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The Trellis and the Vine

by Colin Marshall, Tony Payne (Author)

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1,755158,069 (4.27)1
The ministry mind-shift that changes everything. "This is the best book I've read on the nature of church ministry", says Mark Dever. "The Trellis and the Vine is a dangerous book to read. It demolishes precious and much-loved idols..." says Ben Pfahlert.
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Showing 1-5 of 15 (next | show all)
LT The Trellis and the Vine, Colin Marshall (Ministry Training Strategy, Vinegrowers) and Tony Payne (Matthias Media), St. Mathias Press, 2009, 7/8-15/18
Recommended by Josh Pegram

Theme: all should be nurturing disciples
Type: inspirational teaching
Value:1-
Age: mature
Interest: 1- (if interested)
Objectionable: maybe increase emphasis on glorifying God and enjoying Him
Synopsis/Noteworthy:

Purpose of ministry (8, 14, 35-growth, 39, 41/43, 83-advancing kingdom, 85-sum, 116, 120, 147, 151, 153-4, 178, 181): preach the Gospel/Word in power of Spirit to see lives changed (8)
--are we making and nurturing genuine disciple of Christ?! 14
--we are utterly Spirit-grace dependent 36, 39, 176
--minister this to all, not just ones with problems 22, 111, 183
--all are called to this 138
Beware trap of too much virtue going into erecting and maintaining structure 17, 90, 152; love messiness 183
Start with your people and develop structures through which they can grow 18, 20
Concentrate on training (as a pastor and a church) 19, 69-72 what it is, 74, 75 like parenting, 78 goals, 86
Disciples are disciple-makers 43, 124, 154
Speak the word to each other 45, 49, 52, 53, 54 examples, 57 Bible reading
Results in standing together 66-67
Growing 82
Problem of collapsing into trellis work 90, 152
Three pastoring models 94ff, 99, 102-103 104ff-Baxter (107)
Removing weirdness 96
Involve people 97
Willow Creek 98
Small groups 100, 178
Next generation 127ff, 134
Tent-making 135, Ricky/Joshua 140
Apprenticeship 143ff
LCA 148-150, 182
Discontinuing programs 156
Bottom line effectiveness 170
Why low commitment 174ff
Youth minister—don’t have (possibly) 173
Leadership is vision 176 (inspiring)
Let (want) people to have their own styles 195 (193-196)

Critique (great): emphasize delighting in God and Christlikeness as ends (a little more) (along with making disciples) cf. 165

K 112ff co-workers/Paul, 120-greatest calling, 126-chaos, 155, 158-161/176-178-inspire, 170-172
  keithhamblen | Jul 16, 2018 |
Are you a pastor, lay leader, or a Christian with some degree of influence over others? Feel like there’s too many people for you to meet with, personally? Then this is the book for you.

Read it. Take notes. And adjust your schedule so that you can implement a more biblical model of training. Better yet, grab a small group of a few others and read it with them. ( )
  Pastor_Doug | Mar 30, 2018 |
Excellent book on ministry in the church. Authors challenge a complete mind-shift in the way we "do" church. Instead of programs and busyness, the authors turn our focus on what our primary mission should be: discipleship. By training disciple-making disciples, churches will experience true growth, even if that growth is not in the way we usually think. Gospel growth is much more important than numerical growth. True gospel growth is often best fulfilled when disciples take the gospel outside their local church. Must-read for pastors and church leaders. ( )
  broreb | Mar 25, 2017 |
Far too many churches get it all wrong. Their existence stems from an full calendar of social events and purposeless groups that do little to embody Christ's mandate to make disciples of all nations. They are busy, just with the wrong things.

In The Trellis and the Vine, Colin Marshall and Tony Payne put forth a model of ministry that is absolutely obsessed with the disciple-making process. Their thoughts waft like a breath of fresh air over the stale ecclesiological landscape. They constantly remind the reader that ministry is not about programs; it's about people.

A commitment to disciple others will require relationships. "The relational nature of training means that the best training will often occur by osmosis rather than formal instruction" (76). Furthermore, this commitment will require church leaders to focus on multiplication of their efforts through others. "By far the best way to build a congregation full of disciple-making disciples is to assemble and train a band of co-workers to labour alongside you" (116).

While I whole-heartedly agree with almost everything Marshall and Payne say, I wish they had said more about the "people worth watching." People worth watching are individuals that pastors observe, test, and recruit into vocational ministry. These individuals are affirmed through an external call from the church. My issue stems from the fact that Marshall and Payne seem to deny a sense of internal call of the Lord upon the individual. They write, "We shouldn't sit back and wait for people to 'fell called' to gospel work, any more than we should sit back and wait for people to become disciples of Christ in the first place. We should be proactive in seeking, challenging, and testing suitable people to be set apart for gospel work" (134). They conclude, "If these people are also godly servants of Christ who long for his kingdom, then why not headhunt them for a life of 'recognized gospel ministry'?" (140). This line of thinking is certainly controversial and needs more explanation.

Despite the issue over the internal call, The Trellis and the Vine is an amazing book that pastors, church leaders, and astute laymen need to read and digest. It can be a game-changer for churches who have lost the vision to build disciple-making disciples! ( )
  RobSumrall | Feb 15, 2017 |
"The ministry mind-shift that changes everything. Mark Dever says "This is the best book I've read on the nature of church ministry. Al Mohler says "Its wisdom is invaluable. My advise: keep a good stack on hand at all times, and put this book to good use."

I found this work be Marshall and Payne very practicle. Looking forward to mini conference with these two on Nov 1st. " ( )
  david__clifford | Feb 3, 2016 |
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Colin Marshallprimary authorall editionscalculated
Payne, TonyAuthormain authorall editionsconfirmed
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The ministry mind-shift that changes everything. "This is the best book I've read on the nature of church ministry", says Mark Dever. "The Trellis and the Vine is a dangerous book to read. It demolishes precious and much-loved idols..." says Ben Pfahlert.

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