else she did. A bit baroque in places (for my minimalist tastes) but a page-turner. After that, she descended into hackery and I couldn't be bothered. And now, of course, she's retelling the story of Christianity...and taking 10 times as many pages as the original writer(s) of the Bible. Her son is a novelist too, though from the reviews I've read, it appears not a very good one...

Message edited by its author, Sep 30, 2009, 10:54am.

It's not amazing literature, but when I was a teenager I liked vampire novels by Amelie Atwater Rhodes. I think I still have Demon in My View somewhere.

She actually started writing when she was 16 or so years old, which is what drew me to her more than anything.

My life changed when a teacher assigned The Picture of Dorian Gray for class, and there was no way I could go back to YA after reading that. I spent my allowance at the local used bookstore to find novels by aesthetes and male homosexuals. How about The Story of O by Pauline Reage or The Lover by Marguerite Duras? Another particular favorite was Andrew Holleran's The Dancer from the Dance.

Of course, my parents didn't buy these books for me.

When I turned 11 or 12, my mother gave me Les Miserables and that revolutionized my reading career. That plus the musical was fantastic as a girl.

I was not impressed with the Twilight books, but the adult book by the same author called 'The Host' is one of my favorite books. I loved it because it makes you look at the alien invasion idea from a new perspective-from the view of the aliens. I don't know if you would find it appropriate for your daughter, but my 15 year old daughter is ready to read it. As a mom and as a teacher, I think the most important thing is to encourage your daughter to read a variety of material. One way to encourage exploratory reading is to use the various book award lists-we (my daughter, my students and I) try to read the books on one of the lists, and we often find we like something we would not have chosen to read if it hadn't been on the list. Good luck!

Thanks for all the recommendations. I appreciate the links to the award lists, too. However, my problem isn't really finding good young-adult books. It's finding ones similar enough to the ones she likes but of better quality.

We have a terrific awards program here run by the Ontario Library Association. Each year, they publish a shortlist of award nominees for various age categories and encourage schools to participate in a group reading program. My daughter did this for several years but chose not to participate the past two years. I bought a couple of books from the list so she can read them at her leisure, but she hasn't even cracked them open yet.

My younger daughter loves this program though and had read all 10 books on this year's Silver Birch fiction list. From this, she discovered and recommended Shane Peacock to me, for which I am grateful. She loved Gordon Korman's Swindle too and is reading more of his books now.

Anyhow, I'm still having fun checking out everyone's recommendations. There are a number that I think I'll enjoy even if she doesn't. I still love YA novels even though I'm past 40.

You might want to look into Charles de Lint's "Newford" series. It is a fantasy series set in the modern world, so in that respect is similar to the "Twilight" series.

THE WHITE DARKNESS by Geraldine McCaughrean won a Whitbread Award for Best Children's Novel. It looks VERY good. My son Sam says it's going to be his next book, after he finishes the three SANDMAN graphic novels he got for his birthday...

i think Newford is Toronto, modestly altered. Done up as a bunch, reading de Lint can get repetitive. But he's a very good storyteller. (we have a LOT of de Lint - and i don't think we labeled it YA, though it's certainly appropriate). I think my favorite might be the little country. There's also Datlow & friends annual the Year's Best Fantasy and Horror anthology

I read about something called the "Dark Days" novels by Jocelynn Drake on the CBC website. They seem to be getting a bit of a buzz...

Here's the author's home page:

http://www.jocelynndrake.com/Index.html

Looks like paranormal romance mixed with urban fantasy. Female protagonist.

>18 - Oh, interesting. I wouldn't have guessed.

>19 - She was published at 13, actually. She's a favourite author of a friend of mine, so I took a look at her work, and wasn't terribly impressed (even given her age). I don't think the one I looked at deserved to be published. Some other people I respect in reference to English agreed, and with that I lost interest in her.

I'll second the John Green recommendation. Looking for Alaska was wonderful, but if she likes the Gossip Girls type of thing, she would more readily take to An Abundance of Katherines. John Green is actually one of the cleverest and entertaining public speakers I have ever seen. I wish I was young adult now...I can't believe the drivel they had for teens and tweens ten years ago!

I always adored anything by David Levithan when I read YA (okay, still adore him!). His Realm of Possibility and Boy Meets Boy are, in my opinion, his best.

2: I brought home the first Sally Lockhart mystery from the library, after older daughter agreed to give it a try. The bad news: she didn't even crack it open and I returned it three weeks later when it was due. The good news: in those three weeks, my husband, my younger daughter and I all read it and liked it very much, and we now have the second book out on loan.

well - i'm very glad 3 of you liked it! Pullman's main goal in the Sally Lockhart books was just telling a "ripping yarn." He has a bunch of short novels that are just...weird. I really liked his dark materials too, but there's a defn. agenda.

Maybe the Jim Butcher Dresden books? or Patricia Briggs' Mercy Thompson stories? Both are combo modern urban detective/romance/fantasies featuring somewhat "non-normal" protagonists (ie Mercy Thompson is a werewolf/auto-mechanic w/ a side gig in investigations). By no means "great" books, but at least different authors and good entertainments. I think the Dresden books have been turned into a TV series of which i know nothing.

A really good YA urban fantasy is Emma Bull's Finder - one of a set of books set in a shared setting that various writers have used.
The second review (or rather 2nd most recent) on LT is a very fair description:
http://www.librarything.com/work/25437/r...

Most of the books/stories in the series are good->very good; Finder is better than that - and might well be in your local library.

I know someone has already suggested Jane Eyre but I want to give it another vote. Edward Cullen does remind me of Mr. Rochester. What other character scowls? It always annoyed me when I see Twilight shirts saying 'I love Edward' when I know that Edward Rochester is so much sexier, romantic and not undead. Jane is also more interesting and stronger that dull Bella.

I know this is admitting that I read Twilight my only defense is that I work at a library. Give her the Brontë sisters. I think she will enjoy them.

At the very least, give her Wuthering Heights (she might recognize it since it was mentioned in one of the Twilight books—don't ask how I know that). Hopefully, she'll recognize how melodramatic and unromantic Heathcliff is (and NOT fall in love with like so many do), then go back to Twilight and laugh at Edward.

Now that I think about it, there's a lot to laugh at in Wuthering Heights...

i'd be really surprised if she goes for Wuthering Heights - although the Bronte's were every bit as over the top as I imagine Twilight to be (and better written). Even though vampires ARE of respectable age and antiquity, mathgirl's eldest seems to want them in a current setting.

I must admit to disliking WH in college - calling my snippy and not especially insightful essay "Wuthering Heights Rewuthered." (we had to read a book and write an essay on it each week in our frosh English class @ W&Mary); i might well like it better now, in my dotage. I remember the books i disliked better than the ones i liked..the essays of Thomas Carlyle put me to sleep for weeks and resulted in my first late paper.

I am astounded at the fact that you managed to read a book every week—I hardly have the time (or energy) anymore to read a CHAPTER let alone a novel in seven days. I'm guessing one learns how to pull all-nighters in college?

36 bob - Reminds me of the undergrad essay I wrote in my freshman American lit class, "Zen and the Art of Motormouth Maintenance." (By the way, SilverTome, this class was at my fourth-tier undergrad university just several years ago. We also read a book a week + essay. Given the overall crappiness of my undergrad U, I can't imagine that many students in the US do less than that. Be not discouraged, it's really not that difficult, and shouldn't require all-nighters.)

I agree that there's a lot to laugh at in Wuthering Heights. Hubby talked me into giving it another try; we've been reading it aloud to each other for the last couple of weeks. I appreciate the narration and the structure, but I can only enjoy the story if I'm laughing at it--take it seriously and it's tosh. I think my favorite part so far is Hindley's knife-gun.

young adult series that include vampires and/or werewolves include vampire academy series by Richelle Mead, Morganville Vampires series by Rachel Caine, House of Night by PC Cast &Kristin Cast, Blue Bloods by Melissa De La Cruz, Mortal Instruments series by Cassandra Clare, the Darkest Powers series by kelley armstrong. A lot of these aren't romances the way twilight is and I am not sure any of them would be read by a "literary snob". :P

Oh and I detested Wuthering Heights when I had to read it for class and I can't imagine anyone reading it outside of class. Though I suppose people must.

Message edited by its author, Nov 9, 2009, 10:40pm.

Just don't read Atlas Shrugged

From the South Park episode "Chickenlover":

Officer Barbrady: Yes, at first I was happy to be learning how to read. It seemed exciting and magical, but then I read this: Atlas Shrugged, by Ayn Rand. I read every last word of this garbage, and because of this piece of shit, I am never reading again.

Trey Parker and Matt Stone may be libertarians, but they aren't irretrievably stupid.

I advise everyone I meet to read Atlas Shrugged. without having actually read it people may believe what they're told about it.

Only Atlas Shrugged could make illiteracy the sensible alternative.

This group is amazing. Ayn Rand manages to make it into every thread. Anyhow, thanks all, for the latest non-Rand suggestions.

My daughter surprised me by picking out Bob Dylan's Chronicles: Volume 1 from the bookstore's sale table and she's reading it now. She also finished Of Mice and Men (a school requirement) and told me how much she hated it, but then I overheard her telling a friend that she liked the book. Maybe the problem is me, not her.

has she read young adult classics like The Giver, The Secret Garden, A Little Princess, To Kill a Mockingbird, or The Witch of Blackbird Pond?

for books like Twilight: these might have some bad language and sex, but i wouldn't imagine it's any worse than Gossip Girl (although i've not read those, so i can't really compare)

Bloodsucking Fiends & You Suck: these are by my fav dark humor author and should be accessible for her age. they are really really funny and have a strong female lead.
The Last Unicorn: one of my favorite's. quite dark, but really spectacular. there's a good movie version too!
Lonely Werewolf Girl: it's not spectacular literature, but it might get her interested in less mainstream authors, which might open her up to more things. about a werewolf princess in modern London- full of rock n roll, fashion, teen angst, and a good old fashion blood feud.
Graceling: again, not spectacular, but better than Twilight. it's more true fantasy as it's set in a fantasy realm, but it's got a similar kind of Twilight love story.

for books like Gossip Girl:
Stargirl: this is one of those breathtakingly good highschool books. all about how being different is perceived and what it takes to stick to your guns.
The Disreputable History of Frankie Landau-Banks: this was surprisingly pretty good. it's set in a boarding school and is about a girl getting the better of her snobbish male counterparts.
Vile Bodies: about young socialites in London in the 30s. glitzy and glamorous like Gossip Girl, but much more literary. funny but also about serious issues pertinent even to teens.

some good possibilities:
City of Ember: good coming of age, distopian novel
Haroun and the Sea of Stories: a must read for everyone who likes stories
Farenheit 451: a must must must read. completely changed my reading life
Confessions of a Jane Austin Addict: i hated this book, but a teen would probably find it interesting. it might get her interested in Austin....
The Whale Rider: wonderful coming of age book about a Maori girl from New Zealand. very powerful. another great movie!

books i've not read but look interesting:
Angus, Thongs and Full-Frontal Snogging: supposedly Bridget Jones for teens
Beastly: retelling of Beauty and the Beast, set in NYC and cast with teenagers

wow, long list. i always overdo it! hope something here helps.

eta: i hate when touchstones don't work!

Message edited by its author, Nov 22, 2009, 9:00pm.

44: Thanks for all these recommendations. She has read a few of these (Secret Garden, A Little Princess, Stargirl) and she is reading To Kill a Mockingbird as a school requirement right now. However, most of the ones you've listed are new to both of us and look like good ones to check out.

No one has mentioned Francesca Lia Block?! Excellent books, starting with the Weetzie Bat series and branching into all sorts of stories. Her heroines are all interesting young people, often female, who very much live in the real world (and sometimes with fantasy elements).

Seconding Kelley Armstrong! She has two teen books and a bunch of adult books, but they're all in modern settings. Also seconding Lonely Werewolf Girl, as Martin Millar is a fab writer. I also enjoyed his Good Fairies of New York, which is fairypunk in NYC.

Margo Lanagan's an excellent writer, but IMO Tender Morsels has too much sexual violence to really be a YA book. Just so you know.

Message edited by its author, Nov 24, 2009, 5:37pm.

There are some really well written books for teens these days. I found that Kelley Armstrong's Darkest Powers Series (The first one is called The Summoning) was really good. It is about a girl who just turns 15 and can see dead people. It has werewolves and witches in it as well so if she enjoys Twilight she will enjoy that. I would tell her to hold off on the rest of Armstrong's books until she is older. They are definitely more for adults. But that series is for teens and well done.

Also, the Mortal Instruments Series was really good. Again, about a 15-16 year old who can see stuff she shouldn't. Definitely the most romantic of teen novels I have read.

P.C. Cast House of Night books were fantastic. Vampires, I am not sure however if you would like them but I am sure she would.

Did you dislike the Twilight series because it was too vulgar for your daughter? I completely understand. I wouldn't want my 14 year old reading Breaking Dawn. But I thought those books were well done also. So maybe don't take my advice. :)

46, 47: Thanks for the suggestions, as well as the warnings!

Actually, I don't dislike the Twilight series. I'm not qualified to comment on the series because I haven't read the books myself. When I speak of the "trash" around the house, I'm mainly talking about the Gossip Girls and Clique books.

My main concern is that my daughter, who used to read a large variety of books, has been reluctant to wander out of the teen chick-lit genre the past two years. So I posed this challenge to the Literary Snobs: are there examples of good writing in this genre, or other books that might appeal to a kid who reads mainly this kind of book?

Indeed, I've received a lot of recommendations that don't fit into this category, but I don't mind. Even though my 14-year-old is not interested in them, the rest of the family is taking advantage of the pointers.

Those two Martin Millar books are hysterical! Lonely Werewolf Girl is a bit longish, but aren't the twilight books pretty long? And, along with the Good Faeries of New York, suzy, led zepplin and me is pretty great. He has a couple of clunkers inbetween, but when he's on form, his books are very funny, definitely warped and kind of moving.

I think friends gave our son Neverwhere when he was around 12 and we all very much enjoyed it, as well as the Sandman suite of comics, which really are his true medium. He's very visual (Neverwhere was originally a BBC tv series) and his most straightforward novels are, i think, much weaker than his "picture books."