Jill's 2025 Reading, Rummaging, and Sorting Continues - Part Five

Completed in Second Quarter 2025 (April to June)

Fiction

The Death I Gave Him (retelling of Hamlet)
The Black Spectacles
The Angel of Crows
The Wood at Midwinter (Single novella)
A Great Reckoning
Floating Hotel
Taken by the Hand
The Tainted Cup
Unexpected Legacy
Death of an Airman

Non-Fiction

The Zimmerman Telegram
The Science of Storytelling

Book Group Selections

Bestiary (Short Stories, Gardner Dozois, editor)
Unexpected Legacy
Code Girls (on-going)
Appointed to Die

Rereads (Christie)

Peril at End House
Death in the Clouds
Appointment with Death
Dumb Witness
The Mysterious Mr. Quin
Star Over Bethlehem (Only the poems relating to her Harlequin material)

Historical Research

Dame Agatha’s Shorts
Agatha Christie’s True Crime
George V: Never a Dull Moment
Matriarch
Forever England: Femininity, Literature and Conservatism Between the Wars
Appointment with Death and Other Plays

@clamairy @pgmcc Can either of you fix the heading for this thread? It should be Part Five rather than four as currently shown.

>2 jillmwo:
Done!

I was soo tempted when updating that title. Oh the POWER! It is so tempting.

Happy new thread.

>3 pgmcc:. Thank you for fixing the thread title and most particular thanks for not abusing your awe-inspiring power, O Great Potentate....

Happy new thread :)

>2 jillmwo: Happy new thread!

Glad to know I'm not the only one who struggles occasionally with starting another one. :)

Of course, no one taunted me with their editing powers, so there's that.

Happy new thread!

Happy new thread!

>5 Narilka: >6 terriks: >7 Karlstar: >8 haydninvienna: Thank you all. But I am in a bit of a quandary. I had a book and had read two chapters out of it before lunch. But now, when I am ready to return to it, the book has vanished. (Yes, I could read something else, but I was MAKING PROGRESS in that one.) The spouse is watching a ball game so he's no help. I am about to go see if I put it down on the desk. I doubt it but...y'know... hope springs eternal..

>9 jillmwo: Happy New Thread!
I do hope you located the book.

>10 clamairy: I was sitting on it. (Not entirely accurate, because the book had slipped back into the gap between the back of the couch and the seat cushion. Had it gone all the way through the gap, I'd never have been able to retrieve it.)

>11 jillmwo: I'm not laughing. (Okay... Maybe just a little bit.)

>11 jillmwo:
I too have trouble finding things after drinking two bottles of wine. Enjoy the book.

This is rather fun as a list: https://bibliollcollege.substack.com/p/bozes-eighty-five-favorite-books

>14 jillmwo: It certainly is a list. I thought this was amusing.

"37. The Penguin Book of Norse Myths, by Kevin Crossley-Holland

For my money the single best retelling of the Norse myths, preserving the dense worldbuilding of the old tales while adding considerable narrative flair. Without altering or dumbing down the stories (ahem, Gaiman), Crossley-Holland makes them irresistibly enjoyable."

This is a rather lengthy article on ebooks and libraries: https://www.infotoday.com/cilmag/jul25/Blackwell-Halperin-Mason-Parker--Ebook-Av...

>16 jillmwo: That was quite interesting, but I did not read it all. Were you surprised the ebooks were more expensive?

As mentioned in a previous thread, I was reading The Bookbinder of Jericho at bedtime. It was a good choice in the sense that there were no shocking wartime occurrences that might tend to keep one awake. There is more discussion of the internal warfare felt by our main protagonist than discussions of actual military efforts during World War I. The story takes place in Oxford – in a bindery operated by the Oxford University Press, in the college buildings of the University itself, and in the community of families squeezed into narrow canal boats. Peg and her twin sister, Maude, have recently lost their mother and they work side-by-side in the bindery. Both women are exceptional – although in very different ways – and the growth process they experience across the five years of the first World War shapes them unexpectedly. The narrative pace is slow but it works in this context. The book focuses on the lives of not just Peg and Maude, but on the experiences of others around them – Tilda, a VAD at the front; Lotte, a Belgian refugee, Rosie, a neighbor on a nearby canal boat. It’s a lovely book.

My gripe is the title.The British title is The Bookbinder of Jericho which makes sense in a thematic way. It is a reference to the working-class suburb of that name that lies outside Oxford’s walls. But apparently, the publishers felt the original title would be a tad too arcane for American understanding and so for the US market, they changed the name to just The Bookbinder. Why can’t you - the publisher - just leave things the way they are so as to spark learning in your readers? I was annoyed when they changed the title of Harry Potter and the Philosopher’s Stone based on the similar assumption about what American buyers will recognize. I’m a big girl. I can look things up. It makes your book more memorable to me if I need to gather new information to understand. Feed independent curiosity!!!

I’d certainly recommend it as a worthwhile read to women of all ages. I also recommend it for the details included regarding the nature of book production in 1914. Quite interesting for those who care about how a physical volume gets put together and finished. (There’s a lovely tidbit in the book about a frontispiece missing from the Somerville’s library’s copy.) There’s a theme having to do with educational gaps, piecing knowledge together haphazardly, the value associated with learning (who should be educated and who doesn’t need it). It’s a touching story, only a little too “happy ending”-ish, but still robust enough that I would most heartily recommend it. (As it happens, I arm-twisted one of my book groups into reading the previous book by Pip Williams, The Dictionary of Lost Words.)

>17 Karlstar: This requires a lengthier response than I can do right this minute. No, on one hand, I'm not surprised by it. On the other hand, I am irritated by the publishers' business rationale.

>15 Karlstar: Yes, that book list offers some good blurbs about each of the 85 titles. And it was a nice combination of recent work as well as the old classics. (I note that War and Peace was included and I disagreed with him about that, but I did chortle over the comments regarding Les Miserables) And there was not a whiff of Thackeray so clearly a librarian of sound thinking!

>17 Karlstar:. The thing about trade publishing and libraries is a long standing issue. The publishing world would largely prefer that libraries stick to lending out print; libraries would prefer that publishers allow them to pick what works best for the library patrons -- that is, a mix of ebook (popular with some % of their patrons) and print (popular with a different % of library patrons). Part of the publisher thinking is that ebook lending cuts into the revenue earned by authors and honestly, that is an unfair business tactic launched largely by Amazon. Background on some of what is going on is here in an article I wrote back in January of 2020: https://www.niso.org/niso-io/2020/01/ebooks-and-embargoes-eleven-links.

Also the authors of the research report indicate some of their findings had to be dropped from the Computers in Libraries article due to length considerations. The material that was edited out may be found here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/18ltsiUw6VGj9MGHOchD0KpnPRUUg2ZrjUG99oCN6Meo/...

While I was not specifically aware of quite how high the ebook costs were running, I'm not surprised. (Horrified, but not truly surprised by the calculation of ebooks being as much as 7 times the cost of print, but there's a lot of factors to be considered.) There is no friction in an ebook model. An electronic file doesn't get tomato juice spilled on it or have small children scribbling in crayon on it (or as has been noted by Hugh, I think) have photographs cut from the page. When that kind of damage occurs to print, libraries go out and obtain another copy which means money for the publisher. Print wears out naturally; a rule of thumb among librarians for a long while was that a book lasted for roughly 10 loans. (Not sure if that's still considered to be valid.)

But none of that deterioration is likely to occur with the use of an ebook. Publishers will reluctantly license ebooks to libraries because of the public outcry but, to make up for any lost revenue, they hike the price of licensing ebooks to libraries. Print is a whole lot easier for publishers in some respects (albeit not in all); the European Union is leaning heavily on publishers with regard to sustainability when it comes to the use of paper. Publishers have to document the provenance of paper used in the printing house, which is far more arcane and costly than most realize. I think over in the Folio Society discussion group, there was a conversation going on about why FS would put out some books covered in paper rather than in cloth. I'm sure that decision is not taken lightly given the general cost of Folio Society editions. But publishers are facing pressure on production costs on any number of fronts.

Consumers are price sensitive as well when it comes to what they think a book should cost. (I remember how incensed I was as a consumer when a Colleen McCullough book went up in price to $8.99 for a mass market paperback.)

Libraries are even more price-sensitive than individual consumers and their budgets are expected to be applied to more than a single format. The report references audio books as being particularly expensive and the demand for audio has skyrocketed. Those working the front desk at the library also aren't thrilled with the very long wait times involved for ebook access because patrons do complain when the wait for a bestseller extends to weeks and/or months. I'm in awe of the patience shown by folks here in the Pub when waiting for an ebook title from the library.

The report seems to indicate that there are three models currently on offer: (1) perpetual access once licensed; (2) circulation-based licenses; and (3) metered licensing. I'm not clear on a lot of the details involved, but what is very clear from the report is that the Big Five trade publishers lack any enthusiasm for allowing libraries perpetual access licenses.

Sorry, I'm maundering on here but I don't think any particular segment is happy with the current situation when it comes to ebooks.

Edited to add something that was noted during a panel at a 2025 publishing conference: "There's concern how much libraries will actually pay for content next year." True, regardless of whether you're talking about trade publishing or scholarly publishing.

Interesting piece here regarding books that are memoirs as a genre setting expectations for the reader: https://theconversation.com/scandal-has-erupted-over-bestselling-memoir-the-salt...

>14 jillmwo:
That is a great list. I enjoyed reading hos comments on books I have read and volumes I have yet to read.

He asks for suggestions of boohs he would like. Based on his list I would suggest A Confederacy of Dunces.

>22 pgmcc: It is indeed a great list. I keep going back to consider specific titles. I've never read O Caledonia but I'm tempted. He includes Bleak House while admitting it's not his favorite Dickens novel. He cheats by including the entire series of the Dr. Gideon Fell novels by John Dickson Carr. He has two titles by Susanna Clarke so now Piranesi is worming its way up on the wishlist. And he's broad minded enough to include Agatha Christie as well.

So much food for thought. (And I've never read Confederacy of Dunces. Why do you think it would belong?)

>23 jillmwo:
Reading the list I felt I was reading something compiled by someone who shared my liking for books that are a bit off kilter, out there, pushing the envelope (excuse my postal experience) and weird. Of the books and/or authors I have read I felt the following contributed to this feeling:

77. Catch-22, by Joseph Heller

70. Northanger Abbey, by Jane Austen

53. Piranesi et al, by Susanna Clarke

50. Twenty Thousand Leagues under the Sea et al, by Jules Verne

23. Bleak House, by Charles Dickens

20. The Man Who Was Thursday, by G. K. Chesterton

A Confederacy of Dunces it out of kilter, out there, pushes the envelope and is weird. It is a book that gives rise to divided opinions. I see it as a book that champions people with challenges whereas some people think it is making fun of an unfortunate person. My interpretation of the book is that the unfortunate hero wins out in the end; he has ploughed his way through life in a way that he wants to plough it and does not give a damn for societal rules or norms.

Of course, the only way you will be able to judge this for yourself will be to read it yourself.

I hope this goes some way in explaining why I think A Confederacy of Dunces would be one the compiler of the list would enjoy.

>24 pgmcc: I thought there were too many Dickens books on the list. When I was considering books for my Dickens reading, Bleak House just seemed too depressing to even consider.

>25 Karlstar:
I really enjoyed Bleak House.

Going back to book titles, one of my favorites was Rawblood in the UK as originally published, but became The Girl from Rawblood (bleah) in the US. Why? Why girl this and girl that? It's so 2013.

>23 jillmwo: O Caledonia is a great little book. It's well worth your time.

>25 Karlstar:, >26 pgmcc: Bleak House is my favourite Dickens novel (though I have not read very many). He's far from my favourite author but that one is excellent by any measure. The BBC did a very good adaptation in the 2000s with Gillian Anderson as Lady Dedlock that I highly recommend.

>28 Sakerfalcon:
The opening scene in the courtroom captured me straight away with its explanation of the futility of court cases for settling property inheritance disputes.

As it happens I was reading it as I passed The Four Courts on my way to work. It was very apropos.

Finished the most recent Crater School book by Chaz Brenchley. Radhika Rages at the Crater School has a really interesting flavor to it. Excellent addition to the series. Although I think it's time for Rowany to go off and have many interesting covert adventures on her own. But that might necessitate an entirely new series.

>21 jillmwo: Yikes. I had not heard about this controversy, but I had not read that book or seen that movie yet. I don't think I ever thought about the difference between an autobiography and a memoir. I suspect that now I will endeavor to be more diligent about reading reviews and waiting until the book is out a while before I purchase anything labeled memoir.

>26 pgmcc: >28 Sakerfalcon: So, what you are saying is that Oliver Twist and David Copperfield were poor choices? I really enjoyed Little Dorrit.

>31 clamairy: I've been known to say that I dislike biographical films about people who are still alive - mostly because we don't really know their story yet and don't really know if what they say is true, at least in many cases. See, The Blind Side, etc. I guess the same would be true for books.

>32 Karlstar:
I quite enjoyed Oliver Twist but David Copperfield, the supposed autobiographical novel, left me cold. It was the first Dickens novel that I did not like and it has taken me several years to get back into the mood for reading another Dickens.

If you like Dickens you should also try Wilkie Collins and Anthony Trollope. They are both very good.

The Quincunx by Charles Palliser is written in Dickens style and is very enjoyable. Palliser also wrote other novels that I have enjoyed.

>32 Karlstar: Everyone's taste is different, but personally I couldn't finish David Copperfield (although I LOVED Demon Copperhead) and haven't bothered trying Oliver Twist. Bleak House contains some of Dickens' best female characters which is one of its main attractions to me.

>35 Sakerfalcon:
I am glad to learn I am not the only one who had trouble with David Copperfield. I found it tedious, not a problem I had with other novels by Dickens.

I have Bleak House sitting on the shelf, although I still haven't read it. But I still much prefer Wilkie Collins to Charles Dickens. Why is Dickens so venerated? His narratives can get to be so convoluted. Go read Collins' The Law and the Lady or The Moonstone. I think those are worthy of note. I admit that I haven't yet read Collins' Armadale which certainly rivals Bleak House in terms of length.

>37 jillmwo: The woman in white is outstanding. And Armadale is excellent too. I agree with you in your preference for Collins over Dickens.

>38 Sakerfalcon:
The Woman in White is great. I have yet to read Armadale.

Joseph Sheridan Le Fanu is also excellent. Uncle Silas is an entertaining read.

Mary Elizabeth Braddon is also worth reading. Try Lady Audley's secret or Aurora Floyd.

>32 Karlstar: I didn’t see Oliver Twist on the list. I started David Copperfield once, years ago, and dropped it. Just now realizing it's another book I know I had but don't know where it is... I found Great Expectations okay, a little wordy. But it's Dickens, so...

I was tickled to see I Capture the Castle and the Gormenghast trilogy on the list. Mervyn Peake is another author who died too young.

What do you do in this group?

>41 terriks: Oliver Twist wasn't on the list referenced, but it was one of the Dickens that I read the last few years when I was trying to catch up. I thought it was all right, not great. Sounds like I should read Bleak House.

Funny though, David Copperfield is #1 on that list but definitely not in this group.

Just as a follow-up to what get's covered in my review of The Age of Illusion: England in the Twenties and Thirties, Only after I started reading it, did I happen across the fact that the Folio Society had done an edition of this back in 2015; otherwise it had never come up on my radar. My reading copy was an affordable POD paperback from Bloomsbury’s Faber imprint. Worthwhile and definitely a four-and-a-half or five star read.

>43 Karlstar: Okay, that's how I had read it, too.

Dunno about Bleak House, but I think I have a copy somewhere. Oliver Twist was good - I read it as a teenage and it was likely the first Dickens I ever read. Maybe I was impressed with the various characters, like The Artful Dodger (fun name!) and the whole sad clan of little thieves. It may strike me completely differently now.

It's Great Expectations that gets a lot of buzz that left me wondering what all the fuss was about.

Here's something for you, written by Peter Dickinson for The Armchair Detective back in 1991. The article is entitled "Murder in the Manor": https://www.peterdickinson.com/murdermanor/

>45 terriks: Great Expectations was required reading for my sons when they were in high school. Other than A Christmas Carol, I think it was the only thing from Dickens that they found tolerable.

I have responses to both of the above posts but must get back my reading or Jill will accuse me of slacking.

>47 jillmwo:
I read and enjoyed A Christmas Carol decades ago and have read it several times since. It was my first Dickens read. The next Dickens novel I read was Great Expectations and I really enjoyed it. I have read several other of his novels since and enjoyed all but David Copperfield; it just did not move me like the others.

Well, I've spent the past week simply "sampling" books. Nothing I felt I could whole-heartedly commit to, but a number of tastings. For example, it's not got much going for it by the way of a plot, but I did get into The Day of Small Things by O. Douglas for a few hours. But it was too wholesome to fully satisfy.

I have A Month in the Country by J.L. Carr here in front of me. It's much more modern, having been published in 1980.

I could also read a book of essays on American history by Jill Lepore, but am more intrigued by A Drop of Corruption by Robert Jackson Bennett.

There's also a very peculiar mystery that I came across while reading an interview of Stephen Frye. He recommends The Empress Murders for its complexity. I find the author's use of a cruise ship as one of the narrative voices to be intriguing, but none of the characters seemed overly likeable.

I have been slowly reading The Figure of Arthur by Charle Williams It's a well-done overview of the development of the myth but sometimes I feel as if this is something one really could benefit from being with others in a classroom. The actual poetry has memorable moments (such as the point where Taliessin steps off the ship in one of the very early poems included.)

Meanwhile, I continue to meditate on Agatha Christie, the Commedia del Arte, and her on-going use of the romantic triangle. As I said before, most of her poetry isn't very good, but she did have one set of poems she wrote -- "A Masque From Italy" -- which are interesting because of how they set up her thinking in The Mysterious Mr. Quin.

Oh, and I did succumb to getting the ebook version of A Case of Mice and Murder, because Peter said it was good.

I really do lack focus at the moment.

>50 jillmwo: I loved A month in the country but managed to read it without realising it was so recent! I assumed it was written close to the time when it is set. I guess that shows how well the author evokes the period and its sensibility.

>50 jillmwo:
As it happens, today is the publication date for A Case of Life and Limb. Just saying.

From today's New York Times:

Publishers and authors argue that the long wait times for library e-book checkouts, which these legislative efforts hope to alleviate, are the only market force encouraging people to actually buy e-books. “When it’s so easy to get a free e-book, a perfect e-book, every time, why would they ever buy an e-book?” said Mary Rasenberger, executive director of the Authors Guild. “The only friction now that exists for getting library e-books is the wait time.”

She added that authors need every penny in royalties they can get. A 2023 Authors Guild survey found the median income for authors from their books was just $10,000 annually. “We have always been supportive of more library funding, but don’t make authors subsidize access,” Rasenberger said. (Several authors declined to comment by name for fear of review bombing.)

All of this is associated with coverage of possible Connecticut and New Jersey legislation intended to drive publishers to the negotiating table re the pricing of ebooks and contractual restrictions on usage (such as ILL).

A bit more:

Smaller publishers say their authors are largely happy just to get their books into the digital holdings of libraries. Joe Matthews, chief executive officer of the Independent Publishers Group, said the current question is part of a longer philosophical debate in the books business: “If someone checks out an e-book from a library, is that a lost sale?” he said. “No one really has the data set to prove anything.”...Even so, Matthews said that for the authors he works with, library exposure tends to be a good thing, and not represent lost sales. This is why his group allows libraries to purchase, rather than license, e-books and audiobooks from dozens of publishers at a standard consumer price.

I am trying very hard not to just do a massive cut and paste of the article.

>53 jillmwo: Those are some interesting questions. There are definitely some (most?) ebooks I've checked out of the library lately that I will not buy - but I most likely wouldn't have bought them in the first place, so it isn't a lost sale.

I've had a hard time finding the books I want from the library anyway.

>53 jillmwo: I am not au fait with all the library arrangements for e-books and physical books here. I know that some publishers charge libraries and enterprise rate of five times the cover price for physical books to cover the fact that multiple people will read the book. Others have a payment scheme based on the number of loans the cook has.

Any authors I know are only too happy to have people borrow their books from a library as they do receive something relating to the number of loans.

I suspect there are myriad licencing and royalty schemes in operation when you look at the worldwide library/publisher/author world.

Of course, in any supply chain, the weakest player is the one who gets screwed the most. Unless an author is a very successful big name they are not going to have significant leverage with the publisher or the library world. Even when authors unite to present a coherent unified front there will always be authors who will not comply with the group strategy or behaviour, thus weakening the unite front.

AI confuses the already complex environment and muddies the water further.

>55 pgmcc:. Here in the States authors do not get royalties based on the number of loans in a library. In that regard we are somewhat behind the rest of civilization. Your point about the weakest player is valid.

And like >54 Karlstar:, I get a little annoyed with my local library for the same reason that he states. I don't mean that they aren't trying to meet the needs of their community, only that my tastes tend to be something of an outlier.

On an adjacent topic, I was consoling a friend of mine, a retired academic, who had recently gone into her university's library only to discover that the print reference books upon which she'd relied for some thirty years had been "removed". She was directed instead to the bowels of a basement where microfilm was stored with a brand new microfilm reader -- but one that NO ONE on staff knew how to operate. Growling, she went online with some of her citations to see if she could find them in either Gale or EBSCO. After a momentary bit of success, she discovered that half of one substantive article had been truncated in the database. (Bunch of blank pages where the vendor had clearly not done much of a Quality Assurance check. Vendors tend to rely on the user population to advise them of glitches like this. Insofar as I'm aware, AI isn't going to help much with this type of omission.) She's all too aware that getting corrections made to a database is a hit-or-miss kind of priority so it was a really, really bad day for her. She's such a good and conscientious soul and she is always caught off-guard when faced with this kind of stupidity. I let her weep on my shoulder and made appropriate gasps of horror as she told me the tale.

I sound so curmudgeonly these days. One more item for review by those of you who are familiar with the ways of corporate businesses and the move to the "cloud" as a solution. Ever heard the buzzword phrase of "lift and shift"? https://medium.com/@nsagheen/bludgeoned-buzzwords-lift-and-shift-e36c2171d163

>56 jillmwo: After reading your articles lately, I understand the difficulties the library has with e-books. No way they can afford a large selection under the current terms. I guess that benefits authors.

>57 jillmwo: Ugh, don't remind me of 'lift and shift'. In our company, it also referred to moving responsibility for work 'offshore' and thereby getting rid of the existing team. I couldn't actually read the entire article, it required me to create an account, but the first 2 paragraphs were plenty.

>57 jillmwo:
What Jim said in >58 Karlstar:.

A quote included in a column by Michael Dirda "As H.L. Mencken wrote long ago, “What ails American literature, fundamentally, is what ails the whole of American culture, politely so called: a delusion of moral duty.” Dirda was talking about a new book On Book Banning: Or, How the New Censorship Consensus Trivializes Art and Undermines Democracy.

Going to go back now to my book, The West Passage which is a remarkable fantasy that is somewhat redolent of Mervyn Peake and Gormenghast.

>60 jillmwo:
Is your touchstone correct?

>61 pgmcc: Yes, it is. Dirda was wrote a column in the Washington Post talking about the practice of book-banning and Ira Wells book as shown. But WaPo's gift article policy is annoying so I didn't link to the column. Instead I linked directly to the book title itself.

Edited to say that I misunderstood your query, @pgmcc. I fixed the touchstone to go to the right book (The West Passage) both in the msg above and in this one. Life is complicated and confusing, but the title I'm pointing to might be worth your investigating. I have not gotten quite far enough in it to tell you for sure, but it's tending that way. Very Gothic, very funky mechanical environment.

Fun read is this interview with Kathryn Harkup re V Is For Venom: https://bigthink.com/big-think-books/agatha-christies-poisons/
No paywall

>60 jillmwo: I just bought The west passage at the weekend! Your mention of Gormenghast has me intrigued. I look forward to your review.

Just catching up. I like Dickens at least as much as I like Collins if not more, BTW. Just throwing that into the conversation. ;o)

>65 clamairy: I haven't tried Collins yet. >26 pgmcc: >28 Sakerfalcon: >35 Sakerfalcon: Convinced me that I'm not done reading Dickens yet and that Bleak House should be next.

>66 Karlstar: After age 40 I could never have made it through Bleak House in any form other than audio. I make jokes about my adult onset ADD, but the struggle is real.

>66 Karlstar: Bleak House is one of my favourites by Dickens ;) - together with Great Expectations and A Tale of Two Cities. I just thought I'd throw something in as well :)

>68 Alexandra_book_life: A Tale of Two Cities is just wonderful, in my humble opinion.

>69 clamairy: Agreed!

>68 Alexandra_book_life:
Nice throw!

A Tale of Two Cities is one I have not read yet. I must fix that soon. I take it you regard it as one if the best of books rather than one the worst of books.

>69 clamairy:
I have found your opinion in no need to be humble.

>72 pgmcc: You're too kind. And this particular Dickens is short, so perhaps you can hold your nose and dive in at some point.

>71 pgmcc: Very clever. I've always thought it was one of Dickens' better novels.

>73 clamairy: A Tale of Two Cities is short?

>68 Alexandra_book_life: Thanks for the additional vote, I'll be looking up an inexpensive ebook copy of Bleak House soon. I guess that's my classic read for the present.

I have to admit that I'm chortling over the set of messages posted in the past 48 hours. You are all thoroughly fixated on Charles Dickens. I'll bet you are all also squarely with @pgmcc in his Thackeray camp as well. For the record, this is the thread where we support Wilkie Collins. (Not that I have anything against A Tale of Two Cities. As novels by Dickens go, it’s certainly action-packed. Certainly better than Vanity Fair.)

I'm still reading The West Passage but a review will be coming shortly, >64 Sakerfalcon:.

>76 jillmwo: I've been thinking of re-reading The Moonstone sometime. Would that count as supporting Wilkie Collins?

>74 Karlstar: I guess I should have said comparatively short, especially in relation to Bleak House, which is a doorstop. Google tells me copies run from between 300 - 500 pages. Bleak House runs somewhere between 900 and 1100 pages.

>73 clamairy:
I know it is short. I bought a copy while we were away for a weekend and fully intended to read it then, but as you know, things get in the way.

>77 Alexandra_book_life:
The Moonstone is an excellent book. If you like that book you might also like Uncle Silas by Joseph Sheridan Le Fanu.

>80 pgmcc: Aha! Very interesting, thank you :)

>76 jillmwo:
I grew up in a big family. My skin is very thick.

I must reread Vanity Fair. It is 47 years since my reading it.

“Thackery Camp” sounds like a great name for secret base.

>82 pgmcc: That has a lovely ring to it.

>76 jillmwo: Sorry we desecrated your thread.

>83 clamairy: I never said the thread had been desecrated exactly. I suggested rather that there might be barbarians lurking about.

>82 pgmcc: And while we're on the topic of barbarians, you might at least spell the man's name right. It would be Thackeray camp.

>77 Alexandra_book_life: I thoroughly enjoyed The Moonstone. But I would also recommend to you No Name as well as The Law and The Lady. As previously noted, I haven't yet attempted Armadale but it could be a possibility for later in the year.

And >74 Karlstar: A Tale of Two Cities is entirely manageable in terms of page count. Figure 450 pages or thereabouts; I checked the Everyman's Library version. If I recall correctly, my son's high school English class got through it in about 2-1/2 weeks, maybe three.

Thanks for the rec on The Law and the Lady. There is a full cast audio drama of it on Audible and at over 13 hours, I bet it sticks really close to the text. I might have to get that one soon. I've enjoyed a lot of Collins's work when I was on a sensation novel binge about 10 years ago. Couldn't get through Armadale though for some reason. It was just too repetitive and there were too many people with the same names. Ugh. The Black Robe was good as was The Dead Secret although not quite as tightly focused. Same with The Legacy of Cain. Most of those I have reviewed if you're curious.

>84 jillmwo:
Thank you for the correction; only a true Thackeray fan would have spotted that.

>86 pgmcc:. Or really, anyone with an awareness of literature of the 19th century...

>87 jillmwo:
You continue to hide from your love of Thackeray’s work. You have nothing to be ashamed of. Me thinks the lady doth protest too much.

>88 pgmcc: OR as a man who claims to enjoy Thackeray, if you haven't revisited his work in 47 years, there might be some self-deception happening at your end. Somehow or other you can find time to identify elephants in various and scattered locations, but you can't find time to sit and read Vanity Fair.

>89 jillmwo:
The elephants are everywhere. There is always an elephant. It is not possible to get away from them.

Here is one we found yesterday in The Domaine De Chaumont:



The day before we found these ones at Les Closeaux Restaurant:



And before that in Amboise:



There is no getting away from them. There is always an elephant.

>84 jillmwo: See, this is how I recall reading A Tale of Two Cities - in high school. And then, maybe to cheer us up, the teacher brought in the movie. It was a reel-to-reel B&W, of course, and I loved that too.

But that's the last time I read it, and we're talking several decades ago.

My mother used to urge me to read Thackeray, but apparently we didn't have any at the house (which is where I picked up most of my literature in those days), and neither high school or college Lit. classes included him.

But I'm curious, and ready. What's the best Thackeray to start with? (Lengthy novels don't intimidate me.)

>90 pgmcc: OMG!!! I love that elephant standing on the tip of his trunk. (Although it seems like a cruel thing to imagine on the part of the sculptor, so it's a poor reflection on me that it brings a chortle.)

But I've noticed this running theme in the Pub, about the apparent omnipresence of elephants. It calls to mind Alice Walker mentioning the color purple in nature - it's everywhere, once you start to notice it.

Not a big fan of Wilkie Collins. I'll just leave that here. I like Dickens, but like clamairy, find it harder to commit to him these days.

>90 pgmcc: I thought of you the other day. We drove by a water vending machine and someone had painted an elephant peeking around it from behind. Would have taken a picture, but traffic didn't allow.

>91 terriks: I am the wrong person to ask about recommendations of Thackeray. I could never get through Vanity Fair. I did however read the much shorter satirical piece entitled Rebecca and Rowena in which Thackeray takes apart Ivanhoe. Short and savage.

>92 terriks: and >93 MrsLee: I have actually read more of Dickens than might be evident here. I have read The Cricket on the Hearth as well as The Mystery of Edwin Drood, one Dickens novel that I did rather enjoy. I have read The Tale of Two Cities as well as A Christmas Carol. I don't OBJECT to Dickens; I just prefer Wilkie Collins. (See #84 above.)

I'm returning to The West Passage which is extraordinary and requires a slower pace of reading. On the shelf (because there's no room on the ottoman), I also have Agatha Christie: Investigating Femininity. Oooh, and I have been slowly exploring Taliessin Through Logres which is heady stuff. Unread, I think there's also a Wilkie Collins' novel, Hide and Seek which I know nothing about but which appears interesting.

I did finish one of the Philo Vance books (specifically, The Scarab Murder Case which requires patience but which is actually an interesting and well-planned construction. He did it; no, he didn't do it; rather, he's the next victim; no -- he really might have done it. But wait a minute -- could it be one of the other guys? There are a number of tumbling statues and other useful artifacts. Amidst it all, there is the impassive presence of the Egyptian man, Hani. Hani makes the household butler nervous, but he's the wife's guardian so we put up with it. (He's also one of the smarter guys in the room.) Philo Vance isn't entertaining but he does get mixed up in some interesting cases.

>78 clamairy: >84 jillmwo: Is this page count creep? I seem to remember way back when I first read A Tale of Two Cities, it seemed very long. Now, with Jordan, Martin and Sanderson doorstops being more the norm, it is just average? According to my LT stats, I have 100's of books with over 400 pages.

>95 Karlstar:. Well, go look at the book on Project Gutenberg: https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/98/pg98-images.html. It's divided up into three segments (Book I, II, and III). Respectively, those books have six, twenty-four, and fifteen chapters. Dickens wrote for serialized publication with chapters coming out between April and November of 1859. He had to produce a quota of sorts but the real problem with Dickens is not the overall length of his books. The problem his sentence structure; it's far more convoluted than (some of us feel) is quite necessary). When a publisher goes to reprint a book like this, it comes down to weighing cost against readability. 9 point type takes less paper but the buyers may groan over how hard it is to read. 400 -450 pages is probably what allows you to read Dickens' text with an optimal point size.

As a contrast, Agatha Christie rarely goes much above 250 pages; some books are less than that due to wartime paper shortages.

Right now as I read The West Passage the actual text runs 366 pages with 40 lines of type per page. In the current environment, for a hardcover, the usual number of lines per page tends to be something like 32-37 lines per page. The West Passage also has a surprising number of illustrations -- some full page size dividing up the eight internal segments but in other instances, simply indicating the opening of a chapter. (He has lots and lots of chapters.) That also makes a difference in how many pages there are and what the final type size ends up being. Note that the Gutenberg version referenced above also has illustrations to break up the oceans of Dickens' text.

Page counts are somewhat misleading as an indicator. The real thing you should consider when determining how long a book will take you to read is the author's writing style. Dickens is clunky. So is Mervyn Peake. Those books you need to allow time for. Agatha Christie may be swallowed down over the course of a weekend.

This likely doesn't help you very much, but I believe the industry would tell you that in the digital age, "page creep" is not really as much of a thing as you might imagine.

>96 jillmwo: That was very helpful! With all of the formats and editions now, I see straight up page count is misleading, to some extent. Add to the confusion the ebook formats, with adjustable font size.

So thinking about this a bit more, in my head, I'm comparing 'epic' scifi and fantasy novels, many of which seem to aim for a minimum of 600 pages - Brandon Sanderson, Jordan (when he was alive), Martin, Rothfuss, Tad Williams, Janny Wurtz, Anthony Ryan, etc. Doorstops, bricks, etc. It used to be unusual for a fantasy novel to top 500 pages, now it isn't that unusual at all.

'Average' size fantasy/scifi novels now seem to come in the 400-600 page range.

To me, thinking back a few decades, the shelves were full of 'novels' in the same genres that came in under 300 pages. Many were under 200. Super long novels were rare. A Tale of Two Cities, at 470, was super long!

So this is all in my head, obviously. B&N had an ebook of Bleak House for 99 cents, so it is now on my Nook.

I want you all to know that I flipped through the Fall 2025 catalog from McFarland and there's something here for each and every one of you:

1. Agatha Christie Under the Magnifying Glass
2. Tolkien's Glee
3. The Life and Art of Thomas Nast
4. The Lizard People Don't Want You to Read This: Essays on Conspiracy Theory in Popular Culture
5. Newsies, Newsies: Read All About It
6. Uncovering the Nixon Tapes
7. Tracking the Iron Ghost: A History of the Locomotive Mississippi and Its Times, 1834 - 2025
8. The Greatest of Their Times: Comparing Baseball's Peak Performers Across Eras
9. Race and Monstrosity in Dungeons and Dragons
10. Arsenic Was Her Weapon: Women Poisoners of 19th Century Britain
11. They Come From Planet Earth: The Themes of Kaiju Cinema

No touchstones yet, but you can see the titles above.

McFarland does history, military history, pop culture, criminology, journalism and more! Go flip through their online catalog here: https://www.yumpu.com/en/document/read/70657002/fall-2025-new-books

And just as a postscript, I included the biography of Thomas Nast on the basis of the cover, because as pgmcc has repeatedly told us all, there is always an elephant. Also, the Tolkien book is about the songs that appear in LOTR and Hobbit.

Their website is here: https://mcfarlandbooks.com/. Have fun but hold on to your wallet.

>98 jillmwo:
I am glad you are supporting the “there is always an elephant” hypothesis, though the majority of people now realise that the data demonstrates that this hypothesis has been well tested and demonstrated to be true so has moved into the realm of proven fact.

Are you providing biographical details for your entry in the twenty-firstp century US version of number 10?

>99 pgmcc: The question is why you (being the trusting soul that I am sure you are) believed me when I said there was an elephant? I mean, yes, you say that the majority accept the data that there is always an elephant BUT oughtn't you to verify when someone trots out an example out of the blue?

The thing is that I'm sure there are books of interest to you that McFarland is bringing to market this fall and I think -- you of all Pub denizens -- should be buying something there. Publishers need those euros.

All of which reminds me that I may have overlooked my Thingaversary. This year, I may have to celebrate by noting all the books I am having to reread because we're having to put a new roof on the house. (Sadly needed but costly. Apparently we are no longer in compliance with the local building code. Other people put in swimming pools or completely redesign their landscaping. I have to reinstall a roof. )

>100 jillmwo:
Sorry to hear about your roof.

Regarding my trusting you and the elephant, I would trust anything you say. All the same, before I posted my response I looked up Thomas Nast and discovered he was responsible for the GOP using an elephant as their logo. I also discovered he produced a lot of anti-Irish cartoons, but I decided to ignore that.

”It’s good to trust but it’s better to verify.”

A famous actor said that.

>100 jillmwo: We may have to decide between a new roof or new A/C system. I think we will choose the A/C since there are no actual leaks yet. *knock on wood* Isn't it fun being an adult?

>100 jillmwo: I had to do that a few years ago as well. While they were at it I had them install gutters with leaf guards. So far, so good.

>102 MrsLee: Ugh, I would also make that choice.

Speaking of A/C, since ours was installed we have not needed it. I have asked for a refund but do not seem to be persuading people that they should give me one. There is no justice in this world.

>98 jillmwo: That's a lot of baseball books! Of course, I really need to find a copy of "Race and Monstrosity in Dungeons and Dragons" along with about 100 of the other books. I need more money.

After the partial roof this spring, we'll be doing the main roof soon-ish. Just had the plumber in this week for a crack in the main waste stack. Oh fun.

>105 Karlstar: I absolutely thought of you when I saw that particular title.

>102 MrsLee: and >103 clamairy: In days past, I lived in this house w/ minimal A/C and it's not fun in a summer with multiple heat waves. However, I am more worried about what happens to a shingled roof if we have a storm with shear winds or a winter that is icy. The roof guy was flipping and riffling those shingles like they were pages in a book. (Aren't they supposed to lie flat and stiff?) We have no damage as yet but if one assumes a life time of 50 years for a roof, then this one is quite overdue.

>101 pgmcc: Which actor said that? I feel like I should know that.

>106 jillmwo:
Reagan after signing a nuclear arms deal with Russia.

>106 jillmwo: I suspected as much. Who did you have in mind for #10, or are we waiting for the culprit to reveal themselves? Misdirection, perhaps?

>108 Karlstar: I thought perhaps that @clamairy as well as others would enjoy that one. I mean, I seem to recall that it was here in the Pub that folks were recommending Scalzi and The Kaiju Preservation Society.

And for the Newsies title, it's a favorite movie of one of my daughters in law and I'm checking to see whether she'd like it for Christmas.

>109 jillmwo: I missed it the first time through the list. I confess my eyeballs kept going back to the one about the lizard people...

I was told a roof can last from between 20 to 30 years if you are really lucky. If your roof is over 50 years old and it's not leaking you are very blessed.

>110 clamairy: I was told a roof can last from between 20 to 30 years if you are really lucky: that's why, in Australia, we build roofs of aluminium-coated galvanised rolled steel sheet. A properly built one is good for, oh, 50 or more years? Tiles go even longer, but are more vulnerable to strong winds.

>111 haydninvienna: Yeah we do everything cheap and fast in this country. At least they aren't using asbestos tiles on roofs anymore. My brother in New Hampshire got a beautiful shiny red vinyl roof, so he wouldn't have to use a roof rake to remove the snow anymore. The first year they had record snowfall, and it all slid right off his roof and piled up on his new deck... And the weight of the snow crushed it.

>109 jillmwo: 11 is the Kaiju one, 10 is the one about poisons. Continued misdirection, I see.

>113 Karlstar: You are developing a suspicious mind. If I told you that I wanted the #10 book for RESEARCH purposes, you wouldn't believe me.

So I finished The West Passage. I found it to be an extraordinary work of fantasy. The world-building is unlike anything I’ve read before – as if Hieronymous Bosch had chosen to use words rather than images when he pulled together ‘The Garden of Earthly Delights”. (see https://smarthistory.org/bosch-the-garden-of-earthly-delights/) The characters for the most part are not your normal humanoid bi-pedal types. Some have heads of birds and others appear to have multiple arms. The Ladies (very important in their respective Towers) are gigantic in size. The peasants are (in contrast) the little people. All dwell in a massively connected castle of five towers. The two characters whose experiences we follow are two apprentices, neither of whom have received adequate training for the roles they’re unexpectedly now to fill. They have names (Pell and Kew) but those identities are subject to change. They each undergo the Hero’s Journey, but it doesn’t unfold as one might expect. This isn’t LOTR or Star Wars. Jared Pechacek offers a much more honest account of life’s messiness and the ways in which we overcome the daily confusion. But the inherent truth of the book is that, while transformation can be sudden and dramatic, change also comes from taking very small steps in our connection with others.

The theme is one having to do with the impact of time passing and subsequent changes that are part of that.. When the stories we tell ourselves about how the world works become unhelpful, how do we deal with that? When the meaning of stories is allowed to diminish or recede, what does that do to our lives? What has to happen in our heads to begin again to make sense of the world and take action? Depending on who is telling the story, some elements get forgotten or shifted about (as people rationalize events). For me, the book comes down to an examination of what is needed when our daily mythologies have been worn threadbare? The question feels very relevant.

Pell and Kew each have a task to perform. They must leave their Tower in order to be successful in accomplishing that task. There are challenges in the form of deteriorating technology, cranky transportation, unpredictable weather changes, missing artifacts and lost knowledge. Resources are scarce. But the threat is that the Beast is stirring and one way or another, there is an obligation laid on Pell and Kew to meet the crisis.

Pechacek takes a long time getting there and this isn’t an action packed story until the final 100 pages or so when all the pieces suddenly fall together and reveal the full mosaic. The narrative can be terribly confusing, but it is a medieval world view. Pella wears a wimple. Kew acquires a squire. There are courts and palaces and talking frogs. Books are made of vellum and have lovely illustrations while documenting half truths. There’s a good deal about honey and beehives as well.

I can understand why this is up for the Ursula K. Le Guin 2025 Prize for Fiction. The prose is not necessarily lyrical but it is extraordinary and demands attention from the reader. The prize is give to "realists of a larger reality, who can imagine real grounds for hope and see alternatives to how we live now." I’ve read only one of the other competitor titles in 2025 - Nighi Vo’s The City in Glass. The narrative in that one is much easier to follow by the distracted reader, but Pechacek’s narrative is sufficiently striking that the reader may be quite willing to slow down in order to absorb the tale's message. Quite a memorable journey is to be had as you read.

>115 jillmwo: Jill, your touchstone goes to a book by V S Naipaul.

>115 jillmwo: Sounds fascinating - you had me at this:

"The world-building is unlike anything I’ve read before – as if Hieronymous Bosch had chosen to use words rather than images when he pulled together ‘The Garden of Earthly Delights”.

As someone once said, "Now, that's just crazy." 🤪

On my TBR list.

>115 jillmwo: Did you say Hieronymous Bosch in words? Amazing, I am very interested.

I am sorry to hear about your roof troubles!

>116 haydninvienna: Fixed it. Thank you!!

>115 jillmwo: Moving my copy up the TBR pile as I read your review!

Yesterday I was part of a group discussing The Fifth Elephant by Terry Pratchett. My Discworld reading is a bit scattershot and as a result I don’t always remember the relationships between characters. But this featured a lot about Vimes (not sure whether his proper honorific in this context should be Mr or Sir or Excellency/Ambassador) and Lady Sybil, another character I find myself fond of. And the Igors made me giggle (at least mentally…). I find the juxtaposition of trolls, dwarfs, and werewolves to be a bit confusing but I think I did for the most part get Pratchett’s intent.

But there is one significant question. There were references to Uncle Vanya (his grumpy trousers?) and to the three sisters in The Cherry Tree. However, I could not make head nor tail of the references in context. Nor am I apt to plunge into a study of Chekov. What was the point being made? Anyone have an idea?

Oh, and I did enjoy the two or three brief scenes with Death in them...

>122 jillmwo: I cannot help you, being completely unfamiliar with Chekov's plays. However, your post is a good reminder of the many layers of thought and meaning in Pratchett's books. As an American, even one who reads a lot of British literature, I constantly have the feeling that I'm missing references. I still love the books though.

>122 jillmwo: Here's the annotations for The Fifth Elephant: https://www.lspace.org/books/apf/the-fifth-elephant.html

Uncle Vanya is the other great Chekhov play. "Gloomy and purposeless" sums up much Chekhovian drama quite accurately. The Russian word is "toska" -- a sort of weary, faded ennui.

Not sure if that helps at all.

@MrsLee - There are annotations for all the Discworld books. They typically go over all the references/jokes that Terry was using at the time.

>124 Narilka: Has anyone told you yet today that you may qualify as an information goddess? I had no idea that there was a site like that in existence!!!

>125 jillmwo: Awww :)

>124 Narilka: At one time I frequented them, but if I do that, I like to do it when I'm actually reading the book.

A Case of Mice and Murder

In one of his 2025 reading threads, @pgmcc wrote that he found this “engrossing, entertaining and educational. It is a murder mystery entwined with a literary puzzle and the dual challenge made the book very entertaining.”

Like Peter, I too found this an entertaining mystery. But in my review, I would use alliteration to note that it was charming, courtly, and compelling. All this in large part because Gabriel Ward KC is himself such a charming man. When he finds a dead body (barefoot) on the doorstep, it is awkward. When he is subsequently drafted by a legal superior to quietly investigate the circumstances under which the body got there, it becomes even more awkward. But Gabriel Ward is able to unravel the tangled mess and identify the murderer while also emerging victorious against a learned friend and colleague in a client’s arcane matter of intellectual property.

Characterization is excellent. The deft touches of humor as well as the pacing of events work well. It’s comfortably cozy but not twee. (As to the puzzle element, admittedly, I was so charmed by the characters that I didn’t particularly focus on working out the murder, but I had no real quibble with the final revelation of the guilty.)

There’s a strong flavor of the Christie tradition in the set-up of this book. A restricted set of suspects in a well-defined community, a memorable sleuth, and plausible circumstances surrounding the death. Gabriel Ward reminds me very much of Agatha Christie’s character, Mr. Satterthwaite who appears in The Mysterious Mr. Quin and in Three Act Tragedy. The two men are by no means identical but they do share certain characteristics. They each have a certain Edwardian courtesy to their manner. They move in the best of social circles. They are both able to sympathize with innocent, good-hearted souls who find themselves caught up in unhappy events.

I agree with Peter. This one is highly recommended and I will try to pre-order the next in the series as soon as they allow access to those of us living in colonial backwaters

>128 jillmwo:
I love your review.

A Month in the Country

This one was a relatively soothing read – a young veteran (suffering from PTSD) has returned from the trenches of World War I. He arrives at a small village, OxGodby, with the job of restoring a wall mural in a small church. The local vicar is somewhat disgruntled that a donor’s legacy is going to this particular activity rather than to the charity he’d sought. A second veteran is working in the nearby field on an archaeological dig. The two form a friendship as they each “camp out” in their respective work sites. Birkin works to restore a medieval masterpiece - a fresco depicting “the smug souls of the righteous trooping off-stage north to heaven… and the Damned dropping (normally head-first) into the bonfire.” The people of OxGodby slowly accept the presence of these strangers, moving through the transition of seasons.

The subtext of the novella (as I read it at least) has to do with how societies perceive wrong-doing and apportion judgement for those actions. On what grounds do we condemn some souls to heaven and others to hell? As Birkin notes, one of his ideas of hell was his experience at the Battle of Passchendaele. But apart from warfare, what is viewed as being “wrong”? Those who believe in a different Deity? Those who fall in love outside the norm? Across the centuries, ideas of evil change. That being the case, how do we view judgement by the Church and of the clergy?

It’s a lovely novella, just as @Sakerfalcon had promised me at some point. There are bits of humor and bits of sadness, but nothing overwhelms.

>130 jillmwo: Oh! Going on the Libby wishlist forthwith! Thank you Jill and Claire.

P.S. The order I was supposed to receive this past Wednesday was somehow LOST in transit (whether due to weather or lack of oversight is unknown). The refund is being processed. But this means I am faced with a bit of a conundrum. What shall I read next?

Yesterday consisted of three Zoom sessions (which was a trifle over my limit). I need some degree of respite. (On the upside, they relieved me of Monday's jury duty obligation. I wonder if minor flooding at the courthouse might have been the cause.)

>132 jillmwo:
Glad to hear you have been excused jury duty. I was called once and the court sessions for the week were cancelled. Since then I have passed the age limit for jury duty.

>128 jillmwo: This looks intriguing - if I need another series to read. I'll keep it in mind.

>124 Narilka: Oh, thanks. Very useful; I often feel like I'm missing obvious references. It took me so long to discover that his 'underground sound of rushing water' (or something like that) meant an insurance agent.

I'm now over the age limit for compulsory jury duty but could choose to serve. I got a jury notice not long after we arrived here, but as a full-time carer it would have been extremely awkward for me to serve, so I exercised my right to opt out.

>135 haydninvienna: I did the same thing a few years before my husband passed. They were very understanding in Connecticut. I don't think there is an upper age limit in the state of New York.

>135 haydninvienna: and >136 clamairy: I am not sure of all available exemptions but, based on my conversations with various entities, the only way I could legitimately get out of it would be a note from my doctor. (My old doctor would have been willing to sign a form to the state indicating that I have a physical disability and the associated tag for the car that goes along with that designation, but more is required to eliminate one's name from the pool of potential juror pool.)

>137 jillmwo: Oh, I think you should just bring along some of your books with the word POISONS prominently displayed in the title when they call you in for jury selection. Or just yell out "Off with their heads!" to every question they ask you.

>138 clamairy:
I think Jill is talking about getting out of jury duty, not presenting evidence that might result in her being charged with serious crimes.

>139 pgmcc: Well, I suspect it would work. I doubt they'd insist that she serve the duty if she was being charged.

>140 humouress: Interesting approach. Confess to the crime to avoid jury duty. It might just work.

>139 pgmcc: But if she shows up once behaving in the manner I suggested not only will she be immediately excused, she'll be permanently banned from ever serving again.

>138 clamairy: >139 pgmcc: >140 humouress: You have all added immeasurably to the light-heartedness of the day. I was snorting into my coffee as I read and I*particularly* like the idea of responding to attorney questions with the consistent hollering of "Off With Their Heads!". I shall try doing that with the spouse.

But even so, my dear >138 clamairy:, I'm afraid that would be insufficient to eliminate the chance of being selected for a jury. Much better (in my view) to resemble in some form that fragile, faintly ditzy sort of old lady likely to hold up any speedy deliberations by asking irrelevant questions of the bailiff (about his or her gun), the judge, and/or the jury foreperson. As for displaying the titles of books about poisons, that won't help if the actual murder was committed by using a knife.

My image will continue in the public mind as being one of an upright member of the community, hardly plausible as a suspected killer through the use of comestibles.

As further proof of refinement, I did consider the idea of reading and commenting on John Milton and Paradise Lost . At some point today, AMZ is supposed to show up with a copy of Tolkien's Faith: A Spiritual Biography. I really am that soul who pursues only that which may prove edifying.

Meanwhile, there's something on the bunsen burner that requires my attention. Amuse yourselves with this round-up of murder mysteries, many of which feature elderly ladies doing wicked things: https://thecritic.co.uk/murders-for-august-5/

>143 jillmwo: So you'd be Miss Climpson, as in Strong Poison Seems appropriate.

>144 haydninvienna: It's the Episcopalian in me. The language found in the Book of Common Prayer creates these invisible bonds.

Seen in a post by Hesperus Press on Bluesky:

Word of the Day: oubliette

(noun) A secret dungeon with an opening only at the top. From French 'oublier' : to forget.

📚 In a sentence:
My unread books live in an oubliette of good intentions.

>146 jillmwo:
There have been a few oubliettes in the locations I have visited in France. One tosses people one doesn’t like into the oubliette and forgets about them.

>147 pgmcc:. So kind of what happens with ebooks left too long on a Kindle?

Another interesting item from the London Review of Books:

Ambitious collections that centred on the kinds of books that Petrarch and Niccoli had collected began to take shape in the middle of the 15th century. They usually sprang up inside ecclesiastical institutions, but did not serve their ends exclusively. What began as a new library for a Franciscan convent in Cesena, in Emilia-Romagna, turned into an innovative library shaped like a basilica but configured, with rows of desks, for study rather than prayer. It was a church of learning, lit by high windows on both sides and open to the whole city. The Vatican Library, founded at the same time by Pope Nicholas V, occupied a set of four rooms, each with its own purpose. It too was open, if not to the public, at least to all members of the papal curia. And it too was a secular, humanistic collection inside an ecclesiastical institution. It soon became an intellectual adventure playground where readers could encounter stunning texts that had been inaccessible for centuries...

. This is a piece written by Anthony Grafton and the title of the review is "No Cheese Please". I assume this will grab the attention of Pub participants.

Full text available (no paywall) here: https://www.lrb.co.uk/the-paper/v47/n13/anthony-grafton/no-cheese-please

>147 pgmcc: *gulp* Do you visit the oubliettes often?

>148 jillmwo: Just out of curiosity, as I don't have time to click on the link right now, were women allowed into either of these places?

>148 jillmwo: Oooo, I now have a name for my Kindle. Oubliette.

>151 MrsLee: LOL :o)

>151 MrsLee: The customer service guys at AMZ may wonder about that choice, but hey...

>150 clamairy: Given that he was talking about libraries during the middle of the 15th century, I'm guessing probably not.

>149 humouress: I rather suspect that >147 pgmcc: only goes to check in on -- ahem -- "certain guests" of a particular sovereign nation.

>148 jillmwo:
So kind of what happens with ebooks left too long on a Kindle?

Exactly!
@MrsLee has the right idea as expressed in >151 MrsLee:.

>149 humouress:
That would be telling.

>150 clamairy:
I suspect you know the answer to that question.

>148 jillmwo: & >150 clamairy:
The secular libraries in ecclesiastic settings remind me of the secular monasteries in Neal Stephenson's Anathem.

>155 pgmcc: I was about 99% sure what the answer would be.

>156 clamairy: I really need to give that book a go. The find the size of his works intimidating.

>156 clamairy: Stevenson's books tend to be intimidating :) But Anathem was fascinating, fun, and rewarding, once I got into it.

>157 Alexandra_book_life: I have a physical copy somewhere, but I think I will try this on the Kindle so I don't have to haul it around.

>158 clamairy: Good thinking. FWIW, I too have never attempted Neil Stephenson. On some level, I have always found his stuff to be intimidating. Like, y'know, Stuff Requiring Thought.

For all you Dickens fans out there: https://www.charlesdickensillustration.org/ From their intro page

Here you will find over 2000 illustrations taken from the most important (and interesting) illustrated editions of Charles Dickens's works from 1836 to 1912 (the centenary of Dickens's birth). The Gallery contains all the original illustrations, the Household Edition (the first edition commissioned by Dickens's publishers Chapman and Hall after his death and the first to feature all-new illustrations), the Library Edition from 1910 with five hundred illustrations by Harry Furniss, and the "Pears" Edition of the Christmas Books from 1912.

>160 jillmwo: Ooh! Thanks for this. I will wait until I'm at my PC to look.

Edited to add: Love these! Thank you again!

>160 jillmwo:
Jill, thank you for sharing this resource. I know how much you detest Dickens so I greatly appreciate the sacrifice you made to source and share this link. Thank you so much.

>160 jillmwo: That's great, thank you!

>160 jillmwo: Wonderful! Thank you thank you :)

For those of you celebrating the anniversary of Jane Austen's birth, there is a lovely essay to be enjoyed here: https://lithub.com/what-jane-austens-possessions-reveal-about-her-literary-ethos...

>165 jillmwo: Thanks, I will save this for later!

Non-essential factoid gleaned from reading Alan Jacobs' Paradise Lost: A Biography. At the age of fifteen, John Milton wrote poetic versions of two Psalms found in the Bible (114 and 136). Both may be found in Dartmouth University's digital collection, the John Milton Reading Room (https://milton.host.dartmouth.edu/reading_room/paraphrase_114/text.shtml AND https://milton.host.dartmouth.edu/reading_room/psalm_136/text.shtml)

Jacobs is always quite readable.

>165 jillmwo: Wonderful! I am saving this for later as well :) Thank you!

I am not dead yet, but reading is on the back burner. Life has suddenly entered that phase where one just says "It's Complicated". One son made flying visit home today and departs tomorrow. Tomorrow's schedule has a book group in the afternoon. I have to submit a proposal in response to a consulting opportunity by Wednesday. Roofers are now coming to do the work on Thursday.

>169 jillmwo:
Sending you support and hoping you find the energy to meet all the complications and twists and turns that confront you.
Wishing you well.

>169 jillmwo: Sounds like fun. Mostly. Wishing you fine, dry weather for the roofers.

>169 jillmwo: Sounds like some hustle and bustle, in a good way. Enjoy your son's visit!

Good luck with the consulting opportunity, and wishing you an uneventful roofing job.

>169 jillmwo: I'm glad you got to see your son! I'm sorry all the other stuff seems to be piling up at once, though.
Breathe.

>169 jillmwo: I hope the visit went well and his travel is trouble-free. The same with the roofing!

>169 jillmwo: Breathe... I am glad you had a visit from you son.

I hope the "It's Complicated" phase will be over soon.

>169 jillmwo: I hope everything goes well and that life settles down soon.

In case no one else here in the Pub has posted this -- the Hugo Award Winners have been announced. https://seattlein2025.org/wsfs/hugo-awards/winners-and-stats/ For those of you who read it, The Tainted Cup won! Yay!! Also Moniquill Blackgoose for her novel, To Shape A Dragon's Breath got the Astounding Award, formerly known as the John Campbell award for new writers.

Thank you all for the kind thoughts about my complicated life. I don't deserve too much sympathy and I won't die from it. I've been deeply and wickedly slothful lately and it's time for me to get back up and begin engaging with real life. Leaving the house occasionally would be a positive step in the right direction. (We did go out to meals three times in a row while my son was down.)

ETA: One highlight of the weekend was a massive slice of Guiness chocolate cake. At least, 2000 calories all at one go I'm sure.

>177 jillmwo: So glad The tainted cup finally got the recognition it deserves! I really need to read To shape a dragon's breath, it's been on Mount TBR for a while.

>177 jillmwo: Oh, Yay! That is good news.

Also, you deserved every bite of that chocolate cake!

>177 jillmwo:
I have The Tainted Cup as the result of a fusillade of BBs from various snipers here in the GD. Now that it is a Hugo winner I will have to make haste to read it.

>177 jillmwo: What Peter said. I need to catch up. I have read a few new releases lately, just not the right ones.

Roofers are here and making a fair amount of noise. Spouse is not happy, being irritated because it was supposed to be a "one day to completion" thing, but now, due to impending wind and rain from Hurricane Erin, now it will be two days before completion. I pointed out to him that I don't like people being up on the roof in those types of weather conditions because it's a liability thing. Crossing fingers that things will not go further awry. (We have a lot of "things" in modern life.) But he's murfling and grumbling.

By the way, I did finally post a review about the most recent book club selection.

>182 jillmwo: Uh-oh... Too late to dawn the Kevlar now.

Edited to add: It's already on my Libby Wishlist.

Okay.. Spouse is SERIOUSLY ticked off. The job was supposed to be done in one day (work begins at 7:30, done by 4pm). The crew however just packed up at 12 or 12:30 and left for the day. Half the roof is done, but they claim that the second half of the job is more complex due to dormers. We got on the horn to the office and pointed out that the two guys who came out to do the pre-assessment had to have been aware that the dormers were there. (Not something one whips out out of a closet and attaches on the spur of the moment.) And we have this awful massive and ugly BIN (the right word is eluding me) with a bunch of debris sitting in our driveway. We can't park the car because of the location of the DUMPSTER. (Yes, word came back.)

But from Day One, even before we got to the point of a written quote, every roof guy that we spoke with had told us that the roof on a house this size was a one-day thing. Pure and simple. All of our arrangements had been made with that understanding. Patrick has already called the contact at the head office and is following up with email account of when work started, weather conditions, etc. To be fair, the work that did get done looks very good and they did go round the yard with one of the metal detector things for picking up nails.

(Perhaps this is the time for a round of "Am I the Idiot Here" because we didn't insist on a written clause in the contract specifying that the work would be done in a single day.) But Patrick is thoroughly put out.

One passing thought: If you want photos of glamorous international locations, you have to read the threads of people like @pgmcc, @haydninvienna and @hfglen. All I can offer is kvetching w/o the graphics.

>184 jillmwo: Hopefully they come back and finish the job in a timely fashion and don't charge for hours not worked. Looks like you are tracking their time carefully.

>185 jillmwo: No longer, in my case, unless I start digging into the archive ... And what Jim said.

>184 jillmwo: I feel for you. Just a word in passing; don't put all your faith in the metal detectors. Keep a careful eye out for nails. We found them for months after the crew "picked them all up with the metal detector."

>188 MrsLee: Same! I don't think my roof guys even used metal detectors. They had put tarps all around on the ground for the old roofing tiles, but there were holes in those tarps. My brother came to visit a few days later with his detector, and scanned the perimeter of the house. He found plenty of nails, and a couple of jagged strips of metal.

>185 jillmwo: >187 haydninvienna: Me too; I've been mining the archive for some considerable time. And I'll join in Jim's chorus.

>189 clamairy: Stupidest/most careless roofers: my late second wife worked for a law firm whose offices were in a garden street in an inner north suburb of Canberra. The firm had a large carport built behind the building, and one night when she was working late I picked her up from there in the car and got a pop rivet shank in a tyre. Of course the roofers had fastened the roof deck down with pop rivets and just dropped the used shanks. Lots of them.

>186 Karlstar: >187 haydninvienna: >188 MrsLee: >189 clamairy: >190 hfglen: and >191 haydninvienna:. Thank you all for the cautionary warning. I will make sure my husband is made aware of the global inadequacies of the metal detector promise. It's been that kind of week. Oh, and I've got a stinkin' suspicion that the consultant thing will not materialize. Dagnabbit.

So back to the books. Let me share one brief quote that indicates the vivid quality of Charles Williams’ poetry:

Taliessin walked in the palace yard;
he saw, under a guard, a girl sit in the stocks.
The stable-slaves, lounging by the gate,
cried catcalls and mocks, flung roots and skins of fruits.
She, rigid on the hard bench, disdained
motion, her cheek stained with a bruise, veined
with fury her forehead. The guard laughed and chaffed;
when Taliessin stepped near, he leapt to a rigid salute.

Kevin Kelly on the topic of self-publishing. https://kk.org/thetechnium/everything-i-know-about-self-publishing/.

>192 jillmwo: Sorry to hear the consulting opportunity didn't work out.

>194 Karlstar: Truth be told, I had mixed feelings about it. It might have been interesting. OTOH, in my opinion, they really could benefit from someone with a different set of LIS skills.

On Book Banning by Ira Wells

Cheating here and just answering the four questions that have become accepted canon here in the Pub.

Was it immersive? I don’t tend to characterize non-fiction as immersive, but this treatment of a sensitive topic is compelling in its presentation. The book is a fresh examination of how humans try to control each other by gate-keeping knowledge -- which is what qualifies it as compelling.

Is it memorable? Generally speaking, yes. It’s short and therefore digestible. Marjorie Garber made many of the same arguments in The Use and Abuse of Literature but Wells’ prose is a bit less formal in tone.

Will I read it again? Probably – because it’s good to continually remind oneself.

To whom would I recommend this book? A host of people
-- To high school seniors and college first years as they embark on becoming an adult. “Steer towards the middle” is a useful mantra. And because exposure to a broad range of books is a good way of understanding the human experience.
-- To politicians, because a career in public service frequently requires the same mantra.
-- To highly moral people, because it’s useful to remember that sex and obscenity are not inextricably tied.
-- To parents sending their child off to first grade as a reminder that the point of school is not to necessarily preserve wide-eyed innocence.
-- To those assembling raffle prize baskets. A coffee mug, a nice bookmark, a book light,and this title will keep someone stimulated for an entire weekend.
-- To everyone here in the Pub: Because we all benefit from a refresher course on why censorship is counter-productive. Reading must be a highly individualized form of instruction.

And though he'll likely never know it, my thanks go to Michael Dirda for his review of this particular title in the Washington Post last month.

>196 jillmwo: Your touchstone appears to be pointing to the wrong book.

You had me at "short" and "digestible."

>197 clamairy: Thank you. I fixed the touchstone. It's worth your time and attention.

>198 jillmwo: I found it on Hoopla, and I added it to my wish list. I will try to get to it sooner rather than later, considering the state of things these days.

>196 jillmwo: That sounds eminently worth reading, but it's not just books. You remind me of when, in about 1964, the Broederbond made the SABC ban the Beatles. They effectively killed Springbok Radio as a way of communicating to teens, caused the sales of Beatles records to go through the roof, and made the fortune of LM Radio (whose programs were taped in Johannesburg and broadcast from Lourenço Marques (now Maputo). Also more than one author stating as plainly as can be that they wanted to get their latest book banned in order to boost sales, something the narrow-minded book banners lacked the wit to understand.

Ooh, look! Shiny distraction... Did you know that hebenon - the poison referenced in Hamlet as being that used by Claudius to kill Hamlet's father -- has never been identified as being a real poison. Some experts think it's henbane; others think it something Shakespeare just made up.

I've got Kenneth Branagh's Hamlet on in the background and this was the first time it ever occurred to me to look up the particular poison. I am charmed. A creative genius might build up an entire mystery series using just this poison as the means of murder. I feel certain Christie might have been able to do so.

>201 jillmwo:
So, what are the imaginary symptoms of this imaginary poison before one dies?

>202 pgmcc: Talking to bones, maybe? Hallucinations?

>202 pgmcc: and >203 Karlstar: Well, Shakespeare indicates one side effect as some form of crustiness appearing on the skin. But if you pour the poison directly into the human ear, there's immediate (or close-to-immediate) death. Those scholars who have looked into this second symptom believe the impact is most harsh on those who have experienced some degree of hearing loss.

If you go with the theory that Shakespeare really meant henbane, WebMD as a relatively reliable source indicates that "High doses of henbane can cause overheating, reduced sweating, vision disturbances, increased heart rate, urination problems, drowsiness, restlessness, hallucinations, delirium, manic episodes, and death." As is so frequently the case, a lot depends on how much you ingest. So, while there is no mention of the urge to engage in dialogue with skulls, >203 Karlstar: hallucinations are a possibility.

Shifting gears again. I started reading The Demon of Unrest by Erik Larson last night. It's about the take over of Fort Sumter as the initial event of the Civil War in 1860.

>204 jillmwo:
Thank you for your erudite description of the symptoms. I knew you would be up to speed on the effects of all forms of poison.

>204 jillmwo: The Demon of Unrest sounds like a good one.

>205 pgmcc: I suspected she would be as well. :o)

A Drop of Corruption

Two nights ago, I finished A Drop of Corruption at bedtime, the sequel to the Hugo Award winning book, The Tainted Cup. Ana and Din are called to the territory of Yarrow to investigate a peculiar death of a Treasury officer. Following a quick visit to an Imperial vault and a safebox, the man disappears from his room, leaving little behind but the bloody sheet is suspicious. As the investigation progresses, the number of suspicious deaths (by poison as well as other means) rise.

Robert Jackson Bennett has created interesting social and physical environments; advanced technologies and enhancements of one world must be balanced off against dangerous geographical and ecological conditions. We learn more in this novel about the Empire, its industries, its political and financial maneuverings. We encounter oath coins and Pithian lyres, while gleans details of the back stories of Din and Ana. There is scientific sophistication, but there is also filth and misery. There are princes and kings in Yarrow, but there are also those inside and outside of the palace who can't be trusted.

I’ve read two novels by Robert Jackson Bennett in the past two months and they’ve both been remarkable reading experiences. Note: Back in June, Haydninvienna noted about this book that one should not skip the Author’s Note at the end. He’s right. Both this and The Tainted Cup will be among my favorite reads of 2025.

So there's another BB shot off.

>208 jillmwo: Thanks, I will plan on reading that one sometime after I finish The Tainted Cup.

Continuing this reading thread over here: https://www.librarything.com/topic/373353 A nice new shiny thread, full of reading recommendations and shiny distractions.

>177 jillmwo: Oh to shape a Dragons breath is fantastic and well worth reading Yeah I'm eagerly awaiting the sequel that should be coming out soon