When publishers behave badly, should you mention it in your review?

Hi guys!

I'm looking for some advice.

After I finished a recent ER book, I wrote my review and put the book aside for a while. Then, when school ended, I put several of my textbooks up for sale on Amazon.com. This ER book had a similar theme, and I accidentally put it up with the rest. Luckily, someone caught me before the book had been listed for long, and I took it down immediately.

Unfortunately, the publisher has not let this rest. They have left comments on my book blog and on my Amazon.com review attacking me. It's quite unpleasant.

Should I mention this behavior in my Librarything review? On the one hand, I did make a mistake by listing the book for sale on Amazon, which is against the ER rules. But on the other hand, I corrected that as soon as it was pointed out to me, and I have apologized for it. I don't like that I'm being pursued on my blog, and if an author/publisher was doing this to another reviewer, I'd like to know about it so I could avoid that person in the future.

Edited to clarify a sentence.

I wouldn't. I'm reviewing the book, not the publisher!

I agree with lilithcat about not including it in your review. HOWEVER, I think you should alert the ER group here to the identity of the publisher, and do it in a dedicated thread. I did this in praise of a small press called Chin Music not long ago, when they went WAY above and beyond the call of duty to correct a minor issue I had with the ER book I got from them. I suggest you do the same, in reverse. I'd be leery of requesting a book from someone/someplace that treated a reviewer this way.

Also...will you link to your blog in that thread, if you start it? It helps for others to see precisely what you're talking about.

I also wouldn't mention this in your review. You might alert LT staff. Are you sure it's the publisher rather than the author who is attacking you?

Also, I'm a little confused about the whole thing. You say that putting your copy of the ER book up for sale on Amazon was against the ER rules. I can't find any ER rules about this, so I'm confused. Did you accidentally put it up before posting your review on LT or after? I've never tried to sell one of my ER books, but I assumed that members were free to do what they liked with their own books, especially once they'd written the review.

>4 rsterling: If a book is a finished copy, bound for trade sale, there isn't a rule in the ER about what to do with it. If it's an ARC, all publishers require that these copies not be sold to anyone, libraries can't accept them as donations, and no commercial benefit can come to the reviewer for possessing the ARC. These rules are industry wide and are meant to keep uncorrected texts from getting into general circulation.

Anyone can give an ARC away, trade it with a private individual for another book, or the like. That's not covered in the rules.

4 - It's a very small publisher, and I suspect (but don't know for certain) that the author and the publisher are one and the same.

I've talked to LT staff, and they have done what they can. I consider the situation resolved, for the most part. I've just been debating whether I should mention their reaction in my review, since that's something I personally like to know. I like to steer clear of authors who behave unprofessionally online.

As for the sale rule, it's in the "What else? I love this stuff!" section on the rules page:
All results are final and non-negotiable. The book is for the recipient's own personal use and may not be sold. The recipient is responsible for all federal, state and local taxes.


Edit to add: I received a final copy, not an ARC. Can't sell ARCs on Amazon, so if I'd gotten one the whole drama would have been avoided. :-p

5 - So then either way, though, it isn't against any specific LTER rules -- even if selling ARCs may be against publishing industry rules.

Was this an ARC book? (i.e. one marked specifically not for resale)

6 - Ah, I see. I missed that bit when I just scanned through the rules.

6 - I've just been debating whether I should mention their reaction in my review, since that's something I personally like to know.

No, I say take the high road (which the author/publisher clearly isn't). I remember a case a year or so ago, where an author got po'ed at a LT review, and posted comments to the member, and then the member posted something about the nasty comments in the review, and then the whole thing escalated needlessly. Keep your review as it is: your evaluation of the book.

Richardderus suggests you might just post a thread about it here. I'd be wary of that too, but maybe that's just me. Still, it would be a more appropriate place than the review.

To prevent further interface with your blog, I would make it so that you have to approve all comments, then if they try to post anything else you have the power to just deny it.

If the publisher and the author are the same person I see no problem at all with mentioning this on your review as it is a warning to other potential readers about the kind of behaviour they may be up against themsleves. If they are not one and the same then it does seem a shame to spoil the author's chances because of his/her publisher's bad behaviour. Sadly, the world is full of people who could start a fight in an empty room and aren't really interested in your apology, they're just looking for a scrap; I usually find these are best dealt with by making your apology clear and public and then leaving the conversation so that they can continue making fools of themselves if they must. It's probably just not worth the hassle but I do believe others should be warned so that they don't get entangled with this mean-spirited bunch. Cyderry's suggestion is a great one - make your position clear then block them from any further contact.

Ed for typos - Yes, I know we now have a preview facility but if Tim etc thought that would stop me publishing my typos they were sadly underestimating my capacity for overlooking them the first time round.

@1 | Yes. As a book buyer, that information would influence my decision to give the publisher my money. As a reader, that information would catch my attention and very likely my curiosity about the book. And as a mean, mean, petty human; that information would be like sugar and caffeine to me and encourage me to read through all your reviews and browse through all your books to see what other interesting things you've been reading.

I would just let it go. You made a mistake. They overreacted. The fact that the publisher can't seem to let it go shouldn't compel you to hum the same tune.

^5

You say "If it's an ARC, all publishers require that these copies not be sold to anyone, libraries can't accept them as donations, and no commercial benefit can come to the reviewer for possessing the ARC."

I think that actually takes it farther than it really can go. I agree that the covers of ARCs state that the book is not for sale. However, I don't think the publisher can enforce a rule that it not be donated to a library, for instance, or that no commercial benefit can ever come to the reviewer for possessing it. I view the prohibition against sale to mean simply that commercial bookstores, with whom publishers have legal relationships, cannot put the ARC for sale in their store along with the actual finished, published copies of the same title.

Outside of LibraryThing, I am a book reviewer who receives many unsolicited and unwanted ARCs. By sending them to me, the publisher is costing me time and money in disposing of the ones I don't want to keep. Generally, I wait until well after the cover publication date and then give them to my library, which I presume sells them in the Friends of the Library book sale. I can't control what the library does with them after that and I don't try. I refuse to put paper in a landfill. I suppose I could just recycle the books with my paper recycling, but again I don't think the publisher has any say in this.

There is also a collector's market for ARCs, although I don't think it's very lucrative. In any case, I don't see anything wrong with selling the ARC to a collector if it's well after the publication date -- they collect ARCs specifically, so it's not likely to be interfering with sales of the actual book.

I've also given away many ARCs to friends for free, when I know it's an author they're likely to enjoy.

As a comparison, what if a company suddenly started sending me unsolicited clothing stamped with "Can only be worn by the recipient ... cannot be sold or donated" -- they don't have the right to send me unsolicited stuff and then impose their conditions.

By sending them to me, the publisher is costing me time and money in disposing of the ones I don't want to keep.

You poor, victimized person, beset by cruel publishers who keep sending you review copies. Oh, the pain and suffering!

1 by @valkylee>

I am not a lawyer, but my practice and theory regarding this is as follows:

Similar to Promo CDs, a publisher-provided book becomes your property once you have possession of it. Under the First Sale Doctrine of US copyright law, this means you can do with it what you would with any copy you may have purchased from a retailer.

I make a regular practice of disposing of some of my ER books for profit, and have had no problems to date.

I don't sell my ARC's nor do I have any plans to. Barnes and Noble, however has an entire bookcase of ARC's for sale in their used book section, so obviously they don't have a problem with buying or selling them.

#14 - I have to agree with that sentiment.

#13 - If it's such an effort for you to dispose of them @amysisson, you might want to stop requesting them. (Edited to add: If indeed you did request them.)

>17 clamairy:
But presumably the ones @amysisson requests are wanted. It's the unsolicited ARC's that are a pain in the rear end.

#18 - People get ARCs without requesting them? I don't only mean books she requested specifically by title. Somehow somewhere she asked for books, didn't she? Or do unscrupulous publishers pass around lists of home addresses and mail off books willy-nilly these days?

Beats me, but I thought you might have missed the fact that the problematic ones weren't received through the ER program.

Oh, I assumed they weren't through Early Reviewers. One of the reasons that I haven't ever asked for books from any of the other sources is that I just seem to have sufficient reading time to handle the ER books I do win, the books I try to get to for my book groups, and the ones I want to read on my own.

Re.#19: "mail off books willy-nilly these days"

Once publishers suss out that you're a reliable reviewer, it's not uncommon to have books just show up. Ever since I started to use my book reviews as "filler" in my The Job Stalker blog, I started to get "business" books sent to me from various publishers. At first they'd query me as to my interest in particular titles, but eventually they'd just appear in my mailbox.

I can easily imagine that somebody who had built up a reputation as a reviewer might well be on the receiving end of a constant stream of un-requested books!

Especially for the larger publishers, the cost of sending a book out is fairly minimal ... FAR less than the cost of having a P.R. person pick up the phone to schmooze with a reviewer/blogger ... they might have the initial contact to create "a relationship", but once that's established, just sending out the books makes a lot of "bottom line" sense.

 

>19 clamairy:. I think a lot of higher-profile bloggers will receive books to review on their websites, not always solicited.

Yeah, that makes sense. My apologies if that is indeed the case. On the other hand, there should be zero compulsion to read & review the unasked for ones unless they look good. And how much 'time and money' does it take to drop the unwanted freebies off at the library?

I stated earlier (paraphrasing here) that I don't mind when lots of books in genres or subjects that don't interest me are offered. But on second consideration, it's not that I don't mind but I'm actually grateful. Lots of people like and want those books, and if they win one of them, it means they can't win the one(s) I want most. (Edit: Oops, this should have been on a different thread. Once again, my little mind failed me.)

As far as unsolicited ARCs, I have a friend who is a blogger and a new author who has received several, some not even close to her reading interests.

>25 TooBusyReading:
I wonder what would happen if said blogger puts a statement somewhere obvious that his/her tastes run to such-and-such areas, and any unsolicited ARC's in other genres/fields may be considered junk mail at the blogger's discretion.

In the UK the law on this kind of thing is spelled out. I really can't be bothered to go and look it up so I apologise for my errors but it's something like, if you contact the sender of unsolicited items they have to collect (at their own expense) or send return postage and there is a time limit on this - let's say within a month, after that time it is yours to do whatever you like with.

Your other alternative is not to contact them, in which case the items become yours in a rather longer time - let's say 3 months. Either way, if the sender wants them back he/she has to pay.

I don't think I'd mind too much if people sent me unsolicited books but I would consider them a 'donation' and do whatever I pleased with them. I feel the same way about salespeople who leave their catalogues on my doorstep then call back in a week's time and get terribly upset because I've thrown them away. If you don't want me to have it, don't leave it here.

>26 AnnaClaire:
She has stated what kinds of books she likes to read, but I don't think she has your suggested disclaimer on it. That's a good idea.

>27 Booksloth:
I think in the US, you don't have to return anything that is sent unsolicited, no time frames. I'm not positive though. I buy some books online and was sent an unsolicited DVD as an introduction to a new series. They said that if I was not interested, I could return it in the prepaid envelope, but I was under no obligation to do so.

#28 - Got something similar from National Geographic. Didn't sent them any money, and never watched the DVD, though I believe it is still here... somewhere.

As someone has pointed out, "unsolicited" means I'm talking about books I haven't requested. I am not talking about Early Reviewer books. I am also not talking about a book review blog, so putting a "disclaimer" on my blog will not change anything. (Please notice I did not say a disclaimer won't quote solve the problem unquote -- because I never said this was a problem! I was saying that it would or could be a problem if publishers could legally enforce their restrictions on me on what to do with the ARCs they send.)

As others have since pointed out, once you have started to publish book reviews, especially in print, publishers may send you lots of books. I once edited a science fiction related newsletter in which we reviewed a bilingual poetry book by Ursula K. LeGuin and another writer. We published that review because it was related to science fiction and fantasy by virtue of who the author was. That publisher, which specializes in Spanish language and bilingual books, then sent me EVERYTHING they published for at least 10 years after that, even though none of it had anything to do with science fiction. I even wrote them a friendly snail mail letter to tell them we had no interest in their cookbooks/romance books/children's books/etc. It did not make any difference -- they continued to send me everything for years and years.

Third, I agree it does not take much time or money to drop off books at the library. In fact, I specifically said that is what I often do! However, the person I was originally responding to had stated regarding ARCs that "libraries can't accept them as donations." If I accepted that at face value, then I would not be allowed to donate them to libraries, and my time/money to dispose of the books would become more complicated.

I'm a bit dismayed that people seemed to have interpreted my post as "poor me, I have this terrible burden." What I meant was that if the publisher COULD legally dictate to me what I do with every last piece of unsolicited material they send me, THEN it would be a burden. But I don't believe they can dictate that -- that was my point. No company can send me stuff I DIDN'T ASK FOR and then give me orders as to what to do with it.

If I wasn't clear, my apologies.

I don't believe I misunderstod your post and I do recognize your problem. In fact, I have a couple of ARCs that I did request (not the unrequested books you mention), but they weren't favorites of mine. They came with specific instructions that the books were a loan, and I couldn't pass them on to any third party. Now they are taking up space on my shelf, and I'm not quite sure what to do with them.

I believe I was the one who first used the word "disclaimer" in this thread, and I was using it in response to a suggestion about a blogger friend of mine, not about your original post. We do tend to wander a bit in these conversations.

^31, TooBusyReading....

I realized upon re-reading that the disclaimer idea was in relation to your friend, not me. And I didn't think you were one who misunderstood my post!

Wow, even when I've requested books directly from publishers for review in the past, none of them ever came with specific instructions or classified it as a loan. In fact, they never seemed to infer that it meant a review was ultimately required -- because there is always the chance that the reviewer won't like the book after all. Or the publication may decline to print the review for a reason outside the reviewer's control. (This is all in pre-blog days. I had one time recently where the journal accidentally assigned a book to me and another reviewer, so mine was extra -- so I asked for permission to publish that review on my blog, and noted what had happened.)

I pass all my LTER books along to a brother who lives nearby and likes to read.

If I had no such outlet, and didn't want to keep them forever or just throw them in a landfill, I think I would seek out one of the shelters for homeless men or battered women (depending on the books) and offer the books to them. Having something decent to read might be a nice benefit in any situation like that.

> 28

I think in the US, you don't have to return anything that is sent unsolicited, no time frames.

You are correct. If someone sends you something that you have not requested, it is considered a gift, and you can do whatever you want with it.

>OP I may have missed this somewhere along the line as I read through the posts quickly but if the book wasn't an ARC copy how did the publisher know that you posted an ER copy? You didn't mention it in your sale description did you and if you did why would you?

>35 rxtheresa:. Seriously. I've accidentally purchased a book that I won on ER and sold one of them. How could anybody tell which one was the one I won and which the one I bought? The one I got from ER wasn't an ARC, the books were identical.

35 - My username on Amazon is the same as my username here on LT: I assume the publisher recognized the username (and the content of the review) and reported to LT, who then contacted me. I certainly didn't mention it in the description, that wouldn't serve much point since the buyer certainly wouldn't care.

Just to throw this out, some author whom I;m not familiar with and isn't listed here at LT, got booted off of a plane for swearing:

http://blogs.ajc.com/news-to-me/2011/06/13/airline-passenger-drops-f-bomb-gets-b...

It looks like someone went ahead and did their review based on that incident:

http://www.amazon.com/Dividing-Line-Robert-Sayegh/dp/1933570121/

Just including it here since it's similar.

Wow, there's an overreaction! I bet it was totally worth the cost to Delta in extra time and fuel and possibly making the plane late to kick off a guy who dropped an f-bomb in a private conversation.

And the airline industry wonders why it's constantly failing.

?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!WHAT!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

is all there is to say about that.

the plane thing is fucked, seriously. asinine.
and I think amazon killed the review because I don't see it, just the 'be the first to review this product' thing.

#41 Me too.

>38 theapparatus: The worst thing about the article was the comments on it. The profound ignorance expressed there is jaw-dropping. People who think that freedom of speech doesn't apply if it offends someone and people who think that men can take hearing people cursing, but that women shouldn't be exposed to it. Unbelievable.

>43 tottman: Hate to say it but cursing is not covered by freedom of speech.

A decent write up about the idea: http://www.comportone.com/connie/articles/freespch.htm

Here in the US, that would be considered fighting words:

https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Fighting_words#United_States

I vaguely remember a specific case where the f-word was held to be one of those fighting words but I can;t find anything right off.

I don;t see the amazon review either anymore. It was there though.

That "right up" does not offer a single citation, nor indeed any argument, that profanity cannot be protected free speech. It simply asserts that profanity is too "base" to be protected.

Also, you misunderstand the notion of "fighting words." You are only using fighting words if you use them to incite or provoke.

Nothing in the article suggests that this guy attempted to provoke a confrontation. To throw a passenger off a flight because you overhear him cursing is indeed probably a violation of freedom of speech.

The fact that provisions deeming books containing the word "fuck" obscene have been struck down suggest that simple profanity, when not used to provoke or to intimidate a person, is indeed protected free speech.

Read your ticket the next time you fly. Laws protecting free speech only stop the government from interfering with your speech. Your employer, people you do business with, anyone you deal with not connected with government, can place whatever restrictions on your speech that they can enforce.

I'd assume that the problem wasn't so much the particular language as the fact that he seemed to be getting overly angry about some minor flight situation. I can't particularly imagine his question being asked in a friendly tone.

A government instructor once explained freedom of speech as follows: "Your right to free speech stops at my ears."

I always found that interesting.

46: You are not entirely correct.

Your conditions of carriage -- the fine print on the ticket -- will give the airline the right to throw you off a flight if you use abusive language (which does not have to be profane) towards their employees or fellow passengers, or if you are unruly. Restricting any speech outside of that specifically prohibited by the conditions of carriage is indeed an infringement of the passenger's rights.

An airline employee may not place arbitrary limits on you. You can not be thrown off a flight for saying something that an airline employee dislikes or disagrees with. In the absence of a complaint from another passenger, an overheard remark is not usually going to be a basis to throw someone off a flight. If you use the word "fuck" in the context of a private conversation critical of the airline or its employees, and that remark is overheard, and you are then thrown off the flight in the absence of any complaint from other passengers on the basis of "profanity" alone, that's a good basis for a complaint against the airline, as it strongly suggests an abuse of authority by the employee making the decision.

(Edited to remark: we're well off topic now, aren't we?)

49: Off topic, but we may win the award for the most use of the word 'fuck' in an early reviewer thread :P

#50

It's always fun to break a record.