SNOB-TV

Someone raised a good point on another thread:

Do REAL snobs watch TV?

Is it permissible? What shows make the snob-ish grade?

(Well, we have a movie thread...)

OK, Cliff, I am in a "disclosing" mood and this is cheaper than therapy....

I'm a classic TV curmudgeon. My father has a "Kill your TV" bumper sticker and only owns a DVD player and a screen, so that he and his wife can watch NetFlix. I am not as extreme as he is, and I am pretty permissive with my kids, but TV is just not my idea of a good time. Also, I really dislike it as background noise.

I've said on another thread that I recently started watching "House MD" with my son because he likes it and it is mildly entertaining (though really formulaic). But if my son lost interest I wouldn't watch it on my own. When I do feel the urge to watch TV it is going to be a feature film or probably I'll get fed up and turn it off.

I am only admitting all this to you people because you are already snobs. I actually don't go around badmouthing TV or I'd have practically no friends. 90% of people in my age group consider it one of the 2 or 3 major topics of conversation and I try as hard as I can not to look like a jerk to them. This may be why I really prefer talking to boomers than GenXers. More of them are likely not to be that into TV shows.

Anna: we don't have cable, just two channels and one of them has lousy reception.

I have a "Kill Your Television" sticker on my attache case. Sums up my feelings perfectly.

That said, I like watching old stuff to unwind--sometimes I'll dig up a tape of Leo McKern as the great Horace Rumpole or some Jeremy Brett/Sherlock Holmes episodes.

Had fun with the "Firefly" series.

Have watched perhaps a grand total of two episodes of "The Sopranos" and about half an episode of "Lost".

Lately, I've been watching old shows from Roy Thinnes' 60's SF TV series "The Invaders" (kind of a forerunner to "The X Files").

In other words...I think we are simpatico on this point.

But I've heard good things about "Six Feet Under" and various other shows so I thought I'd give people a forum to talk up stuff I might've missed.

Just in case there's another "Firefly" out there...

-The Wire
-Band of Brothers
-Six Feet Under
-Battlestar Galactica
-Cowboy Bebop
-FLCL

The last two are anime. Sue me.

As far as I'm concerned, all of the above are beyond the kind of categorical reproach broadcast by certain bumper stickers.

we heart Cowboy Bebop - bought the set and the movie on DVD (along w/ all the rest of the anime i enjoy so much). If there's something good on TV, i'll be able to watch it sometime after the fact on DVD, on my own time and schedule. Bebop & Serial Experiments Lain (again on DVD) are probably my favorite TV series ever. What's FLCL?

I've made the argument that SEXL is/are the best movie depiction of the impact of the internet on society many a time. The Matrix is a bit of trivia in comparison. (Pi probably is near the same level for command line Unix computing...). Firefly is w/out doubt my fave English lang. tv/sf.. Need to recall both Firefly and Serial Exp. Lain from the guy i've loaned them to.

We've watched a good bit of X-files and Lost that way as well. Did watch UNC in the NCAA on real live TV but that's it since the Olympics. But it's not just the ads (i understand that technology exists to bypass such) but the sense that one is chained to a particular piece of time/space if one is watching a tv series as it is broadcast. Coupled w/ a disconcerting sense of displacement from one's own geographic locale. Of course the suburbanization of the USA has created a nation that's "nowhere" and "everywhere" at once and so having the news be from nowhere is probably fitting.

I've heard enough good talk about The Wire and Battlestar Galactica that Netflix will likely ship them to our PO Box sometime soon.

It's disconcerting to watch the digital signal on our rabbit ears break up into a screen of pixels when it gets windy. Our home entertainment center features a 13" TV w/ rabbit ears downstairs in our piano/guest room and a 23" TV hooked up to our dvd player (sadly not a multiregion player, big mistake) in our bedroom.

Mad Men is absolutely delightful.
Oz had remarkable character development.
Seinfeld always makes me laugh, especially when Kramer falls down.
The Simpsons stopped making me laugh about 5 years ago, but I don't mind a rerun now and then.

TV isn't as evil as it was once upon a time--the 80s come to mind.

Bob: Did I mention I bought one of the "Lain" DVDs for my sons as an end of school year treat?

...and let's hear it for "South Park". The show seems to get BETTER with each passing year. The animal rights episode had me weeping with laughter, outrage, disgust and admiration.

Hey Cliff -
I don't think so. The only downside to having the first Lain DVD is that the series begins quite subtly - you get hints and intimations of what might come, but it seems like it MIGHT just be a somewhat weirder than normal HSchool anime. But that's why Netflix exists~!

If you refuse to watch TV, you're not a snob, you're a Luddite ... or at least wildly uninformed. I don't watch network TV or local news, but the glowing bucket does get it work out via Netflix. Series on HBO and Cinemax and surreal gems like "30 Rock" are what make TV great. Unfortunately, dreck like "Dancing with the Stars" and "American Idol" also make me think the Taliban had a point in banning television. Like anything else in pop culture, there's good stuff and there's crap. Use your brain and make your own decisions.

So my kids are going to become "Lain" junkies?

Well, right now it's World of Warcraft that captivates them so mebbe it's time for a change of pace.

But I bought it on YOUR recommendation...and you know what that means...

5:
FLCL is...well, from what I understand, FLCL was kind of a pet project of some anime elder statesmen. Anybody else would never have gotten it made. The animation style is pretty bizarre, with periodic shifts in the way things are drawn (nothing drastic, and never for more than a scene). The story has to do with a kid whose forehead starts growing enormous monsters.

It's all a thinly-veiled metaphor for sexual coming-of-age, but it's cool and extremely surreal, and satirizes a lot of really irritating anime cliches, and the pathos is actually pretty affecting. It's probably impossible to fully explain.

9:
Yeah, I keep up with South Park, and the satire can be pretty spot-on sometimes, but I wouldn't give up any of the shows I mentioned before for South Park. It's clever, but I require more than cleverness to really *love* a tv show/movie/book/song/etc.

Don't watch much television, tend to watch mostly DVDs. There are few series which I will actually make an effort to sit down and watch each episode. They are "Waking the Dead", "Life on Mars" (now finished, of course) and its sequel "Ashes to Ashes" (2nd series to start soon, w00t), and... that's about it. One-off dramas I'll watch too, the ones that are between 2 and 4 episodes long - British telly is good at them. Like the recent "Red Riding" trilogy.

Sf television I'll watch although I don't have a high opinion of it. But only some series. "Firefly" was mildly entertaining. "DS9" is the best of the Trek franchises, but still makes me wince a lot. The new "BSG" was equal parts excellent and infuriating. I did like "The X-Files" but that was variable. "Doctor Who" - old is often crap... take one I watched recently. Someone or something has broken into several laboratories and stolen secret plans and components. The thief is plainly not human - it ripped open a safe, for a start. But what is it? The series is titled "Robot". Bit of a giveaway that. Later, the robot is on guard outside the nuclear bunker where the baddies have holed up. UNIT sends in a tank... and it's superimposed footage of an Action Man toy tank! New "Dr Who" is better, but it's been hard to get excited about some of the episodes.

We have a TV-friendly household - too damn friendly, if you ask me - but anyone who hasn't seen "Pennies from Heaven" or "The Singing Detective", both by Dennis Potter, should really do so ASAP.

And those are just the Sistine Chapel of television. There are lots of others worth visiting.

While I agree with many of the choices listed above, and would add a few (The Simpsons, Deadwood, Private Life of a Masterpiece, for example), I have to admit that my main tv watching is live sport, especially since it so expensive to actually go and watch it.

While I don't watch any live TV -- censorship and commercials, hooray! -- I do miss watching Formula One live on the weekends. Yes, Virginia, there are Americans who like motorsport that think NASCAR is boring and beyond stupid. I enjoyed Kenneth Hobbs commentary on SPEED TV, since he vaguely reminded me of Holly from Red Dwarf It's also nice to know that cultural titan Clive James did reportage on Formula One and is a well-respected TV critic.

And I know TV is mostly a vast wasteland, with the occasional pockets of brilliance. As a former peon of a local TV station, I can safely affirm that local news is industrialized brain rot that makes people stupider after watching it. But saying "All TV is bad" is asinine, is not critical thinking in any way, and sounds incredibly misinformed. It's the mirror version of Bill Hicks's Waffle House waitress routine: "What you reading for?"

In summary, Formula One is sweet, Two and a Half Men is garbage. TV is like books, pick the good stuff and develop a critical apparatus to explain it. I understand not paying for cable, but I don't understand not watching The Sopranos

"Deadwood" was fantastic, I've seen about eight episodes of that.

Dennis Potter, one of the greats, for certain.

"South Park" is the best satire I know of--those guys shy away from nothing and they always seem to know America's "hot button" topics and sensitive spots.

Best Canadian TV? Not much to choose from, I'm afraid, but about five years ago there was a wonderful little series called "Made in Canada"--the shenanigans at a small production company; the characters are funny, silly, endearing, stupid. Fans of "The Office" would enjoy this one...

Most of what's on TV simply isn't worth the brain cells lost, but I do have my shows.

"LOST"--Though most people have given up on it, I love the fact that I have no idea what's really going on.

"Kings"--A suprisingly good new show from NBC. If anything, watch it for Ian McShane, formerly on Deadwood.

Used to watch the original CSI, but then half the original cast left the show...

Public television's my savior. Masterpiece theatre and the Sunday aft. travel shows are wonderful for a quiet day at home.

I watch more TV than I should. Hey, I was raised by it, okay! We have a satellite dish and a dvr so I watch next to nothing live (a few old movies on commercial free Turner Classic Movies). I regularly watch the following:

The No 1 Ladies' Detective Agency (for now, we'll see)
This Week with George Stephanopolis
The McLaughlin Group
The Simpsons
Family Guy
King of the Hill
American Dad
Hardball with Cris Matthews
The Newshour with Jim Lehrer
Antiques Roadshow
House
Two and a Half Men
The Closer
Castle ( for now, we'll see)
Reno 911
The Daily Show with Jon Stewart
The Colbert Report
Law & Order
Law & Order: Criminal Intent
NCIS (now that Life on Mars is gone the best police procediural on TV)
Deadliest Catch
Monk
It's me or the Dog
Ghost Hunters
Bones (with a leading character with severe Asperger's, very interesting)
My Name is Earl
The Office
30 Rock
Parks and Recreation (for now, we'll see)
Southland (for now, we'll see)
Important Things with Dimitri Martin
Numbers
Friday Night Lights
Real Time with Bill Maher
Beginning tonight Primeval (for now, we'll see)
Dollhouse
Entourage

Only a hand full are "must see". Not all of these are on during the same part of the year. Some start in the fall others in the summer.

i've enjoyed BALLYKISSANGEL ON PBS.
BROOKS & SHIELDS SEGMENT ON THE 6 O'CLOCK news on PBS.
any time the Lakers are on tv; i coached L. Walton at Univ. San Diego H.S. i don't watch much bball otherwise.

My wife and two teen sons rave about an Aussie show they watch on-line (YouTube excerpts?) called "Summer Heights High".

In the past two weeks I've often heard them crowing with laughter as they huddle around Sherron's laptop.

Anybody else know the show?

Oh yes. Haven't seen the whole series - the whole story arc - but what we've seen is brilliant.

"My father has a "Kill your TV" bumper sticker and only owns a DVD player and a screen, so that he and his wife can watch NetFlix."

This is me, minus the wife and the bumper sticker. I only watch movies and do not even have 'rabbit ears'.

I should also note that I do not have a cell phone and do not belong to either myspace or facebook. Lines must be drawn in these times of strife.

God I wish I wasn't on facebook. It's such a waste of time. Unfortunately, I'm borderline-phobic about the telephone, so if I got rid of facebook, I would fall out of touch with literally most of the people I know.

I know what you mean about phone-phobic: I detest the device. Telephone solicitation is a bane of the 21st century. I HATE small talk, catching up talk...and nine times out of ten when the phone rings, I'm right in the middle of a writing project.

Some arse asking for the road to Porlock, no doubt.

25 and 26: Yes! I am on facebook only because of friends who other than that I would never hear from. Every other day I think about just bagging it.

24: You are a kindred spirit indeed.

I am on Facebook, purely because I wanted to get in touch with an old friend and found him there.

Consequently, when you visit my page, it says "David has one friend".

Now that just sounds sad, doesn't it?

I watch TV purely for pleasure mostly. It doesn't even have to be good, it just has to entertain me. Gene, you make me feel better about my list of shows :) Feel free to mock my list;
The Hills
Gossip Girl
90210
House
Greys Anatomy
How I met your Mother
Entourage
The Tudors
Skins
Smallville
Big Love
Merlin
Robin Hood
and a ton of others I'm forgetting

it's great fun to keep up w/ our nieces and nephews who don't seem to mind us following them on facebook. And i keep up w/ my Canadian cousins via facebook. And i play boggle and wordscraper (not esp. well)

>26 Sutpen: and 28:

The reason you give for being on Facebook is the same reason given by everyone who is on Facebook (along with a caveat about wanting to leave it soon, an alleged desire that is never acted upon). As Facebook has only existed for only a short period of time compared to long distance friendship, I do not understand your 'reason' at all.

Why has humanity so quickly turned its back on the written letter? If someone is unwilling to write or call me (much less visit) every once in a while, I'm not sure why I would bother to carry on a superficial internet relationship with them at the expense of time I give to those around me.

Back to TV for a sec:
Gawd, not even one other vote for Mad Men? What is wrong with you people? All right, maybe this will pique: In one episode, the main characters get a letter on which their address is clearly (and deliberately, natch) visible: They live on Bullet Park Road. Is that enough snob cred?

No, knowledge about television is the opposite of snob cred.

#32: Facebook is another tool for keeping in touch, like letters, telephones, e-mail, etc. Having moved from Texas to Minnesota to New York, I am 1000+ miles from most of my friends and family. It is a blessing to be able to have a convenient place to keep up a daily/weekly banter with them, to see the little details of their daily lives, to be able to keep up with who's getting married or having children or moving across the country. The relationship is only as superficial as you want it to be. I have folks with whom I exchange long messages almost every day. That's not any different from writing letters/e-mails or making phone calls.

It is different in that the medium of communication (in this case Facebook) plays such a large role in structuring and defining what is communicated. This happens with email and telephone and letters too. The form of communication is the same with all of them (language), but I think each method of communicating is very different. Facebook is considerably more determinate than a piece of paper and envelope (not to mention covered in advertisements)..

I think Facebook and the like are having an absolutely horrible effect on humanity's ability to communicate as they become the dominant method of communicating. I have a 'front lines' understanding of this, working with around the public computers at a public library. Every day I feel like I'm watching the descent...

Technology is not neutral!

I have a hard time imagining something that could be shared in a letter that couldn't be shared in a Facebook message (drawings, photos, perhaps?--but there's always linking to photo sharing sites for that--hm--locks of hair?). But as I don't really have the inclination to argue further, I would just like to suggest that you make sure your gates are fully secured, and keep a watchful eye out for those barbarians. ;)

Oh, and for folks bothered by ads on Facebook and elsewhere, I recommend a combination of Firefox and Adblock Plus.

I think I know what you mean at #36, it's the brevity and inanity of the updates and comments that people make usually on FB and similar sites. When you used to write letters on paper I think there was more "there" there.

Then again, if you read Jane Austen, a lot of people who used to write letters then just filled them up with silly inanities even then. (Like Lady Bertram in Mansfield Park).
Apropos of that thought:
http://www.much-ado.net/austenbook/

Well, I am going to put in a plug for Saving Grace on TNT on Monday nights. I think it is truly original and non formulaic. The only other tv shows I would say that about are not on any more - Homocide and I'll Fly Away. I don't think there is anything inherently wrong with tv, just that it is hard not to get sucked into it. I know someone who says the frequency was specifically chosen to match out brain waves so we'd get sucked in.

About facebook as opposed to letter writing, I think it is the lack of space that makes the difference. When you write letters, there will be a pause for the mail, for the other person to answer, for the mail again. It is hard to commit to something of more depth when the response can come in a few minutes, and then what, you have to do it again.

39: I think that's true. When the pace speeds up the depth goes down.

37: What bothers me about the ads is how creepily they're tailored to your age/gender/marital status. Being single and 40 I always see ads telling me about dieting services and dating services for women over 40, which is annoying.

I don't think any of these could be considered snobby because they are too popular, but here are a few shows I do make time for:

"The Daily Show" and "The Colbert Report"
"The Soup" (did I see someone mention the Hills? One of Joel McHale's favorite targets.)
"What Not to Wear", "Sell This House", etc - I love a good makeover, but, truthfully, I'd be happy with just the before and after shots. A recent foray into wallpaper stripping makes me a little annoyed at the tv shows that make it sound so simple. My own naivete, I know.
"Crossing Jordan" is the only thing I tivo for myself.
Lastly, an inexplicable attraction for the "Law and Order" channel (you know, 24-7) that will have to suffice for the law school I probably will never get to attend.

33 I've seen the first three episodes of Mad Men, but it fell to the wayside for a bit. I wasn't overly in love with it, but I'll give it another go.

Anna, omg P&P on facebook is pricless, thanks for sharing.

#40: Right, I remember before I installed Adblocker I'd see things on MySpace like "FREE MONEY FOR 26-YEAR-OLDS!!!" Oh, if only. :)

41: I cancelled cable because it was too expensive and my son spent too much time watching it. The only thing I REALLY miss is Colbert/Stewart. They are national treasures. I still watch them once in a while on the computer.

42: I was sure you'd like that. :)

41: Yep, that was me, guilty pleasure. I never give up on a tv show once I've started it, and I watched Laguna Beach back in high school. It's my not-so-hidden shame :)

I do have a television, but it's only turned on three times per year for State of Origin.

The Wire is easily a great snob namedrop. Doesn't hurt that it's excellent.

I really enjoyed The Shield while I was watching it. Friday Night Lights is an excellently acted and written show about - gasp! - Texas high school football. 30 Rock and The Office are both very funny and pretty genius. House is incredibly formulaic but Hugh Laurie is almost always a revelation in that role.

...however, I can't really excuse myself for watching 24 or Chuck.

Facebook is the new Myspace is the new chatrooms is the new Internets is the new computer technology is the new rock music is the new jazz music is the new scary cultural item the previous generation doesn't understand / demonize / scapegoat. That said, Facebook is eating my brain. It's nice to reconnect with old friends, but there are a trillion timewasters and distractions on that site. I imagine Facebook and the Christian Right are two major reasons why we haven't reached the Singularity yet ... that and the utter uselessness of said Singularity, unless it can make me reach and the world peaceful, rather than make sci fi geeks sound occasionally prescient.

If the Singularity comes and all the fanboys disappear into boxes so they can live in a virtual "Star Wars" environment forever and ever, I, for one, will dance with joy.

Then we can pull a prank reminiscent of Infinite Jest ;) "Hey kids, you ever see the movie Scanners?" Not that there's much difference from a Star Wars fan and someone in a vegetative coma.