lkernagh's 2015 Herb Garden Project

Hi everyone! My name is Lori and I usually spend my LT time over on the 75 and Category Challenge Groups. Last year I decided to have a container herb garden on my urban balcony. All of the plants were purchased as ready to use so I just had to learn how to maintain them over the summer and fall. This year, I have decided to try and grow my container herb garden from seed - a challenge for a brown thumb like me! - because there are only limited herbs that I am able to purchase that have already germinated and reached foliage stage by a commercial green house/gardening store for resale purposes. That, and I want to see if I can do this!

I plan on posting updates on a weekly basis, and because I have been busy with RL commitments of late, I will be starting my thread off with updates from the first three weeks of my experimental Herb Garden Project. Suggestions and advice about what I might be doing wrong - seriously, I will do things wrong! - or how I can try and save a wilting plant, will be welcomed with open arms and an appreciative heart.

I also am looking forward to discovering what everyone else if up to in the group!

Herb Garden Project - Week 1 Update - I never did get around to posting my Day 1 pic of my herb garden, so here is the picture of the Spinach, Parsley, Basil, Chives, Dill, Tarragon I am attempting to grow. I decided to grow them in individual pots and cover them with saran wrap to create separate germination chambers for each plant type. :



Seven Days Later: The only plants so far showing strong signs of germination - as you can see by the pictures below taken earlier today - are Basil, Chives and Spinach.



Dill is showing some signs of life, as is Tarragon (if you look really closely at the middle picture below you will see two tiny whisps of greenery peaking up) but Parsley so far is a no show - seriously, it is like looking at Mars, without Mark Watney's (The Martian) traces of life.



I think I planted the seeds too deep - this is an experiment after all - and something I will keep in mind for the next batch of herbs. I have been using these 10 seed starting tips to get the garden going. given what has already popped up in a short 7 days, I am pretty excited about the next 7 days!

Herb Garden Project - Week 2 Update
After two weeks, some of the herbs are thriving and others are.... not. Of course, it doesn't help that I have just realized I have forgotten some key factors: I haven't fed them (they are supposed to receive some plant food on a weekly basis once they sprout), I forgot to place them by the big window for the necessary sunlight (photosynthesis 101) AND I haven't been rotating the pots so that the plants will grow up straight and strong..... I was wondering why some of them were tilting. ;-)

Here are pictures taken yesterday to show progress after two weeks:



The main thriver is Chives - not surprising considering even I know those things can thrive in almost any conditions - and my big surprise this week is Parsley - who was a complete 'no show' this time last week. Basil is growing at a slow but steady rate. Now that I have feed them and placed them where they can have direct access to sunlight, I am hoping these will continue to thrive.



My stragglers are Spinach, Dill and Tarragon, which seem to be more or less in the same growth stage as they were this time last week. Actually, tarragon has regressed.... the single shoot that was showing last week is gone.

I planted second pots of Basil, Dill and Spinach yesterday, adjusting my planting methods slightly as I forgot to tamp down the soil with the first batch of herbs to ensure that they had direct contact with the moist soil. That, and I paid more attention to the seeds and their placement. At the rate that Chives is growing, I will probably be able to move the plant to the outside plant stand next weekend. I will then probably attempt a new batch of Tarragon and plant some of the other herbs I have purchased.

Herb Garden Project - Week 3 Update

I think I have mentioned more than once that as much as my goal is to grow a wonderful container herb garden, this is very much an experiment for the brown thumb that I have when it comes to gardening. Week 3 into the project and my brown thumb reared its ugly head. I managed to kill almost all of the plants by: 1) over watering, and 2) with probably overfeeding them with a biofish plant food I had in the house. Now, to give my other half credit, he had suggested that I don't use the biofish plant food and that I get rid of it. Looks like he was right and I was wrong. Biofish plant food now ditched and a new batch of herbs - in fresh soil and sterilized containers - has been planted.

Now I mentioned that almost all of the plants were dead (or in such a sorry state they might as well have been dead), so you are probably wondering what survived my brown thumb? Surprisingly, not the Chives, which blew my mind considered Chives grow like a weed on their own. I seem to be very skilled at killing plants. The plant that survived - and in fact seems to be thriving - is Dill. Yes, you read right.... DILL! Who knew?! Below is a picture of the original Dill plant (on the left) and the second batch of Dill I planted last week:



Of course, I am still a little concerned that this plant is going to survive.... it seems so lanky and wispy. Time will tell.

Last week I also planted new batches of Spinach and Basil. The Spinach (picture on the left) has taken off like no tomorrow in just a short 7 days and Basil (picture on the right) is peeking its tender little shoots up.



At least this time the poor things didn't have to fight their way through a slug of soil as thick and wet as mud - I am getting better at prepping the soil for planting - and will use the 'water from the bottom' method to water the plants when they need water, so that the roots will grow downwards.

New batch of herbs planted are: second batches of Chives, Tarragon and Parsley and new batches of Peppermint, Lemon Balm and Marjoram.

Tune in next week folks for another exciting installment in "Herb Gardening with Lori". ;-)

Oh yay, glad to see you here!

BTW Parsley is always very slow to germinate. 'It goes nine times to the devil and back before sprouting.'

>5 qebo: - ;-)

>6 MarthaJeanne: - Good to know and I love that quote!

Hey! Great idea, glad you are posting @lkernagh.

Your thread is starred, and I'm going to follow it. :)

Having a brown thumb is just due to inexperience. And even once you're "experienced", you'll kill plants. Trust me. ;)

What kind of containers will you transplant them to?

Suggestion: you might want to thin out your Dill. Using scissors is better than trying to pull them out of the pot, as that can disturb the baby roots.

>8 fuzzi: - What kind of containers will you transplant them to?

That is a really good question. I plan to keep all of the plants in their own pots, because I don't know enough about which plants will 'play nicely together'. I like the system I have now where the starter pots sit on top of rocks in a larger plastic tray to ensure the plants don't sit in water, except when watering them.

Good to know about the Dill. I will give it a go. Thanks!

Herb Garden Project - Week 4 Update

Having spent the past week recovering from what I will call a head cold, I neglected my plants, beyond ensuring that the plants that had already sprouted were placed in front of the window every morning to catch the direct morning sun and the indirect afternoon sun and giving them a watering mid-week from the bottom. The Dill continues to thrive - and still needs to be thinned out as per the great advice provided by fuzzi! - but I am completely crushed to report that the basil - at week 2 (my second attempt) has what I can only guess is mold:



Darn it all.... and they only received the one watering mid-week. I am guessing that they received too much water because they haven't been exposed to anything else to cause this to happen. I am starting to see just how delicate the water balance is with these young herbs. The Dill is still doing fine- and it received the same amount of water as the Basil - so it is a good thing that I bought a Basil plant at the grocery store last week to help keep us in fresh Basil while I continue to try and grow my own from seed... which brings me to my re-potting sub-project: the Basil plant I purchased seemed cramped in it 3" pot so this weekend I re-potted it in a clean 5" pot with added fresh soil:



Yes, the poor store bought Basil plant has a bit of the droopsies but right now I am just glad to have a live plant that I can rely on for my fresh Basil. ;-)

The new batch of Chives are doing really well - as you can see by the picture below - and I am happy to report that the second batch of Tarragon (and the first batch of Marjoram) have already sprouted mini shoots after only 7 days. They are too tiny for pictures this week.



My "one step forward, two steps back" approach to herb gardening still continues to keep my interest and I am looking forward to hopefully moving the Chives to the outdoor plant stand in the next week or two, now that we have consistently warmer temps with evenings only dropping down to 6'C.

You're doing fine!

The mold happens to everyone at some time...either discard or sterilize the dirt that got mold...but I recommend the former, as baking soil in the oven stinks!

Some people use a sterile starting soil, to avoid mold, called Vermiculite.

Shop bought herbs tend to be much too thickly sown. I've had good luck taking all the plants out and dividing up into clumps of 1-3 plants and planting them a few inches apart. Yes, they look sad for a few days, and some of them don't make it, but most of them revive after those first few days, and you get a large area of basil, parsley, coriander ... generally all the annuals and biennials. I even bought Bay once that was about a dozen plants cramped together into a very small pot. I replanted into a much larger pot, and keep picking from the smaller ones around the edge, but still haven't managed to kill the little ones off yet.

Do try to buy a few French Tarragon plants. Seeds are the Russian Tarragon, and the French has a much better flavour. French Tarragon has to be propagated by cuttings or divisions, so it is more expensive and harder to find, but really worth searching for. Tarragon is hardy here, so you should only have to do it once. Indeed after a few years one plant is probably enough.

It's so fun to "watch" all the seedlings grow!

>11 fuzzi: Heh. "Mold happens." I think there should be a gardening apron with that stencilled on it.

>12 MarthaJeanne: What's the difference in flavor? Is it really that noticeable?

>13 lesmel: Yes. If you taste a leaf and don't get why this is hyped so much, you've got 'Russian' plain old grown from seed tarragon. If your mouth is full of flavour with anis undertones and you think, 'Wow!' then you have the 'French'. And just like most varieties of apples or oranges, it wouldn't breed true if grown from seed, beside the fact that it almost never sets seed.

So taste before you buy.

>11 fuzzi: - Thanks and good to know! I have ditched the molding Basil plant (and the soil) and will think about tackling another batch of Basil in a couple of weeks.

>12 MarthaJeanne: - Excellent advice about the shop bought herbs. I thought it looked rather crammed into that tiny pot! I will keep my eye out for French Tarragon plants.

>13 lesmel: - I know.... I get a huge kick of happiness every time a pot of soil starts to shoots green sprouts!

Herb Garden Project - Week 5 Update

It has been warm enough this past week and a couple of the plants have progressed enough that I have taken the plunge and moved the following second batch of herbs to the outdoor plant stand during the days:
Chives, Dill and Parsley



I continue to coddle/pamper what appear to be more delicate herbs:
Marjoram, Tarragon (which one can barely see) and Lemon Balm



I will hold off on planting any new plants while I see how these ones progress over the next couple of weeks.

Note that, if the Dill ever decides it's truly happy, you're looking at a 3-4 _foot_-tall plant with spreading ferny leaves and platter flowers. The stem gets up to an inch thick. It will want a large pot - 12" or so across the top, and probably a foot deep (2-5 gallon)! My mom grows hers in her Earthbox - a 3'x18", sub-irrigated pot (it has a reservoir at the bottom that you fill from a tube in a corner, so it does bottom-watering like your setup). She grew it _once_, from seed, and it's been self-seeding for 5 years now. I've never gotten one to really grow - even in dirt (as opposed to a pot), my best effort got to about 4 inches before dying - but it's something to consider with that plant!

The Dill plants that I was purchasing last year would all fade and die after about 6-8 weeks and I have read that it is difficult to keep Dill going so kudos to your mom! I have a bigger - as in wider - pot but it is the same height as the current pot so I will need to keep an eye out for some that are wider and deeper if the Dill takes off like that. Thanks!

I grow dill every year in raised beds (because it's a host for black swallowtail caterpillars), but I've never tried it in a pot.

I so wish I had some space for a proper garden. Balcony / pot gardening seems to be a bit of a challenge for certain things, but I am enjoying having fresh herbs and things growing on the balcony. ;-)

If I just remembered correctly, Dill does not like to be transplanted. It's best to direct sow it to the garden/pot.

>20 lkernagh: Do check out Earthboxes. They're pricey (about $30), but they provide the closest thing to a raised bed you can get in a pot. There are also literally thousands of "DIY Earthboxes" instructions - mostly using plastic totes, some using Homer buckets - but I've never seen one that was a) as big and deep as an Earthbox and b) was _cheaper_. Smaller ones can be quite cheap but I think it's the size that makes a difference (as well as the SIP reservoir).
I regularly grow 2-3 tomatoes in an Earthbox - admittedly, I prefer cherries and salad tomatoes, I haven't tried a beefsteak, but I grow indeterminate plants that just keep growing (they go up a net I have installed above the Earthbox, on the wall). My mom's grown as many as 4 dill plants in a box, along with chives and marigolds (we can't keep those from happening!). The pots really are amazing. And mine are...5 years old? 7? They do last.

>20 lkernagh: Square Foot Gardening has plans for container gardens, too.

>21 fuzzi: - That would explain why Dill is being such a problem child. ;-)

>22 jjmcgaffey: - Many thanks! Very useful information. I will keep an eye out for the Earthboxes. They must sell them where I live.

>23 fuzzi: - I saw a book at Russell's - a bookstore here in town - about square foot gardening. Not sure if it was the same book - the cover page was quite a bit different - but I was encouraged that container gardening in smaller planter pots does seem do-able.

Herb Garden Project - Week 6 Update

So, My hit and miss approach to container gardening continues, but I still feel pretty positive, even with the setbacks that have occurred. The second batch of Chives, Dill and Parsley continue to flourish outside:



The Marjoram and Lemon Balm are not doing so good, even though they have been spending a more pampered time of it indoors:



I have done something wrong.... just not sure what.

When I went grocery shopping yesterday, I noticed that the first batch of nursery grown herbs were available for purchase. I resisted yesterday but I have a weakness for fresh herbs so I went back today and came home with the following plants:
English Thyme, Parsley, Cilantro



Spearmint, Spanish Tarragon, Italian Oregano



I know French Tarragon was mentioned as preferred, and I do still have an eye out for any French Tarragon that may show up, but at $2.50 per plant, I could not turn up these beauties. They need to be re-potted in larger pots but I won't be able to get around to doing that for at least another week, so they are aclimatizing to the balcony for this week.

>24 lkernagh: Actually, I'm not sure I've ever seen them for sale...not true, I've seen them at Harvest Festivals. Just not in any stores. I got my first one through a direct mailing (to my mom, actually - we got 3 (because it's cheaper if you do) and split them), and then another one through their website (again, split with Mom). earthbox.com, nice and simple.

There are at least two editions of Square Foot Gardening - I have both, though I haven't yet read the new one. I don't remember anything specifically about container gardening, though SFG is certainly applicable - it's all about concentration of plants and really using your space. So pots should work fine (though a square foot is a pretty large pot!).

You might want to look at The bountiful container. I find it very useful.

>27 MarthaJeanne: I love that book!

>25 lkernagh: whatever you do, do NOT put the mint in the ground, but keep it in a pot. It is horribly invasive. If you plant it, generations to come will curse you... ;)

My thyme came back, as did my marjoram/oregano, yippee! I pruned the rosemary severely, so we'll see what happens.

My edition of Square Foot Gardening (the old one) has plans for raised beds and containers, towards the back. I specifically recall a container plan for someone who is confined to a wheelchair.

>24 lkernagh: etc. Yeah, as others have noted, there are two editions: Square Foot Gardening and All New Square Foot Gardening. I have both. IMO, the older edition is more informative and less glitzy.

>26 jjmcgaffey:, >27 MarthaJeanne:, >28 lesmel:, >29 fuzzi: and >30 qebo: - Thanks everyone!

>29 fuzzi: - I am very impressed that your thyme, marjoram and oregano came back! I actually managed to kill my rosemary plant, which is a testament to my brown "not green" thumb. ;-)

I will keep all of the herbs in separate containers so no worries on the mint taking over! After being away last week my herb garden update is two weeks overdue.

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Herb Garden Project - Week 7/8 Update

Kind of a good news/bad news story. I was away for a week visiting family and, of course, a bit of a cold snap came through. No below freezing temps but still, I have a good indication of hardy plants compared to the more fragile variety.

On the good news front, the second batch of Chives, Dill and Parsley continue to flourish outside:



The Basil did not fair as well - it was not a happy plant! - so I have harvested the leaves and disposed of the plant and soil. Marjoram and Lemon Balm also regressed during my week away so those plants have also been disposed of. *sighs* Overall, I am still happy that I have been able to grow Chives, Dill and Parsley from seed as a first second attempt.

Resorting to expanding my nursery grown herbs, I picked up a Fernleaf Dill and Rosemary for my burgeoning mini-herb garden:



Here is a picture of the current plants on my balcony:



Obviously, I will need to get in some larger planter pots, especially for the store bought Cilantro, Parsley, Mint and Oregano plants. I am a little leery about transplanting them into larger pots if they are plants that do not like to be moved from pot to pot, but I am enjoying being able to cook and bake with the fresh herbs.

>31 lkernagh: What a sweet garden! Sorry for the plant deaths, but on the plus side it is useful information.

Thanks Katherine! I agree, plants deaths are always useful for determining how to try and do things differently. ;-)

Cilantro is picky about its roots, parsley's ok if you keep it nicely watered after transplant. Mint and oregano (in my experience) truly don't care - if they've got dirt, they're happy. Both of them make long runner-roots, at varying depths; I've grown new mint by digging out a plant and putting it elsewhere, and forgetting to clean out the original pot and sift out the roots! That's why they're dangerous in a garden. Oregano is less enthusiastic than mint, but still happy to spread - and breaking off a long tendril with some root and burying it is likely to get you an entire new plant.

I find it's easier to plant cilantro seeds (coriander) and get new plants. Cilantro also doesn't last long - it bolts pretty quickly - so I usually don't bother to buy it because the plant is half over by the time I get it. I just got some "slow-bolt" cilantro, which may change things, but right now if I want to move cilantro I spread some coriander where I want it to be and pretty soon it's there.

>32 qebo: I was going to say the same thing..."what a sweet garden!"

I had a balcony garden ONCE. I bought some sunflowers -- that the garden center people PROMISED would do fine in their pots for a week -- some Mexican Heather and hmm, something else I loved at the time. I watered thoroughly and left for a week. When I got home, I had a corner of dead plants. Every. Single. Plant. Dead. That was the end of my attempt at balcony gardening. *sighs*

>31 lkernagh: love your setup!

>34 jjmcgaffey: - Thank you for your wonderful words of wisdom re: transplanting plants. The oregano and parsley definitely need to go into larger pots and it sounds like the mint would love the extra room a larger pot would give it. I did not know that cilantro bolts. That simplifies matters.... I will probably use what I have and invest time and effort into trying to grow more cilantro as opposed to transplanting the current plant.

>35 lesmel: - Thanks and sorry to learn that your balcony garden didn't survive while you were away. My dental hygienist had a similar incident with her herb garden - something about an unseasonably hot and dry 5 day period when she was away on a trip - has made me appreciate that a herb garden might need some TLC. My brother and sister-in-law have the perfect second balcony directly off of their kitchen but that have decided that they travel too much to maintain a herb garden. Sounds like a smart decision on their part.

>36 fuzzi: - Thanks!

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I came home this evening with a new Basil plant. The grocery store near work had nursery grown herb plants on sale for $1.99 each and since my last Basil plant did not survive my trip away, I bought a new plant for the balcony herb garden:



Isn't he a cute little plantie? ;-)

My other half then surprised me with the following auction purchase:



Now I not only have a great place to store my various herb garden supplies, but the top shelf will be perfect for the larger planter pots. Soooo exciting! Of course, he in invested in the whole herb garden as he is enjoying having fresh herbs in his meals every evening.

Ooh, nice shelf! That will work wonderfully.

Yeah - I just came back from my garden, and I did successfully transplant three parsley plants. They grew in the path instead of the bed (a whole clump) and I'd tried to replant some of them before but they failed. These I poured in a ton of water before I planted them - planted them in slurry, basically. Watered them on my usual irregular basis. They were looking pretty limp the last time I went, more than a week ago - but this time, although all the leaves/branches they'd had before are lying dead on the ground, all three plants have clusters of new dark-green leaves coming up from their middles! Yay, it worked! So I harvested the rest of the clump. And also oregano, and NZ spinach. Now I have to take the leaves off the stems and deal with them...I'm nearly done with the oregano, I think the rest will wait until tomorrow (it's past midnight now).

>37 lkernagh: Yep, he is a cutie. And nice shelf!

>37 lkernagh: love that shelf!

If it's not stained, you might want to put a protective coat of stain or paint on it, to keep it from getting damaged by water.

Thanks >38 jjmcgaffey:, >39 2wonderY: and >40 fuzzi:! The shelving unit does have a protective stain on it in a nice warm honey color so I won't have to prep it before I start using it.

>38 jjmcgaffey: - Great job on transplanting the parsley plants! I have tomorrow off so I hope to go to the garden center to pick up some larger planter pots and spend the afternoon transplanting the larger herb plants that seem to be outgrowing their current pots.

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What a great weekend this has been. Perfect for the annual newspaper-sponsored book sale in town. I went to the sale yesterday looking for vegetarian cookbooks and books on herb gardening and came home with the following herb gardening books:


Herb Garden (American Horticultural Society Practical Guides) by Richard Rosenfeld
Little Herb Gardens by Georgeanne Brennan
The Ultimate Herb Book: The Definitive Guide to Growing and Using Over 200 Herbs by Antony Atha


Herbal Celebrations Cookbook by Noel Richardson and Jenny Cameron - a great crossover book about herbs with recipes

Plans for this afternoon involve sitting on the balcony reading the gardening books for further hints and tips.

I think you might like this one, too: http://www.librarything.com/work/44867/book/81339158

>42 fuzzi: Anything from Rodale's is always good. I think I have that book (although it doesn't show on LT)...

Yep, it's right next to my wonderful collection of The Encyclopedia of Country Living of which I have three different editions (and which LT considers duplicates, of course).

Thank >42 fuzzi: and >43 Lyndatrue:! I have made a note of the book title and will keep an eye out for a copy.

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I had the day off from work today so I went out and purchased some slightly larger pots for some of the 'growing like a weed' herbs such as the Oregano, Thyme, Mint and Parsley plants. I spend the afternoon puttering around and re-potted the plants mentioned above. I know.... going from a 4" square pot to a 6" round pot does not seem like much of a difference - especially as I see how well the plants seem to fit into their new pots - but I am sure any size is an improvement and I don't want the plant to not take to the transplant. At least this time the bottoms of the planter pots have rocks to aid in drainage, which the original pots did not have. They seem pretty darn happy:



Worst case, I can think about transplanting them into larger pots in about 6-8 weeks and then use the smaller 6' pots forf some of the smaller plants.

Nice pots, and drainage is SO important!

Thanks! I followed the advice from the Little Herb Gardens regarding adding rocks in the bottom for drainage.... I did not know that roots that sit in water can suffocate/drown when they do not have access to oxygen.

Most plants will rot if left in standing water. Last year I planted irises around my pond, as I had read they do like "wet feet", but the tubers rotted. I found out that it's Siberian iris that love having wet roots, so I bought some and planted them by the pond. They are getting nice green leaves.

>47 fuzzi: Here are some additional hints for the Bearded Iris, sometimes called the German Iris, and the Latin name is Germanicum.

First, as my mother would have said, they like their bellies to see the sun. Never plant the tubers too deep. Having some of the tuber show above ground is fine.

Second, they grow from the center out. When it's time to divide, dig up the whole plant (which by now has formed multiple branches), and break them up, keeping the outside tubers (you'll want to give some away by then), and replanting them. Cut the leaves back to around two or three inches, at most, before planting anew.

Third, remember this is a plant that fixes nitrogen. Give it some nice bone meal, especially when it blooms in the spring, and in the fall. Don't give it regular fertilizer. It's wasteful, and encourages weeds to grow as well.

Fourth, these are an excellent plant for the part garden where it's difficult to get water to, since they're very drought tolerant. Sometimes absent minded people forget to water them in the early spring, and they perk right up after that person rushes out and douses them with the garden hose.

I always recommend the Iris as a good starting plant for the novice gardener, because they're so easy. Remember, the only reason we don't call them a weed is because they're so beautiful. They spread like crazy, and the root system is a sight to behold. They're okay in pots if you're careful to watch them, and divide every two or three years. Iris that I forgot for three years had literally displaced nearly all the soil in a pot, and were nothing but a mass of spidery Iris roots.

Okay, enough fun; it's spring, and there's more work than hours in the day.

>48 Lyndatrue:
"this is a plant that fixes nitrogen"

I didn't know that! How interesting.

I have seen them take over sections of yards. People use them around here to populate roadbanks that would be a nuisance to mow. My daughter found them breaking through the asphalt of her driveway. No, they weren't invading, they had been covered with hot tar and sat dormant for a couple of years and then decided to grow again.

I can buy the same stuff they use in diapers these days for the garden, and dig a little into the earth for each pot.

1 That stuff holds a lot of water and gives it out slowly so you have a little more time before watering gets desperate.

2 When you do water it after a dry spell it expands in the process breaking up hard-packed soil.

I find that dry plants need a little at a time over and over again to absorb the full amount they need, and a last watering to top up just before leaving also does not come amiss. Most of the pots I use have extra space for water under the soil, but it is also important that they have good drainage above that water in case of rain. The better pots have that built in. The cheap ones I attacked with a drill.

>48 Lyndatrue: I love Iris, but they don't like the clay in my garden. Last time I dug them up there was a lot of rot on the roots. I had to be very careful when dividing to get rid of all questionable bits. That must be two years ago, and the pieces I replanted have not really recovered yet. I hope they are still in bloom when I get home as I want to put a new one in where one really died, but I need to see the colours first.

>50 MarthaJeanne: the best thing for clay is adding humus, as in compost, peat, ground up leaves, grass clippings, straw, etc.

I'm currently using small leaves as mulch all over my gardens (with corrugated cardboard underneath in especially weedy areas). As the humus element rots, the earthworms invade, as do the other small critters that like to eat dead plants. As they tunnel, eat, and poop, the soil becomes lighter, and richer, as they also help aerate it. :)

>48 Lyndatrue: lots of information, thanks!

My big Bearded iris are happy on a slope with an eastern exposure, shaded in the hottest part of the day by a Live Oak tree. They're close to the rainwater runoff ditch, so the soil tends to stay just a little damp.

The Siberian iris are planted in gravel, on the side of my pond. The water level is generally just covering the gravel, or slightly below, so the iris roots stay wet, but the base of the plant is open to the air and sun.

>49 2wonderY: nice bit about them breaking through the asphalt. No matter how big and important we humans think we are, the plants and bugs tend to show us we're not that big... :D

You guys are the best! I love all the great information.

>47 fuzzi: - Bearded Iris sounds familiar... My mom has/had some growing in her back garden and they were/are beautiful! I hope she still has them but as you have pointed out, they are not growing near a water supply.

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Question for the group:

I have what is labeled as a Dwarf Margoram plant that I purchased almost a month ago as a nursery grown plant. The plant is doing well and looks like this, as of this evening:



... but what I find somewhat baffling is the following description on the plant tag:

Plant forms a tidy, low growing mound and adapts well to container growing.

... so, my question is, am I supposed to be pruning the plant, since it seems to be growing as a tall, gangly plant and not the "low growing mound" it is billed as being? I am okay with the upward mobility of the plant but I find the description to be a bit confusing...

It may just be in too small a pot. But my oregano (closely related to marjoram) makes a mound primarily, but when it decides to flower it first grows stalks straight up. I generally give it a haircut - shear it off down to the mound - because I really don't want it spreading seeds around - it's big enough as it is! Um, actually, those two may be related - if it's potbound, many herbs will react by bolting (on the assumption, I would guess, that maybe some of their children will find a better (bigger) place to grow). You might try potting it up, cut the stalks back by about half, and see what happens.

If you see buds near the ends of the stalks, definitely shear it - once it flowers, I think, the flavor changes and it starts to die. Well, that's true of basil, maybe doesn't apply to marjoram. But flowering does change a lot of plants.

>53 lkernagh: Marjorams are perennials, so it won't die after flowering, just spread seeds around. From the picture it looks like it is inside, and not where it gets a lot of sun. That can make plants tall and spindly. I think I would cut it back by about half and give it a sunnier location. Also make sure you are not giving it too much water.

>51 fuzzi: Yes, I know, and I use many raised beds with a lot of added compost (free from the city, but I have to haul it) and elephant dung (from the zoo, fairly cheap), and the parts I have concentrated on are a lot better, so now I can try and improve other areas as well. We've been in the house 7 or8 years now. It takes time.

>55 MarthaJeanne: great! So, you were the one with the elephant dung...I recall reading that. :D

I have a bird feeding station in the middle of my perennial garden; I even call it my "bird garden". Today I noticed that a lot of sunflower seedlings were growing throughout the garden, so I took a flat hand fork and dug them under...wow! There were lots of baby earthworms uncovered, they love the rotting seed/droppings mixture. And I love them being there.

>54 jjmcgaffey: and >55 MarthaJeanne: - Great advice! No buds near the end of the stalks. I have re-potted the Marjoram in a larger pot and given the plant a bit of a hair cut - a "short back and sides" as my other half called it when he saw the plant! - and placed it in the sunniest area of the balcony. I know it isn't in the sun right now.... our balcony gets the morning sun. Will give it time and see if it bushes out any.

I saw these today at the hospital gift shop:



I wanted to buy them all, but settled for just taking a picture to share with my gardening buddies on LT.

Those are awesome!

I need some of the Plantus Unknownus - I keep planting seeds and forgetting to note what I scattered where!

>58 fuzzi: My husband says they missed Grassus Longum.

>61 MarthaJeanne: LOL! Tell your dh that he's quite the wit!

I think he is quite relieved that today is a holiday and you are not supposed to mow on Sundays and holidays here. We got back from England yesterday, so the lawn was last mown 4 weeks ago. Very much 'Grassus longum'!

He drove through two long days, and needs a break. I will be driving to buy tomato plants without him.

Wow.... it has been a while since I have last stopped by here. Sorry about the absence. Today seems like a good time for a gardening update.
-------------------------

Herb Garden Project
The garden is growing at a fantastic rate. Here are some quick snaps of the various plants as of this morning starting with a quick shot of almost all of the plants:



Here are some more detailed close ups:


Starting at the top row (on the plant shelf), going left to right, we have English Thyme (growing like a weed!), Orange Thyme (a recent acquisition that I am looking forward to trying out in some recipes), Marjoram (a plant I enjoy growing more as an experiment in learning how to shape the plant to grow the way I want - more bush-like, as I have yet to add this herb to any of my culinary dishes), Triple Curled Parsley (which I am rather proud of since I grew this plant from seed!).

Bottom row, we have Dill (another plant I have grown from seed), Chives (again, grown from seed), Garlic Chives, Mojito Mint (love the flavour of these leaves!), Spearmint (fantastic in drinking water with a wedge of fresh lemon), Creeping Rosemary (a plant I am trying to train like I have the Majoram), and tucked in the corner behind the plant stand leg, Fernleaf Dill.



Starting at the top row (on the plant shelf), going left to right, we have Italian Oregano (another plant that grows like a weed), French Tarragon, Purple Sage (I wasn't sure which type of Sage plant to grow but decided I didn't like the gangly look of Pineapple Sage), Parsley.

Middle row in picture (bottom row on plant shelf), Fernleaf Dill (more on this plant below), French Lavender and Spanish Tarragon.

On the deck in front of the plant stand, Basil (this plant is amazing! I am harvesting leaves every 3 weeks!), another shot of the Creeping Rosemary and Cilantro.

You have probably noticed that some of these plants are new. I purchased small 3" plants of Mojito Mint, French Tarragon and French Lavender back in May and they are happily thriving. Here are the purchase date snaps and the current date snaps:


Mojito Mint


French Tarragon


French Lavender

Part of the reason the plants are growing like gangbusters may have something to do with the fact that the huge spruce tree that filtering the sun on the balcony was removed last month - something about foundation damage to the building and Raccoon damage to the roof. Suffice to say, the plants now receive full sun from sunrise until noon and they seem super happy with this change.

New Plants:
Because we are still in prime growing season, I decided to start the following new batch of plants from seed two weeks ago:



Still early days but I am happy to report that the Lemon Balm and the Summer Savory are already sprouting:



The Chevil has only recently produced a single sprout, but no sign of any activity for the Reb Rubin Basil:



On the Dill front - my ongoing challenge - I am happy to report that the Fernleaf Dill transplanted well but has already outgrown it new pot. I need to think about the best pot for this plant.



The Dill I planted from seed is a mere shadow compared with its towering friend Fernleaf, and I am very concerned that in the past week the Dill has developed brown leaves.



I hope everyone has been having a wonderful spring/summer and that your gardens are flourishing!

>64 lkernagh: Wow, you are proliferating! Will your balcony be big enough?

Ha, my other half raised the same concern. I think I am going to start containing growth, although now that the balcony gets full sun, I am thinking of attempting some tomato plants next year. ;-)

Lovely! Love the pictures.

Have you considered harvesting and freezing or drying your herbs? You can take advantage of their growth now, and enjoy their taste all year.

Frozen tastes a lot better. I'll start harvesting mine as soon as it cools off a bit. (tomorrow?) I like to do bags of mixed herbs. BTW The best way I know of chopping herbs is in a glass with a pait of scissors. They really brighten up salads in the winter.

>67 fuzzi: & >68 MarthaJeanne: - I am starting to freeze the herbs, now that I know how easy that is! I am also starting to share the bounty with friends. I have been having a lot of fun gardening this year!

Thought I would report back on the progres of the newest batch of herbs I am attempting to grow from seed. Below is a comparison of the pictures taken back on June 14th - and their current pictures as of today - for the following herbs:

Red Ruben Basil and Chervil:

June 14th:

Today:


Lemon Balm and Summer Savoy"
June 14th:

Today:


Overall, a huge success, thanks to the unusually warm, sunny and dry weather the plants have experienced while I germinated them outdoors. I am looking forward to possibly transplanting the Summer Savory and the Chervil next weekend, into larger pots, and will leave the Lemon Balm and Red Ruben Basil in their current pots for another 2-3 weeks.

Everything else if growing great guns and being harvested on a regular basis.

I believe you are enjoying your little "Eden", on your porch.

Do keep us updated. :)

I do enjoy the garden. It is the first place I head after a day at the office. ;-)

>72 lkernagh: ah, relaxing, hmm? Our little gardens are better than television...and sometimes better than reading!

Yup, relaxing, in a therapeutic sort of way. My other half now understands when I just want to sit outside with "the plants". ;-)

I've really enjoyed your balcony herb garden odyssey, Lori! And am so impressed (and not a little jealous) at how wonderful you're doing! And inspired to do more container herb growing myself. This year, so far, all I've managed to grow (well) are basil, chives, and dill (surprisingly on the dill), as well as one borage plant that is taking over the container from the bush beans.

>75 Storeetllr: And my dill and borage have flat failed for the last two years (three for dill), though my oregano is taking over the world and the parsley is hanging on. It's funny how things vary, for no visible reason.

>75 Storeetllr: - Awe, thanks, Mary! I have really enjoyed getting back to gardening and enjoy harvesting the 'herbs' of my labour. ;-) I need to investigate more herb and plant varieties as borage is a new one for me. Kudos on your success with dill! That is one of my problem children. *sighs*

Time for an overdue update on my adventures in container herb gardening. Overall, this has been a very successful spring/summer, helped along by the fact that:

1. The big tree that provided shade to the balcony had to be chopped down early this spring which means the balcony can now receive full sun from sunrise until noon on sunny days.
2. We have had an unusually hot, sunny and dry spring/summer.... perfect temperatures for the garden to thrive in.

Starting with the big 8-inch pots, the Mojito Mint, English Thyme, French Lavender and Spearmint have been happy plants.



The following plants I acquired as small 2-inch plants have continued to thrive in their now 6-inch pots:
Italian Oregano, Spanish Tarragon, Orange Thyme, Sweet Basil



Dwarf Marjoram, Triple Curled Parsley, Rosemary, Purple Sage


Garlic Chives


the following plants were grown from seed and continue to happily thrive in their now 6-inch pots - these are my glowing success stories:
Chervil, Summer Savory, Parsley, Lemon Balm



Chives


My problem children are few but they do still worry me somewhat and will be the focus of attention for next year's herb garden. They are growing but they seem to be a bit on the weak side. The plants that I attempted to grow from seed that are causing me to loose sleep at night:
Red Rubin Basil and Dill



I think my problem with the Red Rubin Basil is that during the height of our heat wave, I was watering plants bottom up and top down (I placed the plant pot in a pail of water and watered it from the top while it was absorbing water from the bottom up). This, I believe, caused the Red Rubin Basil to establish shallow roots and now I have a plant that is kind of whimpy. The Dill, is just being Dill.

Two plants that I am a bit baffled with are my store bought Cilantro (Coriander) and French Tarragon.



The Cilantro/Corinader decided, in just the last two weeks, to just shoot straight up, almost as if it is in a height competition with my fernleaf dill. My French Tarragon seems to be browning out leaves at the lower stems of the branches as the plant grows:



No clue if this is normal plant behaviour for either of the plants. Any ideas?

Looks like I need to get around to harvesting herbs again. Good thing I have a three-day weekend this weekend. ;-)

Fairly typical of Tarragon in my experience.

Borage has large hairy leaves that taste cucumbery and cute blue flowers that are floated in Pimm's cup. The plants get really big, so might not be the best use of limited space.

Nice update, thank you.

If a plant gets "leggy", too tall, I cut off the top, to encourage it to branch out.

78> The cilantro is bolting, preparing to flower and seed. The height is one clue, the way the leaves have gone ferny is the other. You can trim it down and it might last a little longer, but in general I'd say it's done - you can let it go to seed and harvest the coriander, or just get rid of it. Cilantro has an _amazingly_ short life - it's literally weeks from sprout to bolt (perhaps as much as two months, but that's only 8-9 weeks...). When I really want to have cilantro to use, I plant the seeds every two weeks so there's always some ready to harvest while others are bolting or too young to use. It does take a while - another month or so - before the seed is brown and ready for harvest, so you'll have to decide if you want to tie up your pot that long. Even the flat leaves will change flavor with the bolting - they go bitter, I think (most herbs do, when they flower/bolt).

The others may do the same - rise straight up into flower stalks - but not so quickly.

>78 lkernagh: All those beautiful herbs! I haven't had luck with cilantro this year, either from seed or store-bought. But the dill! I should get out and take a picture of it, though I think you might get jealous. But that's okay, because I am definitely jealous of all your gorgeous healthy plants.

Your herbs are simply gorgeous, a major success, Lori! And yes, cilantro is so frustrating, bolting practically before you can harvest it at all.

Another one that does that is chervil. I love the anisy but delicate flavour, and try to enjoy it in spring when the self-seeded ones come up, but keeping multiple sowings going isn't practicle for me.

>79 MarthaJeanne: - Good to know, as I was starting to panic. I will avoid attempting to container grow borage. Thanks for the info!

>80 fuzzi: - Great advice! I did that to the cilantro and dill and they are both starting to propagate again.

>81 jjmcgaffey: - It is so sad that some herbs have such a short grow life. I am going to have to think about what herbs I want to start a continual growth cycle with.... maybe next year. Right now I need to come to grips with figuring out which plants are annuals and which ones may come back next year. A lot to learn. ;-)

>82 Storeetllr: - I would love to see pictures of your dill! That is one plant where my consumption exceeds its growing. I won't get jealous.... I will just stare in awe.

>83 ronincats: - Thanks Roni! So frustrating about cilantro. Until I come up with a plan, I think the majority of my fresh cilantro will come courtesy of the green grocers.

>84 MarthaJeanne: - I was just noticing that about the chervil. I agree with you. Keeping multiple sowings going is a lot of work for the amount of chervil I have consumed this summer.

---------------------

Summer has continued to be wonderful weather-wise so I have been absent spending time outdoors. I need to get around to doing another harvest from the plants but finding the time is a bit if a challenge. Good news is that I think I have figured out my Reb Rubin Basil. Remember how limpid he was looking earlier? Well, I think I have fixed the shallow roots and the overwatering problem. Here is are before and after shots:



The leaves are not as limpid and the plant is standing pretty tall.

>85 lkernagh: He does look much happier.

Oh well, the dill seems to have peaked, and it's now looking a bit scrawny. So, no need anymore for either jealousy or awe. The tomatoes, though! Lots of them, and oh! Absolutely delicious.

ETA good job with the basil!

Hello everyone! Instead of starting a new thread for 2016, I thought I would just continue with this one. I pretty much neglected my herb garden over the winter months. Gave it a bit of a quick cleanup back in February. Completely ignored it in March and it seems to have taken care of itself quite nicely.

HERB GARDEN - Update

As mentioned, the herb garden has done a wonderful job taking care of itself - not sure what that means for me as a gardener, but I will take any assistance I can get! The following herbs have come back on their own this Spring:

French Tarragon, Chives, Triple-curled Parsley (x2)

. . .

Thyme, Spearmint, Mojito Mint and Italian Oregano

. . .

The Lavender and Rosemary were fine all winter and continue to go strong (albeit, the Rosemary does seem to be the hardier of the two plants)

.

... I am wondering if the Rosemary could do with a good triming and possibly a bigger pot.

The Purple Sage and Lemon Balm look a little worse for wear but I think they will thrive as summer approaches

.

Last of the last year plants is Spanish Tarragon which seems to have some fresh shoots sprouting in just the past week

.

New plants planted back in late Feb/ early Mar that seem to have taken hold are Dill and Cilantro

.

... as for Basil, I have resigned myself to the fact that I just cannot seem to grow Basil from seed. I will have to rely upon seedling plants from the stores for my Basil.

Yay, it's spring and the herbs have returned!

The Parsley is a biennial, so it will soon start to concentrate on flowers and seeds, and then die, so you need to plant up new pots to replace the ones you have.

I think I would try to use more of the rosemary this year and not give it a bigger pot yet. If you aren't going to use it much, then it probably would appreciate a bigger pot. The lavender will be blooming soon. Doesn't look like the rosemary plans on that this year. Both rosemary and lavender vary a lot in how much cold they can take. My favourite lavender is not winterhard.

>89 qebo: - I do love this time of year!

>90 MarthaJeanne: - Oh, good to know about the parsley! I decided to re-pot the rosemary... it has now gone from a 6-inch pot to an 8-inch. The lavender is a plant that I purchased as a seedling last year - the tag labels it as French Lavender - and while it made it through the winter pretty good, I have to admit that we had a relatively mild winter this past year.

This was my first of the lavender I like so much. I have several that do fine in the garden, but my current plant of this variety spends the winter in the greenhouse. It did not survive this. I think it is Lavendula dentata. It doesn't blossom for me, but the leaves smell so nice.

Just found this website http://www.downderry-nursery.co.uk I wonder if I can convince Jerry to visit there this summer.

>88 lkernagh: Beautiful pics and what a great job you did of overwintering your herbs!

Of mine, only the chives plant that I forgot to bring inside but left out in the snow and cold is thriving. The ones I brought indoors just didn't like the dry stuffy air, and only the scented geraniums are still hanging on. Not even the rosemary or lavender made it, though I have hopes that, once I get them outdoors, they'll come back. We'll see.

You're back, so I am, too! :)

Nice looking herbs.

>92 MarthaJeanne:- What a gorgeous picture! My lavender variant has shorter leaves but still has a lovely fragrent scent (I use clippings to fill sachets for my sweater bin, etc).

>94 Storeetllr: - Lovely and jealous you have access to such a wonderful lavender nursery!

>94 Storeetllr: - We will just chalk it up to darn luck and a mild winter, Mary. No skill on my part, that is for sure! Have your chives already started to flower? Mine has and I read somewhere that you are supposed to clip back to the ground the chives with the flowers so that you can continue to get new growth. My mom is very protective of her geraniums - she brings them indoors at the first wiff of frost and keeps them indoors until she is satisfied that the warmer weather has settled in. Not sure how she makes that determination (she lives in Calgary) but I don't question what she does with her plants. ;-)

... Even rosemary didn't make it? Now I am shocked. I thought rosemary was the hardiest of hardy plants. One learns new things every day.

>95 fuzzi: - I'm back. So glad to see you are back as well! Looking forward to another wonderful growing season.

Happy Sunday everyone! It has been a wonderful day. Puttered around a bit with my plants - re-potting a house plant (more on that to follow), started a new batch of Spinach, Chervil and Summer Savory from seed and re-potted a Basil plant I purchased this afternoon (Basil continues to be one of the plants I just cannot seem to grow from seed).

The house plant is a Calathea. The history of this plant is a story of struggle and battle against odds in that this plant has been brought back from the brink of death not once but 4X by my other half. For those of you wondering at this statement given my herb garden, yes I kill houseplants on a regular basis. Poor little trooper was lucky to have my other half intervene each time the plant was on its last legs. At one point (3 years ago) the plant consisted of one limp leaf. Seriously. I am a poor plant mom. I have gotten much better at tending to both outside and inside plants in the last three years. Today was a bit of a celebration in that the Calathea has finally grown (under my more recent care, thank you very much) to the point where it needed to be transplanted into a bigger 9-inch pot. Here are the before and after shots of the Calathea plant:



I still need to find a new ceramic pot for the larger sized plant to fit into. For now, the basic green planter pots (that enable me to water it from the bottom) will suffice without the fancy 'housing'. This plant represents more than just my ability to learn how not to kill a house plant. It shows that anyone can learn how to care for a plant - even a brown thumb like me. ;-)

On the down side, I have decided that my French Tarragon plant is not doing well. I think I probably should have brought the plant indoors over the winter months - lessons learned. Here are some shots of the poorly doing plant:



Sad to see the French Tarragon isn't doing as well as I had hoped but, lessons learned. Even though we had a mild winter, if I get a new French Tarragon clipping, I will make sure to bring it indoors over the winter.

My coworker kills plants, repeatedly. She just doesn't understand about letting the soil dry out between waterings. I've killed a Jade plant that way, myself, but I learned.

I am still trying to do that - let the soil dry out between waterings. Nothing like killing a plant with kindness!

That's a beautiful herb garden. Congrats!

Thanks Rachel! I do love gardening and wish I had taken up the hobby earlier.

GARDENING UPDATE:

I know.... I have been pretty much absent from this thread since I revived it earlier this spring. I continue to experiment with container gardening. Some of my perennial herbs - Thyme, Rosemary and Chives - are doing fabulous:

. .

I had some plants from last year that came back this spring and I decide to see if I can grow cuttings. I had a bit of a hit and miss go at this - Italian Oregano did NOT do so well as a cutting, at least not my attempt anyways - but for the most part I have had some level of success with growing cuttings of Spearmint, Mojito Mint and Lemon Balm:

. .

With the success from last year, I grew the following herbs from seed again this year - Chervil, Cilantro (Coriander), Summer Savory, Dill, Parsley, Basil - both Sweet and Red Rubin. The following plants have done well outdoors - Cilantro, Summer Savory and Parsley:

. .

I particularly love how the Parsley came in so thick and green! Beats any Parsley I see in the grocery store.

Chervil has proven to be a bit of a dud this year, which disturbs me a bit considering it was such an amazing success last year:



The following plants were purchased as seedlings this spring and seem to be happily thriving outdoors: French Tarragon (after my failed attempt at trying to grow a cutting this spring from last year's plant), Spanish Tarragon, Greek Oregano and Sage (to replace last year's (Purple Sage - which did not come back very well this year):

. . .

Trying something a bit different this year, I decided to keep the Dill and Basil plants as indoor plants, even after they started to sprout. That involved coming up with a plant stand that would enable the plants to take full advantage of the morning sun as the sunniest area in our home is in front of the living room balcony windows. Roaming the second hand/charity shops, I came up with the perfect solution: a second hand wood frame 7 shelf CD stand. It was in good condition and - even better - painted black, which matches my bookshelves and our entertainment unit. Lying on its side in front of the balcony windows, I now have a perfect 8"H - 7"W - 45"L plant stand that blends with the living room decor and can easily accommodate seven 6-inch pots. Suffice to say, my previous failed attempts to grow Basil from seed have now gone the way of the Dodo as you will be able to see from the following pictures (pictures taken outdoors for better lighting):

. .

As I like to attempt new things every year, this year I have decided to add some leafy greens to my container gardening experience. I chose the following, mainly because these were the seeds I was able to readily lay my hands on - Spinach, Swiss Chard, Mustard and Red Russian Kale:



For the most part, I claim success with this new gardening adventure. The Spinach didn't do so well, but I don't know if it has to do with the confines of container gardening or being an off-season. I have a work colleague who has also attempted to grow spinach in her garden this year and has also reported sub-par success. On the good news front, I count the Mustard and Kale as huge successes and even the Swiss Chard is doing pretty good, even though my mom did tell me after the fact that Swiss Chard needs a deep container for its root system.

. . .

Overall, I continue to enjoy my on-going adventures in container gardening. It is both therapeutic and empowering. I am also looking forward to dinner this evening... homemade lasagna with a side salad of greens from the garden.

>102 lkernagh: Your plants are so well tended!

>103 qebo: I'll say they're well tended! Way to go, Lori!

What's the weather like where you are? Spinach is a cool-weather plant - it does _not_ like heat, and will bolt almost as soon as it sprouts if it's warm out (highs over 70 and mine quits). I found out this year that it also doesn't like being shaded - I planted spinach and carrots together, and the carrots grew wildly and overshaded the spinach which bolted very young (despite cool weather). I never got a usable leaf off it. I'm letting some of it grow, still, in order to get its seeds - we'll see how it does. These days I'm growing New Zealand spinach instead - it's a completely different plant, a semi-succulent that's heat-tolerant and capable of growing through our mild winters (maybe 1-2 frost nights a year). But it cooks up quite a bit like spinach, and does well both in the ground and in containers. The only thing is that it takes _forever_ to sprout - it was something like 2 months (admittedly, in cool weather) from my planting seeds to them finally sprouting. But it also produces seed constantly and abundantly; I haven't planted a seed in 2 years, I get sprouts every year from where I pulled out a plant three years ago (despite scraping off the surface and adding more dirt and compost to the pot, this spring). It's a weird, but very useful plant.