Exploring Reviews, (Semi-)Random Review Encounters

Tim expressed interest in this idea when it came up over on the Add Names to Thumbs topic, so I'm bringing it up again to see what people think about it.

As I understood him, he said that he wants more reviews and he wants to see more thumbing of reviews. Both as a way of helping the reviews and for encouraging social connections.

I think that a page that pulls different reviews along with interesting statistics of some kind might encourage more reading of reviews that might not otherwise be seen, which in turn might lead to more thumbs and/or social connections. It's also an alternative to Hot Reviews.

Would you use a page like this? What would you like to see involved in it?

 

The first suggestion is that it have a way to explore reviews according to tags. This is similar to something people already want for the regular profile_reviews.php page (only showing according to tags).

Also - reviews with certain star ratings. Recently written reviews. Reviews from members in a particular group. Reviews only from a particular series (or attached to other CK items).

 

I'm also thinking that it'd be useful to show only one review per work per pageload, with an ajaxy option to load other reviews for that work. Also, an Add Book function, once that page is fixed up.

I'd also like to see it randomized. Instead of all ten thousand (or however many) reviews for the tag "fiction" at once, maybe ten or fifteen randomly chosen, with an option to load more.

 

This would probably work best with some kind of discussion or talk feature attached, but we've beaded the Review Comments pony until it's sparklier than a Vegas showgirl costume.

Mostly, I think that a way to explore reviews not from Connection News, Hot Reviews, or profile_reviews.php would be a great addition to the site, though I worry that it might be slow and troublesome like tagmash or tag watch or tag mirror.

I like this idea. I'm particularly interested in filtering by tags, by group, and by star rating.

One addition: I'd like a way to filter it for number of copies, to "show only reviews for books with fewer than 500 copies in LT", for example. (This is another thing I'd like for the existing member review pages as well)

I also think there really needs to be an option to ignore reviews for books/authors already in my library. Soemtimes I want to see reviews of familiar books, but sometimes I want to discover something new.

This would probably work best with some kind of discussion or talk feature attached, but we've beaded the Review Comments pony until it's sparklier than a Vegas showgirl costume.

Yeah, I think this is a pretty obvious consequence of Tim's desire to foster social interaction around reviews. Maybe he'll realize it eventually. But that's a subject for another thread ;)

> 1

When you say "according to tags", are you referring to the way the books are tagged, or are you suggesting that reviews be tagged (as they are at amazon.com)?

I think that a page that pulls different reviews along with interesting statistics of some kind might encourage more reading of reviews

I probably would use it. Right now, I regularly read only my profile_review page (when it works; it's been glitchy). I don't look at hot reviews, probably because I never got in the habit of going to my home page. Too cluttered for my taste. Having a page dedicated to reviews, other than my reviews and those of books in my library, would be attractive to me.

3> Oh, according to the books, not the reviews! So reviews for books tagged "fiction" or books tagged "steampunk" or books tagged "books that need to get over themselves" (is that a tag? it should be).

Zoë: oh, yes, an option to exclude books already in one's catalogue. I know there are a ton of potential filters that this could take that didn't occur to me in the first list, and other options that shouldn't be left out.

I would like to follow specific reviewers but only see the reviews for books among my recommendations or specified tags.

A "people who thumbed like you also thumbed these reviews"-function would make me thumb like hell. And if LT could take all this information and make a personalized review stream (like on the connections page) It would really increase my interest in LT reviews.

ETA: but if the statistics is only general and has nothing to do with my own preferences I would probably not use the page.

A "people who thumbed like you also thumbed these reviews"-function would make me thumb like hell.

Ooh, I like that idea.

I'd also be interested in seeing the basic data behind this feature: a list of the users who thumb like you, both in raw numbers and weighted. (This is probably the sort of thing you were looking for that should go in the hypothetical new thread about showing names on thumbs.)

By the way, I propose that we refer to this feature as Explore Reviews. I suspect that it will come up in other discussions.

I've often wished that tag and series pages would show the number of reviews for each title, like author pages do.

"people who thumbed like you also thumbed these reviews"

Presumably, you could do that even if you didn't put names on thumbs. We don't know the personal details involved in automatic recommendations either.

I really like the idea of "people who thumbed like you also thumbed these reviews".

Another (similar) idea would be showing the reviews thumbed by users that are connected to me (friends, interesting libraries, members with your books). They probably read reviews of books I might like, so it would also be a new way to find books.

I think that's great. Here's a list of my suggestions, in no particular order:

* Let us mark "interesting reviewers". (I suppose this could be done now with a custom Connections group, but what I'd really love would be to see only their reviews, not their added books and ratings, in Connection News.)

* Let us filter the "Books in X's library reviewed by others" by tags or Collections (see just reviews of your Wishlist or Recently Read, anyone?)

* Let us restrict the "Books in X's library reviewed by others" view to one review per book per screen. As it is I hardly ever look at that module, because it's full of lots of reviews for just a few very popular books.

* Give us more ways to sort or filter reviews. Maybe we want to see reviews by people who gave a book five stars, or one; maybe we want to see only reviews longer than a few sentences, or only reviews shorter than two paragraphs. Let us have more ways of seeing the reviews we're interested in. Thumbs are useful, but they're also crude, since people give thumbs for many reasons.

* Along the same lines as the above, consider "thumb types". Let people mark their reason for giving a thumb; "interesting", "funny", "informative", "I agree with this review", etc.

* Reconsider the motivation and spin on the "names on thumbs" proposal. I was initially behind it, when I understood the reasoning to be "help me find other people who like the same sorts of reviews that I do, because their libraries or reviews might be interesting to me." Tim could implement exactly the same software with very different social spins, depending on how he blogs about it and what the UI is. Tweaking this proposal a bit to keep the focus on reviews and books, rather than people, would still be a worthwhile idea.

* I never look at Hot Reviews. They aren't for books that interest me, and I find the pile-on effect distasteful. Still, I'd like to see excellent reviews for books I find interesting. I'd need to think about how this should be implemented.

Personally I don't like to read reviews on books I haven't read, because there's a possibility I will read it and be spoiled. (I don't even read backs of books. I really hate being spoiled.)

There is one thing that would make reading reviews easier, and that's on the review page where you can see your reviews and the reviews written by people who have reviewed books in your library. I would like to be able to ignore certain books so they don't show up in that list. (I'm not sure if I currently can and just don't know how, this site is terribly difficult to figure out sometimes.) For example, I don't care about reviews of Harry Potter, but I do care about reviews for the more obscure books I read.

I do see a benefit to having reviews by tags or something like that, which immediately came to my mind, although I'm not sure if I would use it.

Presumably, you could do that even if you didn't put names on thumbs. We don't know the personal details involved in automatic recommendations either.

Yeah, that's true. But I'd rather be able to look at the data myself than be forced to rely on a murky algorithm all the time.

what I'd really love would be to see only their reviews, not their added books and ratings, in Connection News

Does the homepage Connection News not have filters for ratings only? I think you can do this from the full Connection News page, at least. But I think I'd actually prefer a new "favourite reviewers" module anyway.

Along the same lines as the above, consider "thumb types". Let people mark their reason for giving a thumb; "interesting", "funny", "informative", "I agree with this review", etc.

I'm coming to like this idea more and more.

Reconsider the motivation and spin on the "names on thumbs" proposal.... Tweaking this proposal a bit to keep the focus on reviews and books, rather than people, would still be a worthwhile idea.

Do you think it's worth starting a new thread about this now, while the ideas are fresh? I was initially resistant to the idea of rethinking the proposal from the ground up, but I'm starting to be won over.

12> I'm not sure if I currently can and just don't know how, this site is terribly difficult to figure out sometimes.

You're not the only one who would like that! Surprisingly, a poll from Zoë's RSI thread suggesting being able to sort it by collections to help with that (or so that ONLY wishlist reviews could be read, or so that all reviews EXCEPT wishlist ones, &c.) came out with more 'no' votes than 'yes' - maybe because folks don't have it as a high priority, maybe because they don't care, but still. The sorting by tags (which could accomplish the same purpose) was popular, though.

At any rate, it isn't an available function, though it's been something I've wanted ever since Collections came out and made it possible to block books from being used for connections or recommendations.

 

Do you think it's worth starting a new thread about this now, while the ideas are fresh? I was initially resistant to the idea of rethinking the proposal from the ground up, but I'm starting to be won over.

I could maybe be swayed to like names attached to thumbs if it created more functionality of an Explore Reviews page. But if the same functionality could be done without actually having the names attached, I'd prefer it. I just can't stand the idea of seeing a list of names after a review with "These people liked/thumbed/appreciated/ate/bandwagonned this review". I could see something like "Reviews Zoë Liked" being interesting, but I think that might work better with a list feature that has commenting enabled. It's something that I would really want to be able to have conversations about.

>14 keristars: Okay, I'll make a new thread to avoid distracting from the discussion here. One quick point for now: the list of thumbers wouldn't show up unless you actually clicked to see it.

Yeah, that's true. But I'd rather be able to look at the data myself than be forced to rely on a murky algorithm all the time.

Oh, I agree. (If people allowed it, that is; I'm still not sure if I would.) I was saying that just in case Tim totally ditched the idea of putting names on thumbs.

>16 235711: Well, I'm still optimistic. I just started a new thread for renewed discussion of the idea.

17: Good.

Lorax #11 "I never look at Hot Reviews. They aren't for books that interest me, and I find the pile-on effect distasteful."

I sort of agree - but I do look at it frequently because I believe a certain amount of cognative dissonance is useful. Otherwise the Echo Chamber gets to be all you know.

Otherwise I like all those suggestions, especially for sorting reviews by star.

Great idea.

Ideally, I'd prefer a review snippet and a link to appear in relevant places (tag page, tagmash page, series page, tagwatch - if that ever reappears, character page etc etc). Loading an entire random review would be too much of a good thing when you're not actually looking for it.

I'd second all the filtering options proposed by lorax in #11. AND I would like to set them in my profile, rather than reconfigure the search parameters every time.

Earlier this week I was re-inventing the wheel, only I didn't realise it. Fortunately I used search before posting my various ideas, since they're all here.

I quite enjoy that right-hand column on the reviews page: In elenchus's library and reviewed by others. I'd love something similar but based on specific reviewers, or reviewers who thumbed reviews I thumbed, or reviewers whose reviews I thumbed. In short, for discovering new books, and for appreciating good reviews, whether or not I'd like the book under review.

Yes, yes! Love those ideas, elenchus! I've long enjoyed that right-hand column, too, and wished for a way to fine-tune what I'd like to see out of it.