1timspalding
LibraryThing is adding a "copies" system. "Copies" are for when you have two or more copies of the same book. One can, of course, have two "books" within the LibraryThing system now--two items with different pages, details, reviews tags, etc.--but copies provides a different way—a single "book" in your catalog, with one page, one line in "Your books," but with multiple "copies." Each copy can have a different barcode, and different "copy notes."
The concept here is from libraries. When your local public library buys new James Patterson, they add the record only once, but add as many "copies" as they have. Many TinyCat libraries would like to do the same.
At present, copes are only in LibraryThing, and are NOT integrated into the lending/circulation/check-out system on either LibraryThing or TinyCat. "Copies" are a big change, so we're rolling it out in stages. Once we're satisfied that things are working well and members are happy, we'll move onto the next steps!
What's a Copy?
At present, two fields are now "copy" fields—barcodes and item notes. The former has been around for a long time--if you had a barcode, it is now the barcode for copy 1. The latter is a new field. It's a free place to write notes about the condition, where you got it, what it means to you, etc.
If You Don't Like It
How We Converted
Editing/Adding/Deleting Copies
You can add, edit, delete and renumber copies on your book's edit page, or in the catalog, from the "copies," "barcodes" or "copy notes" fields. See some of the images below for what it looks like.
Questions You May Have
Q: What about works?
A: Copies are not intended to be used when you have two different editions of the same work. You can use them that way, but there's only one set of all the regular data (ISBN, cover, publisher, etc.), and it will belong to one edition, not many.
Q: Copies should also have…
A: Members will probably want other copy-specific fields, such as call numbers, prices and condition. Our ears are open to what you want, but we feel strongly that an "item notes" field is flexible enough for most users.
Q: What about lending?
A: At present, the lending/circulation/check-out system is not copy-aware. To be precise, you are always lending copy 1. But, yes, this is definitely something we want to implement soon! We will do so when we feel confident this change went through well.
The concept here is from libraries. When your local public library buys new James Patterson, they add the record only once, but add as many "copies" as they have. Many TinyCat libraries would like to do the same.
At present, copes are only in LibraryThing, and are NOT integrated into the lending/circulation/check-out system on either LibraryThing or TinyCat. "Copies" are a big change, so we're rolling it out in stages. Once we're satisfied that things are working well and members are happy, we'll move onto the next steps!
What's a Copy?
At present, two fields are now "copy" fields—barcodes and item notes. The former has been around for a long time--if you had a barcode, it is now the barcode for copy 1. The latter is a new field. It's a free place to write notes about the condition, where you got it, what it means to you, etc.
If You Don't Like It
- The book edit page has a new "copies" section. If you don't like it, I've added a second feature, where you can collapse sections on the edit page. See https://www.librarything.com/topic/383565
- If you really don't like it, you can go to Other Settings > I don't want this feature! > Disable "copies" system here https://www.librarything.com/settings/other
How We Converted
- Books were given copies by looking at the current "Copies" field. If that was one, one copy was added, if two, two copies, etc.
- If a book had no copies, no copies were added.
- If a book had no copies, but it had a barcode, we added a copy, as barcodes have always been part of our hidden copy system, and it doesn't make sense for a book to have a barcode but no copies. If it makes sense to you, you can turn off the system (above).
- If a book had more than 20 copies (very rare), we reduced it to 20 copies and sent the member a note about it, giving the old value. There were books where the "copies" field had 10,000 or more! We assume they are errors. (If you really have 10,000 copies of a book, go ahead and switch the system off.)
- Unless disabled, the bare, numeric "copies" field is now uneditable. It's a count of your copies.
Editing/Adding/Deleting Copies
You can add, edit, delete and renumber copies on your book's edit page, or in the catalog, from the "copies," "barcodes" or "copy notes" fields. See some of the images below for what it looks like.
Questions You May Have
Q: What about works?
A: Copies are not intended to be used when you have two different editions of the same work. You can use them that way, but there's only one set of all the regular data (ISBN, cover, publisher, etc.), and it will belong to one edition, not many.
Q: Copies should also have…
A: Members will probably want other copy-specific fields, such as call numbers, prices and condition. Our ears are open to what you want, but we feel strongly that an "item notes" field is flexible enough for most users.
Q: What about lending?
A: At present, the lending/circulation/check-out system is not copy-aware. To be precise, you are always lending copy 1. But, yes, this is definitely something we want to implement soon! We will do so when we feel confident this change went through well.
2timspalding
Update: It's live. Working on kinks.
3anglemark
On the book edit page, you are reusing the word Copy from elsewhere (in 'Copy n'), which doesn't work for Swedish (and I'm sure other languages). We have two different words for copy in "Oh my god, he's a perfect copy of his cousin!" and "6,000 copies were printed".
4JonathonL88
Is copy note field searchable? as in
https://wiki.librarything.com/index.php/%22Your_books%22_Search
or sortable as in column sort in list view
If not, can you please make it so.............please
https://wiki.librarything.com/index.php/%22Your_books%22_Search
or sortable as in column sort in list view
If not, can you please make it so.............please
5JonathonL88
I collect cookbooks.
Those I particularly like, I buy extra copies to give as presents. I use LT to record who gets what and to avoid giving the same present twice. Should I make the EXTRA copy note field a way of showing this?
Those I particularly like, I buy extra copies to give as presents. I use LT to record who gets what and to avoid giving the same present twice. Should I make the EXTRA copy note field a way of showing this?
6gilroy
Will there be a way to merge records into a single line for those of us who have multiple of the same work cataloged for the sake of multiple copies?
7DarlaReadsBarefooted
Please helps! While this sounds cool. I'm a new member who had spent more than a week entering my personal library and then, at almost the same time you were working on this function, when I was at more than 2500 books entered, suddenly all the web shows is 500 or so books. Please help!
And thank you for all you do here!
And thank you for all you do here!
8timspalding
>3 anglemark: On the book edit page, you are reusing the word Copy from elsewhere (in 'Copy n'), which doesn't work for Swedish (and I'm sure other languages). We have two different words for copy in "Oh my god, he's a perfect copy of his cousin!" and "6,000 copies were printed".
Thanks. Give it 10m, but I have clarified all uses of copies across LibraryThing, so the strings should now be:
Thanks. Give it 10m, but I have clarified all uses of copies across LibraryThing, so the strings should now be:
9timspalding
>4 JonathonL88: Is copy note field searchable?
Not yet. Nor does it export. But I'll get to it. I tend to want to wait a few days before adding fields to the search index, because it's a much harder to change, if changes are needed.
Not yet. Nor does it export. But I'll get to it. I tend to want to wait a few days before adding fields to the search index, because it's a much harder to change, if changes are needed.
10timspalding
>7 DarlaReadsBarefooted: Your books are all there now. There was some sort of blip that set a memory cache of them to the wrong number. I'll see if I can dig into it, but in any case they were never not there on the disk.
11timspalding
>6 gilroy: Will there be a way to merge records into a single line for those of us who have multiple of the same work cataloged for the sake of multiple copies?
Yeah. I'm open to ideas on how to implement this. We have a work-duplicates page ( https://www.librarything.com/stats/MEMBER/workdups ). I'm think we could have a page that shows you books that are identical? Or perhaps it can show all fields that diverge between two books? Then let you combine them, giving you an easy way to add a note?
Yeah. I'm open to ideas on how to implement this. We have a work-duplicates page ( https://www.librarything.com/stats/MEMBER/workdups ). I'm think we could have a page that shows you books that are identical? Or perhaps it can show all fields that diverge between two books? Then let you combine them, giving you an easy way to add a note?
12Maddz
I'm in the case of slowly transitioning a paper library into a digital library, and I often have multiple copies of the same work which are in different formats.
What I'd like to see is an entry for the most recently added format followed by 'You have x other editions: format 1, format 2 etc'. Or if you have exactly the same edition 'You have y copies of this edition'. Each different format should be clickable to go to the specific entry.
However, you should be able to set specific collections to not be included in this: so my 'Deaccessioned' collection or my Wishlist (not that I use it) or a 'Read but not owned' collection shouldn't count towards work duplicates.
What I'd like to see is an entry for the most recently added format followed by 'You have x other editions: format 1, format 2 etc'. Or if you have exactly the same edition 'You have y copies of this edition'. Each different format should be clickable to go to the specific entry.
However, you should be able to set specific collections to not be included in this: so my 'Deaccessioned' collection or my Wishlist (not that I use it) or a 'Read but not owned' collection shouldn't count towards work duplicates.
13quaeker.org
I am extremly happy to see that change towards WEMI. So first of all I want to thank you for your work, and also for the carefull way to roll it out. I still had a small hart attack today when I wanted to quick edit a barcode.
I am managing a library with two "branches" in different cities and a storage. So far we have catalogued 1600 of about 5000 books (not started on the storage yet), we often have 2 or 3 copies of a work - the link provided above says about 220 books with 2-3 copies each, which sounds about right. As we circulate (via TinyCat) and need different barcodes (which also designate where the copy is to be found) I did not use the old copy-numbers system, but painstakingly made individual entries.
I would like to echo JonathanL88's suggetion about making the note field searchable and sortable and gillroys request about a merging mechanism. If I were to switch to the new system (which sounds lovely but scares me a bit!), I would need exactly these changes
- a simple but controlled way to merge (as in: react to suggestions, but I want to verify myself)
- a place to put item (copy) specific information, which so far was to be stored as a tag with the respective copy, that would need to be search- and sortable to not break my workflow
- using it within tinycat - I heard this is planned, it would be a non negotiable need for me. this would also include making the item (copy) specific note field searchable and "clickable" in tiny cat
Also, we are using the collections as marker of the physical location of the book. That means I would need to be able to set different collections for different copies.
So I dont really have any concrete suggestions or insights, but wanted to thank you and add my voice to the sensible requests, and offer to test/give feedback.
(PS I hope this is all clear, as I am not a native speaker)
I am managing a library with two "branches" in different cities and a storage. So far we have catalogued 1600 of about 5000 books (not started on the storage yet), we often have 2 or 3 copies of a work - the link provided above says about 220 books with 2-3 copies each, which sounds about right. As we circulate (via TinyCat) and need different barcodes (which also designate where the copy is to be found) I did not use the old copy-numbers system, but painstakingly made individual entries.
I would like to echo JonathanL88's suggetion about making the note field searchable and sortable and gillroys request about a merging mechanism. If I were to switch to the new system (which sounds lovely but scares me a bit!), I would need exactly these changes
- a simple but controlled way to merge (as in: react to suggestions, but I want to verify myself)
- a place to put item (copy) specific information, which so far was to be stored as a tag with the respective copy, that would need to be search- and sortable to not break my workflow
- using it within tinycat - I heard this is planned, it would be a non negotiable need for me. this would also include making the item (copy) specific note field searchable and "clickable" in tiny cat
Also, we are using the collections as marker of the physical location of the book. That means I would need to be able to set different collections for different copies.
So I dont really have any concrete suggestions or insights, but wanted to thank you and add my voice to the sensible requests, and offer to test/give feedback.
(PS I hope this is all clear, as I am not a native speaker)
14DarlaReadsBarefooted
>10 timspalding: You rock! thank you!
15kristilabrie
>1 timspalding: Issue: IF I delete a copy for an item that has 2+ copies, the deleted barcode does not get archived on the /settings/barcodes page as it normally would have. They would have gone into an "Inactive Barcodes" section, with the option to "free up" that barcode number.
BUT I can now assign that deleted barcode onto another book. THEN if I search for that barcode, I get a whacky SQL error on the catalog page. (Presumably because the barcode is now tied to two books.)**
To reproduce:
1. Add a book
2. Add a 2nd copy to that book. Make sure both copies have barcode numbers.
3. Delete Copy 1. (Check and verify: /settings/barcodes page doesn't have the newly deleted barcode in the "Inactive Barcodes" section)
4. Assign the recently deleted barcode from Step 3 onto a different book.
5. Search for the barcode in your catalog.
Issue: SQL error, presumably because the barcode is now tied to two separate books.**
Edit: something resolved itself, so I'm testing further.
**Okay, after a few minutes I searched again and it only found the last book I added 462 to. Maybe a timing thing.
Remaining Issues:
1. If you delete a copy with a barcode, the barcode is not put into the "Inactive Barcodes" on the /settings/barcodes page.
2. The deleted copy does not have the Undelete option on the Edit History page. I think it should, yes?
BUT I can now assign that deleted barcode onto another book. THEN if I search for that barcode, I get a whacky SQL error on the catalog page. (Presumably because the barcode is now tied to two books.)**
To reproduce:
1. Add a book
2. Add a 2nd copy to that book. Make sure both copies have barcode numbers.
3. Delete Copy 1. (Check and verify: /settings/barcodes page doesn't have the newly deleted barcode in the "Inactive Barcodes" section)
4. Assign the recently deleted barcode from Step 3 onto a different book.
5. Search for the barcode in your catalog.
Issue: SQL error, presumably because the barcode is now tied to two separate books.**
Edit: something resolved itself, so I'm testing further.
**Okay, after a few minutes I searched again and it only found the last book I added 462 to. Maybe a timing thing.
Remaining Issues:
1. If you delete a copy with a barcode, the barcode is not put into the "Inactive Barcodes" on the /settings/barcodes page.
2. The deleted copy does not have the Undelete option on the Edit History page. I think it should, yes?
16kristilabrie
Bug: Add manually page doesn't let you fully add more than 1 copy (the copy is missing from the book-edit page).
1. Go to https://www.librarything.com/addnew.php and add a book. Make sure to add 2 copies with barcodes attached.
2. Go to the newly added book Overview page: Your Book Information shows both copies in the Barcode & Copy field.
3. Go to the Edit Book page.
Bug: Copy 2 is missing.
Additionally, only one barcode number will show up in the "Barcode" field in the catalog at one time. It will only show the barcode for Copy 1, but if you empty the barcode out for the copy, the barcode for Copy 2 will suddenly show up in its place. But, double-clicking to edit that barcode is impossible: I can only see Copy 1 in the edit lightbox.
1. Go to https://www.librarything.com/addnew.php and add a book. Make sure to add 2 copies with barcodes attached.
2. Go to the newly added book Overview page: Your Book Information shows both copies in the Barcode & Copy field.
3. Go to the Edit Book page.
Bug: Copy 2 is missing.
Additionally, only one barcode number will show up in the "Barcode" field in the catalog at one time. It will only show the barcode for Copy 1, but if you empty the barcode out for the copy, the barcode for Copy 2 will suddenly show up in its place. But, double-clicking to edit that barcode is impossible: I can only see Copy 1 in the edit lightbox.
17ianreads
>1 timspalding: I'm still a little confused.
If a book has multiple copies and I double click the copies field in the catalogue, I get a pop-up with a line for each copy. That seems correct. If I edit that book, on the Edit page, I just see a single textbox called Barcode & Copy Notes. There's also a pop-up (the gear icon) with a button to Edit Copy Numbers. That button does nothing (perhaps because I haven't added any data to the copies yet), but fails silently (closes the pop-up without any apparent changes).
Is it expected that on the Edit page, there's just a single textbox (when no data has been defined about the different copies so far)?
It would be nice if Edit Copy Numbers reports why it wasn't able to do anything.
Screenshots from https://www.librarything.com/work/4858587/edit/26590999 (a 2-copy book, or a book with 1 copy).
--
I also have some books with 0 copies. That was an experiment of mine of yore (although some are probably mistakes). The idea was to set Copies to 0 for Unowned books. Did the new feature account for 0-copy books? Are they now identical to 1-copy books? Is there still a way to make 0-copy books? To be clear, this is not part of my workflow anymore and is not really a request to support this. If these are now special/in limbo, how do they become regular single-copy books? Disable the feature, edit the copies field to 1, and re-enable the feature?
Following on, what exactly happens on disabling/re-enabling? Was the initial conversion a one-off or does it happen on each re-enabling of the feature?
--
Would future generic editions be built upon this feature? I.e. LT-wide editions which individual libraries can own copies of? Probably not; just cheekily wondering out loud if that one is still on the far horizon/roadmap!
If a book has multiple copies and I double click the copies field in the catalogue, I get a pop-up with a line for each copy. That seems correct. If I edit that book, on the Edit page, I just see a single textbox called Barcode & Copy Notes. There's also a pop-up (the gear icon) with a button to Edit Copy Numbers. That button does nothing (perhaps because I haven't added any data to the copies yet), but fails silently (closes the pop-up without any apparent changes).
Is it expected that on the Edit page, there's just a single textbox (when no data has been defined about the different copies so far)?
It would be nice if Edit Copy Numbers reports why it wasn't able to do anything.
Screenshots from https://www.librarything.com/work/4858587/edit/26590999 (a 2-copy book, or a book with 1 copy).
--
I also have some books with 0 copies. That was an experiment of mine of yore (although some are probably mistakes). The idea was to set Copies to 0 for Unowned books. Did the new feature account for 0-copy books? Are they now identical to 1-copy books? Is there still a way to make 0-copy books? To be clear, this is not part of my workflow anymore and is not really a request to support this. If these are now special/in limbo, how do they become regular single-copy books? Disable the feature, edit the copies field to 1, and re-enable the feature?
Following on, what exactly happens on disabling/re-enabling? Was the initial conversion a one-off or does it happen on each re-enabling of the feature?
--
Would future generic editions be built upon this feature? I.e. LT-wide editions which individual libraries can own copies of? Probably not; just cheekily wondering out loud if that one is still on the far horizon/roadmap!
19timspalding
>17 ianreads:
If a book has multiple copies and I double click the copies field in the catalogue, I get a pop-up with a line for each copy. That seems correct. If I edit that book, on the Edit page, I just see a single textbox called Barcode & Copy Notes. There's also a pop-up (the gear icon) with a button to Edit Copy Numbers. That button does nothing (perhaps because I haven't added any data to the copies yet), but fails silently (closes the pop-up without any apparent changes).
The renumber shows the copy number column, so you can change the numbers. That may be too subtle.
If a book has multiple copies and I double click the copies field in the catalogue, I get a pop-up with a line for each copy. That seems correct. If I edit that book, on the Edit page, I just see a single textbox called Barcode & Copy Notes. There's also a pop-up (the gear icon) with a button to Edit Copy Numbers. That button does nothing (perhaps because I haven't added any data to the copies yet), but fails silently (closes the pop-up without any apparent changes).
The renumber shows the copy number column, so you can change the numbers. That may be too subtle.
20ianreads
Now that I now how it's supposed to work, it seems it doesn't on my side.
On https://www.librarything.com/work/4858587/edit/26590999 I added a note in the "Barcode & Copy Notes" field.
On the catalog pop-up, I can see that what I entered goes to the barcode field of the first copy.
I'm sure that doesn't look right?
And to be clear, the "Renumber" button on the catalog seems to work, but the "Edit Copy Numbers" on the edit page doesn't. But the latter page doesn't even show the copies anyway.
ETA: Most of this seems to have cleared up with time, sorry!
Firefox 147.0.4 (64-bit) on Linux
On https://www.librarything.com/work/4858587/edit/26590999 I added a note in the "Barcode & Copy Notes" field.
On the catalog pop-up, I can see that what I entered goes to the barcode field of the first copy.
I'm sure that doesn't look right?
And to be clear, the "Renumber" button on the catalog seems to work, but the "Edit Copy Numbers" on the edit page doesn't. But the latter page doesn't even show the copies anyway.
ETA: Most of this seems to have cleared up with time, sorry!
Firefox 147.0.4 (64-bit) on Linux
21timspalding
Yeah, I think it's okay now. There was a bug.
22CarloPoni
I don't do barcodes. (Most of my books don't have bar codes.) How do I get the "copies" field back up and running? Thank you.
UPDATE: Never mind! I figured it out! Thanks :-)
UPDATE: Never mind! I figured it out! Thanks :-)
23timspalding
You can go to Other Settings > I don't want this feature! > Disable "copies" system here https://www.librarything.com/settings/other
24johninvienna
I am totally confused.
I have hundreds of duplicate books that were entered in LibraryThing. My collection, now more than 40,000 (half cataloged) has many duplicates - there are three locations (my library, my apartment, my museum).
WHERE ARE COPIES THE PREVIUSLY CATALOGUED Books?
For example
https://www.librarything.com/work/23164315/details/168069390
had three copies
now I dont find copies anywhere
Frustrated in Vienna
JOHN
I have hundreds of duplicate books that were entered in LibraryThing. My collection, now more than 40,000 (half cataloged) has many duplicates - there are three locations (my library, my apartment, my museum).
WHERE ARE COPIES THE PREVIUSLY CATALOGUED Books?
For example
https://www.librarything.com/work/23164315/details/168069390
had three copies
now I dont find copies anywhere
Frustrated in Vienna
JOHN
25timspalding
The system is not automatically deleting books and creating copies. Your duplicates remain duplicates. What's changed is that you can now have copies underneath the book. Members have proposed that there be some system for finding duplicates and turning them into copies, but it's a tricky thing since something would have to be a complete duplicate for us to be sure. We're probably going to need to bring you in on that and give you the option to combine or keep separate.
26gilroy
>24 johninvienna: I'm still seeing over 240 duplicates on this page:
https://www.librarything.com/stats/johninvienna/workdups
https://www.librarything.com/stats/johninvienna/workdups
27CtrSacredSciences
>25 timspalding: I think I'm having an issue similar to 24 johninvienna. In Your Books under my style B, I have 251 items, I've used the old copies field to indicate I have more than one copy. I used this to indicate to my library helpers that for some items, especially our own in house recordings that we have them in a blizzard of flavors (7 talks on 1 MP3 (stored with the regular cds), 7 cds in a box (stored with oversize cds), 7 cds circulating individually (stored with regular cds), 7 audio cassettes in a box (stored with oversize cassettes), 7 audio cassettes circulating individually...) and where to look. In the beginning I decided to catalog only the first occurrence, then later decided to catalog all the DVD, Cds and MP3s but not vhs and cassettes but kept the notes in each pointing to the others.
I still see these copies in my style B, and I can still sort on that column to locate them. But when I open the record for one of those items, there is no copies field up in the physical summary area, it's now down by BarCode... and it says Copy 1 with the barcode for copy 1, and then unlike items with only one copy, it says Copy 2 with nothing in the barcode field, and nothing for the other copies, not even an indication how many copies I originally stated we had.
It's kinda freaking me out that the same field has two values depending on where you look at it. And it makes me afraid to do any kind of edit on a book that had something other than 1 in the copy field, as I don't want it to now update to 1 when I save.
I would like the copy field in edit your books to show the same value as the field in Your Books even if the Bar Code... wasn't filled out.
First image is my catalogue, second is the detail of an item with 6 copies, and the third is the detail of an item with 1 copy.
I am excited to see where you go with Copies and how that will impact circulation in TinyCat.
I still see these copies in my style B, and I can still sort on that column to locate them. But when I open the record for one of those items, there is no copies field up in the physical summary area, it's now down by BarCode... and it says Copy 1 with the barcode for copy 1, and then unlike items with only one copy, it says Copy 2 with nothing in the barcode field, and nothing for the other copies, not even an indication how many copies I originally stated we had.
It's kinda freaking me out that the same field has two values depending on where you look at it. And it makes me afraid to do any kind of edit on a book that had something other than 1 in the copy field, as I don't want it to now update to 1 when I save.
I would like the copy field in edit your books to show the same value as the field in Your Books even if the Bar Code... wasn't filled out.
First image is my catalogue, second is the detail of an item with 6 copies, and the third is the detail of an item with 1 copy.
I am excited to see where you go with Copies and how that will impact circulation in TinyCat.
28johninvienna
Good Grief!
I use copies only for multiple copies I am keeping. For example, for all books related to the Weltmuseum Wien I purchase one, receive one or two as a Member of the Executive Committee, and sometimes a gift or two. These I register in COPIES and in the first lines of comments, with the remark Location data denote where they are located.
For example in the Book "Nepal Art Now English"
https://www.librarything.com/work/23164315/details/168069390
Location data: 1) John's Library - WMWI; 2) John's Library - Nepal; 3) Wohnpark Alterlaa - bedroom
I have three copies, that I am keeping, and this shows in the record. Number of Copies 3
For this book I also have ca. 25 duplicates, as I funded this exhibition. Here I use in the Collections Duplicate
I enter under Private Comments the word Duplicates and the number of copies.
I have compact shelving in one room of the library. There are on "two walls" many shelves with duplicates. Of these a large number (unfortunately not all) have a post-it with the LT number.
I very gladly give away books, and when someone chooses one or more, I collect the "post-its" and update the LT record.
So, I use Copies and Duplicates for two totally different reasons.
I also have several helpers in my library and - with time - they get the system!
Anyone coming to Vienna is welcome to visit my library (so far seven rooms in all) in an industrial building as the books weigh tons!
More in the next Message, as I am now having some problems and will outline them.
Greetings from a Springtime Vienna (finally)
JOHN
I use copies only for multiple copies I am keeping. For example, for all books related to the Weltmuseum Wien I purchase one, receive one or two as a Member of the Executive Committee, and sometimes a gift or two. These I register in COPIES and in the first lines of comments, with the remark Location data denote where they are located.
For example in the Book "Nepal Art Now English"
https://www.librarything.com/work/23164315/details/168069390
Location data: 1) John's Library - WMWI; 2) John's Library - Nepal; 3) Wohnpark Alterlaa - bedroom
I have three copies, that I am keeping, and this shows in the record. Number of Copies 3
For this book I also have ca. 25 duplicates, as I funded this exhibition. Here I use in the Collections Duplicate
I enter under Private Comments the word Duplicates and the number of copies.
I have compact shelving in one room of the library. There are on "two walls" many shelves with duplicates. Of these a large number (unfortunately not all) have a post-it with the LT number.
I very gladly give away books, and when someone chooses one or more, I collect the "post-its" and update the LT record.
So, I use Copies and Duplicates for two totally different reasons.
I also have several helpers in my library and - with time - they get the system!
Anyone coming to Vienna is welcome to visit my library (so far seven rooms in all) in an industrial building as the books weigh tons!
More in the next Message, as I am now having some problems and will outline them.
Greetings from a Springtime Vienna (finally)
JOHN
29johninvienna
Now documentation of the first problem. It can be that I do not understand all the new combination of fields. I am almost 84 years old and I also have problems with changing passwords, etc. etc.
For the book "Mit dem Kaiser zum Popocatépetl: Die Reise nach Mexiko im Jahr 1864"
https://www.librarything.com/work/36006885/details/311228920
This book was presented at a Weltmuseum Wien activity. I have two copies, one signed by the new editor (with excellent comprehensive introduction)
So I have two copies and no duplicates. SEE MY PREVIOUS MESSAGE.
I tried yesterday and today to update the number of copies to two.
Under Edit Book in the Field Number of Copies I enter 2!
Then I look at Book Details
and find no Number of Copies
When I go back to edit mode, I see once again under Number of Copies 1
NOT TWO AS ENTERED AND SAVED!
Please explain if I am doing something wrong.
I have to understand it and train two helpers how to now enter Number of Copies
I will also have to update English and German instructions and sometime Arabic have lots of books not catalogued.
Greetings once again from Vienna
JOHN
Vice President, Weltmuseum Wien Friends
For the book "Mit dem Kaiser zum Popocatépetl: Die Reise nach Mexiko im Jahr 1864"
https://www.librarything.com/work/36006885/details/311228920
This book was presented at a Weltmuseum Wien activity. I have two copies, one signed by the new editor (with excellent comprehensive introduction)
So I have two copies and no duplicates. SEE MY PREVIOUS MESSAGE.
I tried yesterday and today to update the number of copies to two.
Under Edit Book in the Field Number of Copies I enter 2!
Then I look at Book Details
and find no Number of Copies
When I go back to edit mode, I see once again under Number of Copies 1
NOT TWO AS ENTERED AND SAVED!
Please explain if I am doing something wrong.
I have to understand it and train two helpers how to now enter Number of Copies
I will also have to update English and German instructions and sometime Arabic have lots of books not catalogued.
Greetings once again from Vienna
JOHN
Vice President, Weltmuseum Wien Friends
30johninvienna
>gilroy
You said:
>24 johninvienna: johninvienna: I'm still seeing over 240 duplicates on this page:
https://www.librarything.com/stats/johninvienna/workdups
This is not extra copies (which I am keeping) nor duplicates (which I would like to give away) but often
various editions of the "same work". For example most catalogues from our museum are issued in German and English versions. In some cases a volume in a third language is also published.
Our book on the famous Brazil collection, collected when the Austrian "Leopodine" was empress:
https://www.librarything.com/work/15294680/details/136545131 (German Edition)
https://www.librarything.com/work/15294680/details/89375628 (Englsih Edition)
https://www.librarything.com/work/15294680/details/100033275 (Portuguese Edition)
The LibraryThing system considers this one work and denotes duplicates - I don't like this, but that is the system.
And for a lot of books I have both English and German editions, some also in Spanish (can read) and Dutch.
Also many books get a new edition with different editors, commentators, covers, etc. etc.
These I try to enter these seperately, as I include usually the "jacket flap text" or "back cover text".
I, eg. collect books on Albrecht Dürer and even from the same author different editions can have different analysis...
But thanks for reading my Message - I often have the feeling these just get filed!
Greetings
JOHN
You said:
>24 johninvienna: johninvienna: I'm still seeing over 240 duplicates on this page:
https://www.librarything.com/stats/johninvienna/workdups
This is not extra copies (which I am keeping) nor duplicates (which I would like to give away) but often
various editions of the "same work". For example most catalogues from our museum are issued in German and English versions. In some cases a volume in a third language is also published.
Our book on the famous Brazil collection, collected when the Austrian "Leopodine" was empress:
https://www.librarything.com/work/15294680/details/136545131 (German Edition)
https://www.librarything.com/work/15294680/details/89375628 (Englsih Edition)
https://www.librarything.com/work/15294680/details/100033275 (Portuguese Edition)
The LibraryThing system considers this one work and denotes duplicates - I don't like this, but that is the system.
And for a lot of books I have both English and German editions, some also in Spanish (can read) and Dutch.
Also many books get a new edition with different editors, commentators, covers, etc. etc.
These I try to enter these seperately, as I include usually the "jacket flap text" or "back cover text".
I, eg. collect books on Albrecht Dürer and even from the same author different editions can have different analysis...
But thanks for reading my Message - I often have the feeling these just get filed!
Greetings
JOHN
31timspalding
>27 CtrSacredSciences:
If you had three copies before, you have three copies now. It was a number before. Now it's a number of rows—each of which can have their own barcode and item note (e.g., "a location, a condition, etc.'). Each copy you have has a row. Copy 1, Copy 2, Copy 3, etc.
Does this make sense? If it doesn't, turn this new feature off—see message 1.
If you had three copies before, you have three copies now. It was a number before. Now it's a number of rows—each of which can have their own barcode and item note (e.g., "a location, a condition, etc.'). Each copy you have has a row. Copy 1, Copy 2, Copy 3, etc.
Does this make sense? If it doesn't, turn this new feature off—see message 1.
32johninvienna
THIS IS NOT WORKING!
Can you please tell be how to get 2 copies in the record of the following book:
Post- und Telegraphenmuseum Jubiläumsführer, 1889-1959
https://www.librarything.com/work/8420801/details/312286361
When I go to edit and insert in the field copies the number 2 (1 is automatically there) it shows 2
Number of Copies 2
When I save it - it reverts back to 1
Can this please be fixed.
If I am doing something wrong let me know!!!!
Greetings
John Marshall
Can you please tell be how to get 2 copies in the record of the following book:
Post- und Telegraphenmuseum Jubiläumsführer, 1889-1959
https://www.librarything.com/work/8420801/details/312286361
When I go to edit and insert in the field copies the number 2 (1 is automatically there) it shows 2
Number of Copies 2
When I save it - it reverts back to 1
Can this please be fixed.
If I am doing something wrong let me know!!!!
Greetings
John Marshall
33quaeker.org
I can add copies in the new system. As a test, I disabled it, and could reproduce the error you are reporting, John - I could not edit the number of copies in the old system.
I have also noted that (with the new system enabled) the copy notes now are showing as a column in "my books", which is great. But it seems I can't search them yet. Seems work is being done, exciting!
I have also noted that (with the new system enabled) the copy notes now are showing as a column in "my books", which is great. But it seems I can't search them yet. Seems work is being done, exciting!
34ZephCraven
A few notes:
- In my overview pages' Your Book Information boxes, there's a Copies section. I can show Barcode & Copy Notes or just Copy Notes. I think others would agree that I'd rather have three options:
- Number of copies (just show me a single number to say how many I have, which I think will be the most popular inclusion here)
- Barcodes
- Copy Notes
- Number of copies (just show me a single number to say how many I have, which I think will be the most popular inclusion here)
- I'm also not seeing any notes currently, in the Barcode & Copy Notes field of Your Book Information even though notes are present.
- Folks may similarly want a simpler "Number of copies" column in Your Books. Unless they need each individual barcode, it's a lot to look at rn:
35ZuckerJewishAcademy
As a tinycat school library user, I just wanted to say THANK YOU! This is extremely helpful. I am now able to add multiple copies of popular books that much more easily!
36FiLoMa
This seems like a great feature, though I've never used it or taken note of the field. Like someone mentioned, many of my books don't have bar codes. I also tend to manually add my books as I've noticed over the years the system seems to struggle with Australian book covers, often not finding them, of finding a version that doesn't reflect what I actually have.
Will this 'copies' feature ever be rolled out where it reflects different format copies. It's not uncommon for me to get the ebook and audio book. In one rare instance, I have a book series with all formats, i.e., hardcover, paperback, ebook and audio. These are all reflected as different books because they all have different page counts, different publishers etc. A multiple format example in my library is Dungeon Crawler Carl.
Will this 'copies' feature ever be rolled out where it reflects different format copies. It's not uncommon for me to get the ebook and audio book. In one rare instance, I have a book series with all formats, i.e., hardcover, paperback, ebook and audio. These are all reflected as different books because they all have different page counts, different publishers etc. A multiple format example in my library is Dungeon Crawler Carl.
37johninvienna
>34 ZephCraven: ZephKraven
YOU WROTE§
A few notes:
In my 'overview pages' Your Book Information boxes, there's a Copies section.
Where is this?
WHERE ARE MY OVERVIEW PAGES?
I can't seem to find them?
Many thanks for the help!
John
YOU WROTE§
A few notes:
In my 'overview pages' Your Book Information boxes, there's a Copies section.
Where is this?
WHERE ARE MY OVERVIEW PAGES?
I can't seem to find them?
Many thanks for the help!
John
38keristars
>37 johninvienna: He's referring to the Work Overview for books he has. The main Work page is the Overview page.
Here's one of your currently reading books, its work overview page with the "your book information" box. https://www.librarything.com/work/10187358/66066390
Here's one of your currently reading books, its work overview page with the "your book information" box. https://www.librarything.com/work/10187358/66066390
39johninvienna
>38 keristars: keristars
>34 ZephCraven: ZephCraven see bottom of note
>1 timspalding: timspalding see very bottom of note
Thanks
This is complicated, but it seems to work.
For example for the book:
Maximilian von Mexiko, 1832-1867 : Ausstellung auf Burg Hardegg
https://www.librarything.com/work/7881577/details/41458765
I have entered under notes the location and this is showing in both OVERVIEW
Copy Notes
Copy 1: John's Library - Habsburgs - Maximilian of Mexico; Copy 2: John's Library - Lower Austria - Burg Hardegg
And in BOOK DETAILS, under COPIES
Copy 1: John's Library - Habsburgs - Maximilian of Mexico
Copy 2: John's Library - Lower Austria - Burg Hardegg
But if I have not entered any data, then I cannot find COPIES for books with more than one, anywhere in OVERVIEW or BOOK DETAILS
But I can find it in listings -my C version - where I have entered Copies and Copy Notes.
Here I can sort on COPIES from large to small, and low and behold I have one with 20 copies.
https://www.librarything.com/work/10694784/details/67285146
Actually
I have over 50 copies of this book - BUT I ONLY ENTER UNDER COPIES THOSE I KEEP WITH THEIR LOCATION.
This should have been 3. The others are duplicates to be given away (its a beautiful book in German and English).
The number of duplicates are entered under Private Comments.
Now to the point:
With practice I can find many errors and make updates.
But it would be nice to see in OVERVIEW or BOOK DETAILS or BOTH
Copies Nr.
if it is more than one - NO PROBLEM IF IT ALSO SHOWS 1.
ZephCraven YOU WROTE
A few notes:
In my overview pages' Your Book Information boxes, there's a Copies section. I can show Barcode & Copy Notes or just Copy Notes. I think others would agree that I'd rather have three options:
1. Number of copies (just show me a single number to say how many I have, which I think will be the most popular inclusion here)
Is the first of the 3 options working?
How do I turn it on? I have not corrected "Balinese Art in Transition"
where I should still be seeing 20 either in OVERVIEW or BOOK DETAILS
in edit mode I see 20 lines for the 20 copies!
Its very clever, but a bit difficult to manage. I see that I have some 720 books with more than one copy.
THANKS TIM, sorry if I had trouble getting this all straight.
Greetings from Vienna,
JOHN
>34 ZephCraven: ZephCraven see bottom of note
>1 timspalding: timspalding see very bottom of note
Thanks
This is complicated, but it seems to work.
For example for the book:
Maximilian von Mexiko, 1832-1867 : Ausstellung auf Burg Hardegg
https://www.librarything.com/work/7881577/details/41458765
I have entered under notes the location and this is showing in both OVERVIEW
Copy Notes
Copy 1: John's Library - Habsburgs - Maximilian of Mexico; Copy 2: John's Library - Lower Austria - Burg Hardegg
And in BOOK DETAILS, under COPIES
Copy 1: John's Library - Habsburgs - Maximilian of Mexico
Copy 2: John's Library - Lower Austria - Burg Hardegg
But if I have not entered any data, then I cannot find COPIES for books with more than one, anywhere in OVERVIEW or BOOK DETAILS
But I can find it in listings -my C version - where I have entered Copies and Copy Notes.
Here I can sort on COPIES from large to small, and low and behold I have one with 20 copies.
https://www.librarything.com/work/10694784/details/67285146
Actually
I have over 50 copies of this book - BUT I ONLY ENTER UNDER COPIES THOSE I KEEP WITH THEIR LOCATION.
This should have been 3. The others are duplicates to be given away (its a beautiful book in German and English).
The number of duplicates are entered under Private Comments.
Now to the point:
With practice I can find many errors and make updates.
But it would be nice to see in OVERVIEW or BOOK DETAILS or BOTH
Copies Nr.
if it is more than one - NO PROBLEM IF IT ALSO SHOWS 1.
ZephCraven YOU WROTE
A few notes:
In my overview pages' Your Book Information boxes, there's a Copies section. I can show Barcode & Copy Notes or just Copy Notes. I think others would agree that I'd rather have three options:
1. Number of copies (just show me a single number to say how many I have, which I think will be the most popular inclusion here)
Is the first of the 3 options working?
How do I turn it on? I have not corrected "Balinese Art in Transition"
where I should still be seeing 20 either in OVERVIEW or BOOK DETAILS
in edit mode I see 20 lines for the 20 copies!
Its very clever, but a bit difficult to manage. I see that I have some 720 books with more than one copy.
THANKS TIM, sorry if I had trouble getting this all straight.
Greetings from Vienna,
JOHN
40ZephCraven
>39 johninvienna: Hi John, those were suggestions on my end—they don't exist yet, but perhaps Tim will incorporate them!
41johninvienna
>ZephCraven
Thanks, I am getting use to the new feature. Will also show it to the fellows working at my library.
I see some books catalogued in 2009 were done differently, so we can also make corrections!
Moustache looks great - I even tried wax many many years ago. My first beard was in Yemen in the 1970s where there was no electricity or running water!
Greetings from Vienna
JOHN
Thanks, I am getting use to the new feature. Will also show it to the fellows working at my library.
I see some books catalogued in 2009 were done differently, so we can also make corrections!
Moustache looks great - I even tried wax many many years ago. My first beard was in Yemen in the 1970s where there was no electricity or running water!
Greetings from Vienna
JOHN
42AppTrailMuseum
>4 JonathonL88: Searchable would be necessary!
43AppTrailMuseum
I don't see any of the copy information appearing in our public-facing TinyCat. And the copy specific notes do not appear to be searchable in TinyCat OR in LibraryThing.
So I don't know whether I'm missing something on the LibraryThing side, or whether that's got to be dealt with on the TinyCat side.
I will have to keep using our previous workaround (fully cataloging 2nd and 3rd copies separately from copy 1; using the Notes field for the copy specific notes - which for us include things like author inscriptions, gift notes, specific copy binding notes)
I know this whole bunch of updates is a huge bit of coding to add. We appreciate it!
So I don't know whether I'm missing something on the LibraryThing side, or whether that's got to be dealt with on the TinyCat side.
I will have to keep using our previous workaround (fully cataloging 2nd and 3rd copies separately from copy 1; using the Notes field for the copy specific notes - which for us include things like author inscriptions, gift notes, specific copy binding notes)
I know this whole bunch of updates is a huge bit of coding to add. We appreciate it!
44the_red_shoes
>1 timspalding: "If you really don't like it, you can go to Other Settings > I don't want this feature! > Disable "copies" system here https://www.librarything.com/settings/other"
Thank you for providing an option to disable this, because LT frequently and incorrectly lists different editions as duplicates.
*However,* I wouldn't have known about this at all if I hadn't searched for this group and then found the topic. Changes like this should be flagged with a message or something similar.
Thank you for providing an option to disable this, because LT frequently and incorrectly lists different editions as duplicates.
*However,* I wouldn't have known about this at all if I hadn't searched for this group and then found the topic. Changes like this should be flagged with a message or something similar.
45gilroy
>44 the_red_shoes: This has nothing to do with duplicates.
46ZephCraven
>43 AppTrailMuseum: Hi there! Sorry I didn't catch this message earlier. As Tim stated in the initial post, we're still in phase 1:
At present, copes are only in LibraryThing, and are NOT integrated into the lending/circulation/check-out system on either LibraryThing or TinyCat. "Copies" are a big change, so we're rolling it out in stages. Once we're satisfied that things are working well and members are happy, we'll move onto the next steps!
