A Dance to the Music of Time GR 2013 - February: A Buyer's Market
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1Deern
Here's our discussion thread for the February volume A Buyer's Market!
Main thread: http://www.librarything.com/topic/147074
Main thread: http://www.librarything.com/topic/147074
2Deern
I started 2 days early, knowing that February will not only be a short but also a very busy month. And I am also trying to get through Les Misérables.
I plan to read 10-20 pages a day. I like this slow approach with this series, it gives me the time to enjoy the language and to look up references, like the painters mentioned here in the beginning.
Again I had difficulties with the way Powell just throws us into a situation, before introducing the characters first. Or is my memory so bad that I forgot Mr Deacon being mentioned in book 1? But around page 5 I started feeling comfortable again. For a change Nick's parents are mentioned here and it seems he grew up in that atmosphere of 'mild irony', no matter how exciting the time and circumstances must look for us readers nowadays. I mean - Paris during the peace conferences must have been such an interesting place, and again Nick seems completely unmoved by it all.
I plan to read 10-20 pages a day. I like this slow approach with this series, it gives me the time to enjoy the language and to look up references, like the painters mentioned here in the beginning.
Again I had difficulties with the way Powell just throws us into a situation, before introducing the characters first. Or is my memory so bad that I forgot Mr Deacon being mentioned in book 1? But around page 5 I started feeling comfortable again. For a change Nick's parents are mentioned here and it seems he grew up in that atmosphere of 'mild irony', no matter how exciting the time and circumstances must look for us readers nowadays. I mean - Paris during the peace conferences must have been such an interesting place, and again Nick seems completely unmoved by it all.
4JonnySaunders
Just finished Oliver Twist as my "phone" book (the book I read when out and about, or at night when I have no light) so will probably be starting this tonight.
I'm very much enjoying doing this monthly so far, the gap between the first 2 volumes has made me very excited the get back into it!
I'm very much enjoying doing this monthly so far, the gap between the first 2 volumes has made me very excited the get back into it!
5LizzieD
I very much agree, Jonny. Left to myself, I would have zoomed through the second volume and gotten bogged down in the third or fourth. It's happened before. This way I'll enjoy all twelve again!
6ALWINN
Jonny you kinda sound like me I always have 2 or 3 books going at the same time, and depends on where Im at and what Im doing that decide which book Im reading at that moment. I have an audio book that I listen to here at my desk at work. Then I have a live physical book then I have one one my kindle that I take with me when I have to wait or no other light because the other side of the bed is complaining about my light on.
7AnneDC
I'm over half way through this second volume and I'm getting caught up in wanting to know more about these people. Nick is a bit of a cipher. One question I have, though, is that one of the blurbs in my copy describes this as a "comic" work. Although I've noticed some comic moments (the sugar incident perhaps) I'm not really experiencing the books as comic. Am I missing something?
8Deern
Some little spoilers for chapter 1-3 ahead:
I'm in chapter 4 now, and although this one is also a reread I am still surprised how Widmerpool manages to turn up in the most unlikely circumstances. That dungeon scene was incredible. He is also the only character who(m?) I can perfectly picture, and I can't help liking him. And then he brought himself into a 'bad situation'. Who would have thought that?!
I am not so sure yet about Nick, our observer.
I'd like to learn at some point what his role is in this circle of old friends and acquaintances. What's his quality or social standing that makes people invite him to their dinners, dances and even country houses?
He has a job now with a small publishing house, buying art books. Does that pay him the rent of his 'rooms' (what are rooms? a flat? 2 rooms and a shared bath?) in that dubious London quarter? There must be some family money in the background to secure him and therefore allow him the adventure of living a wannabe bohemian life for a couple of years while all his often very rich friends see the need to get real jobs early in their life?
When I listened to the audio book last year I thought he was in love with Barbara with her not returning the feelings. Now reading the book I saw he hints at more. But I don't get those subtle hints. Did they have an affair or is he just one of her numerous admirers?
I'm in chapter 4 now, and although this one is also a reread I am still surprised how Widmerpool manages to turn up in the most unlikely circumstances. That dungeon scene was incredible. He is also the only character who(m?) I can perfectly picture, and I can't help liking him. And then he brought himself into a 'bad situation'. Who would have thought that?!
I am not so sure yet about Nick, our observer.
I'd like to learn at some point what his role is in this circle of old friends and acquaintances. What's his quality or social standing that makes people invite him to their dinners, dances and even country houses?
He has a job now with a small publishing house, buying art books. Does that pay him the rent of his 'rooms' (what are rooms? a flat? 2 rooms and a shared bath?) in that dubious London quarter? There must be some family money in the background to secure him and therefore allow him the adventure of living a wannabe bohemian life for a couple of years while all his often very rich friends see the need to get real jobs early in their life?
When I listened to the audio book last year I thought he was in love with Barbara with her not returning the feelings. Now reading the book I saw he hints at more. But I don't get those subtle hints. Did they have an affair or is he just one of her numerous admirers?
9Deern
Some quotes I marked (sadly I don't always have a pencil with me, so I lost many good stuff again in this 2nd book) - beware of little spoilers!
About Widmerpool:
I did not, however, as yet see him as one of those symbolic figures, of whom most people possess at least one example, if not more, round whom the past and the future have a way of assembling.
and
Widmerpool still represented to my mind a kind of embodiment of thankless labour and unsatisfied ambition
and
I still had no idea of Widmerpool's Christian name
and in chapter 3, instead of feeling just the tiniest bit of pity for Widmerpool:
I could not help admiring the calm manner in which Sir Magnus had accepted damage of the most irritating kind to his property: violation which, to rich or poor, must always represent, to a greater or lesser degree, assault upon themselves and their feelings.
(Did I miss sth here? It was an old flower pot - okay, 'stone urn' - with geraniums!).
My favorite Widmerpool quote, because so completely unexpected:
"A doctor was found"
*****
Miss Rosie(?) Manasch at the Huntercombes' (and an example why I'd be bored to death on those social dance events):
"Going home seems the only alternative to sitting among the coats", she said.
"Whatever for?"
"I comb my hair there."
"But does it need combing?"
"And while I tug at it, I cry"
*****
Barbara, when Nick tries to take her hand: "Oh, don't get sentimental".
How sad...
*****
Great example of how a couple of drinks can boost our self-confidence - Nick on his return from all the parties:
I found myself almost deciding to sit down, as soon as I reached my room, and attempt to compose a series of essays on human life and character in the manner of, say, Montaigne, so icily etched in my mind at that moment appeared the actions and nature of those with whom that night I had been spending my time. However, second thoughts convinced me that any such efforts at composition would be inadvisable at such an hour.
*****
Btw now that I got used to the writing I find that Nick writes quite a German English. Long sentences, many (often unnecessary) parentheses... If I didn't know how annoying the reading can be for many people, that's how I'd like to write. Yes, I know, I still use the parentheses and extra relative clauses frequently, but what you get to read has already been edited and re-edited! :-)
I would however spare my readers the over-pretentious expressions like the above quoted "assault upon themselves and their feelings".
About Widmerpool:
I did not, however, as yet see him as one of those symbolic figures, of whom most people possess at least one example, if not more, round whom the past and the future have a way of assembling.
and
Widmerpool still represented to my mind a kind of embodiment of thankless labour and unsatisfied ambition
and
I still had no idea of Widmerpool's Christian name
and in chapter 3, instead of feeling just the tiniest bit of pity for Widmerpool:
I could not help admiring the calm manner in which Sir Magnus had accepted damage of the most irritating kind to his property: violation which, to rich or poor, must always represent, to a greater or lesser degree, assault upon themselves and their feelings.
(Did I miss sth here? It was an old flower pot - okay, 'stone urn' - with geraniums!).
My favorite Widmerpool quote, because so completely unexpected:
"A doctor was found"
*****
Miss Rosie(?) Manasch at the Huntercombes' (and an example why I'd be bored to death on those social dance events):
"Going home seems the only alternative to sitting among the coats", she said.
"Whatever for?"
"I comb my hair there."
"But does it need combing?"
"And while I tug at it, I cry"
*****
Barbara, when Nick tries to take her hand: "Oh, don't get sentimental".
How sad...
*****
Great example of how a couple of drinks can boost our self-confidence - Nick on his return from all the parties:
I found myself almost deciding to sit down, as soon as I reached my room, and attempt to compose a series of essays on human life and character in the manner of, say, Montaigne, so icily etched in my mind at that moment appeared the actions and nature of those with whom that night I had been spending my time. However, second thoughts convinced me that any such efforts at composition would be inadvisable at such an hour.
*****
Btw now that I got used to the writing I find that Nick writes quite a German English. Long sentences, many (often unnecessary) parentheses... If I didn't know how annoying the reading can be for many people, that's how I'd like to write. Yes, I know, I still use the parentheses and extra relative clauses frequently, but what you get to read has already been edited and re-edited! :-)
I would however spare my readers the over-pretentious expressions like the above quoted "assault upon themselves and their feelings".
10brenzi
I finished the book tonight and I must say I enjoyed this book more than the introductory first book maybe because I'm getting to know the characters more. Templer did not make an appearance in this book so I don't know if that indicates that he is not as important or just nowhere to put him. I love the writing, even the long confaluted sentences. And we now know Widmerpool's first name! Yay!
I put these comments on my thread:
The characters are beginning to be fleshed out a little more completely by the author but the narrator, Nick Jenkins is still a complete cipher. I’m beginning to wonder if we will ever get to really know him.
We aregetting to know Widmerpoole whose awkwardness is still rather apparent and as a matter of fact he is dumped on, quite literally, by a young woman that both he and Nick have fallen for. At a dance, Barbara Goring dumps a sugar bowl over his head.
Most of the little action there is, takes place at one social event or another. In one night alone, Nick and his entourage attend a dinner followed by a dance followed by a party.
Nick attends the events with Mr. Deacon, an artist who is an old friend of his parents and his rather disreputable girlfriend Gypsy Jones. The last event they attend, Mrs. Adriadis’s party does not end well when she asks Mr. Deacon to leave. Nick’s old school chum Charles Stringham shows up and actually ends up getting married before the book ends..
I’m really enjoying this series and surprisingly, this slow pace (one volume per month) seems to be working for me. The writing is outstanding and I enjoy Powell’s dry sense of humor. In chapter two, Nick’s Uncle Giles makes an appearance again:
”Uncle Giles's standard of values was, in most matters, ill-adapted to employment by anyone except himself. At the same time, I can now perceive that by unhesitating contempt for all human conduct but his own -- judged among his immediate relatives as far from irreproachable -- he held up a mirror to emphasise latent imperfections of almost any situation that momentary enthusiasm might, in the first instance, have overlooked. His views, in fact, provided a yardstick to the proportions of which no earthly yard could possibly measure up.” (Page 96)
I love that!
I put these comments on my thread:
The characters are beginning to be fleshed out a little more completely by the author but the narrator, Nick Jenkins is still a complete cipher. I’m beginning to wonder if we will ever get to really know him.
We aregetting to know Widmerpoole whose awkwardness is still rather apparent and as a matter of fact he is dumped on, quite literally, by a young woman that both he and Nick have fallen for. At a dance, Barbara Goring dumps a sugar bowl over his head.
Most of the little action there is, takes place at one social event or another. In one night alone, Nick and his entourage attend a dinner followed by a dance followed by a party.
Nick attends the events with Mr. Deacon, an artist who is an old friend of his parents and his rather disreputable girlfriend Gypsy Jones. The last event they attend, Mrs. Adriadis’s party does not end well when she asks Mr. Deacon to leave. Nick’s old school chum Charles Stringham shows up and actually ends up getting married before the book ends..
I’m really enjoying this series and surprisingly, this slow pace (one volume per month) seems to be working for me. The writing is outstanding and I enjoy Powell’s dry sense of humor. In chapter two, Nick’s Uncle Giles makes an appearance again:
”Uncle Giles's standard of values was, in most matters, ill-adapted to employment by anyone except himself. At the same time, I can now perceive that by unhesitating contempt for all human conduct but his own -- judged among his immediate relatives as far from irreproachable -- he held up a mirror to emphasise latent imperfections of almost any situation that momentary enthusiasm might, in the first instance, have overlooked. His views, in fact, provided a yardstick to the proportions of which no earthly yard could possibly measure up.” (Page 96)
I love that!
11katiekrug
My thoughts:
This is the second in Powell' series of novels about upper-class British life in the inter-war period as observed by Nick Jenkins, an often ambivalent narrator. Here the focus is once again on Nick's social circle - all of the "action" occurs at dances and dinner parties and house parties. Nick himself is rarely in the center of things, and I find his dismissing of his old school-mate Widmerpoole as a mere hanger-on interesting, as I often get the impression Nick is playing a similar role. There are several mentions of the roles people play throughout the book, as if it all were a grand play rather than real life. That line from Shakespeare comes to mind: "It is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing."
This sounds harsher than I mean it to. I just think that perhaps right now Nick is observing life and imbuing it with meaning that is not there. I feel like the last lines of the novel are foreshadowing changes to come, that life - real life - will begin soon. This has all been merry amusement for the most part; I expect that as the world changes and begins to move toward economic crisis and war, Nick will continue to mature and to understand that what came before, despite the heartache and drama, was really rather frivolous and superficial.
This is the second in Powell' series of novels about upper-class British life in the inter-war period as observed by Nick Jenkins, an often ambivalent narrator. Here the focus is once again on Nick's social circle - all of the "action" occurs at dances and dinner parties and house parties. Nick himself is rarely in the center of things, and I find his dismissing of his old school-mate Widmerpoole as a mere hanger-on interesting, as I often get the impression Nick is playing a similar role. There are several mentions of the roles people play throughout the book, as if it all were a grand play rather than real life. That line from Shakespeare comes to mind: "It is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing."
This sounds harsher than I mean it to. I just think that perhaps right now Nick is observing life and imbuing it with meaning that is not there. I feel like the last lines of the novel are foreshadowing changes to come, that life - real life - will begin soon. This has all been merry amusement for the most part; I expect that as the world changes and begins to move toward economic crisis and war, Nick will continue to mature and to understand that what came before, despite the heartache and drama, was really rather frivolous and superficial.
12LizzieD
I'm lagging behind this month although I will finish with the end of the month. I'm wondering, though, why AP chooses to have Nick analyze persons and situations from Uncle Giles's viewpoint. Nick doesn't subscribe to UG's thought patterns. Is it just that Nick is too young yet to know what he will think as an adult? I'm agreeing with Katie's last paragraph.
As to Nick's dismissal of Widmerpool, I blush to admit to thinking and treating people that I perceived as odd in exactly the same way that Nick does. Nick clearly belongs in these circles by virtue of birth in a way that Widmerpool can't because of his family background, which we get a glimpse of in this book.
Read on, my friends! I'll catch up.
As to Nick's dismissal of Widmerpool, I blush to admit to thinking and treating people that I perceived as odd in exactly the same way that Nick does. Nick clearly belongs in these circles by virtue of birth in a way that Widmerpool can't because of his family background, which we get a glimpse of in this book.
Read on, my friends! I'll catch up.
13Donna828
I finished Book Two yesterday. Spoilers ahead! Like Nathalie, I thought maybe I had forgotten Mr. Deacon as a character because A Buyer's Market starts out with no introduction of him whatsoever. We quickly learn that he is an old friend of the family and that he is a so-so painter who is now dealing in antiques. The dance continues as Jenkins and Widerpool continue to get thrown together. Loved the sugar bowl incident. While it wasn't LOL funny, it was humorous, especially the description of W's appearance: "The sugar sparkled on him like hoar-frost..."
The action picks up when they leave the party and meet Charles Strickham by accident and then run into Mr. Deacon and Gypsy Jones. What a name! Poor girl doesn't have a chance to be considered as one of the debutants! Apparently that doesn't matter to either Widmerpool or Nick Jenkins. Speaking of names, I'm glad we finally learned W's first name. Kenneth is much easier to type repeatedly than Widmerpool! Question? I notice some people put an "e" at the end of W's name but my edition spells it without the silent "e". Anyone know which is the correct spelling?
My thoughts: a few too many social events though I do see their place in the story. I wish we had been invited to Strickham's wedding to give us a little more variety of social settings. I am ready for life to begin in earnest at last which is hinted at in the last paragraph! I am not giving up, but this is slow stuff even for me who enjoys introspective writing. Peggy, I also wondered about the influence of Uncle Giles on Nick's thoughts. I suspect we will see more of him in future installments.
The action picks up when they leave the party and meet Charles Strickham by accident and then run into Mr. Deacon and Gypsy Jones. What a name! Poor girl doesn't have a chance to be considered as one of the debutants! Apparently that doesn't matter to either Widmerpool or Nick Jenkins. Speaking of names, I'm glad we finally learned W's first name. Kenneth is much easier to type repeatedly than Widmerpool! Question? I notice some people put an "e" at the end of W's name but my edition spells it without the silent "e". Anyone know which is the correct spelling?
My thoughts: a few too many social events though I do see their place in the story. I wish we had been invited to Strickham's wedding to give us a little more variety of social settings. I am ready for life to begin in earnest at last which is hinted at in the last paragraph! I am not giving up, but this is slow stuff even for me who enjoys introspective writing. Peggy, I also wondered about the influence of Uncle Giles on Nick's thoughts. I suspect we will see more of him in future installments.
14katiekrug
I sort of see Uncle G as representative of the questioning of the social order and while he is dismissed by his family, including Nick, his influence has penetrated Nick's consciousness, causing Nick to view things slightly askance. Like he knows what he should think and he lives for the most part in keeping with that but there is always this nagging little voice questioning it - its meaning, its value, its purpose, etc.
15LizzieD
That's interesting, Katie. Thanks for an answer. I'm also wondering how old you all think Nick is as he narrates this.
"Widmerpoole?" I don't think I've ever seen it spelled that way, Donna, and I'm too lazy to check back through the thread to see. I have three different editions of the books, and those three are consistently non-e.
"Widmerpoole?" I don't think I've ever seen it spelled that way, Donna, and I'm too lazy to check back through the thread to see. I have three different editions of the books, and those three are consistently non-e.
16katiekrug
I thought he was about 27-29?
Re: Kenneth's last name, I could swear it had an "e" on the end but I went and checked my edition and lo and behold, there is no "e"! So weird....
Re: Kenneth's last name, I could swear it had an "e" on the end but I went and checked my edition and lo and behold, there is no "e"! So weird....
17LizzieD
Katie, I think that's a logical guess based on what we've read so far. The whole series covers about 40 years, I think, and I can't for the life of me remember whether he ever catches up with himself so to speak. Seems as though these are mighty definite memories.
I can't call Widmerpool anything but "Widmerpool" no matter how long it takes to type it. I'm not even sure I could call him Wmp.....
I can't call Widmerpool anything but "Widmerpool" no matter how long it takes to type it. I'm not even sure I could call him Wmp.....
18Deern
In my head, Jenkins is younger in the second book, in his early 20s. He still seems a bit immature, like Katie said - always watching and considering how others might judge a situation, careful not to take sides too quickly.
The selection of the social events was interesting as well. We don't get the 'really important ones', like weddings. Instead, Powell constrcuted a night where it was possible to weave in almost all characters we had met before, no matter how different they might be.
I wondered who might be Nick's regular friends/ acquaintances if he runs into Stringham/ Widmerpool/ Templer/ Uncle Giles only every couple of years. He can't lead such a solitary life normally? We still know nothing about his work and haven't met any co-workers yet.
Re. Gypsy Jones: when I listened to the audio last year, I completely missed the 'couch incident' and even this time I had to read the paragraph twice because it was so subtly expressed. It made me a bit sad to see Gypsy as this girl who just lets things happen, knowing she isn't even liked by the men she sleeps with. For me she doesn't feel like a strong woman living a free life, it's more like she is used to being used.
The selection of the social events was interesting as well. We don't get the 'really important ones', like weddings. Instead, Powell constrcuted a night where it was possible to weave in almost all characters we had met before, no matter how different they might be.
I wondered who might be Nick's regular friends/ acquaintances if he runs into Stringham/ Widmerpool/ Templer/ Uncle Giles only every couple of years. He can't lead such a solitary life normally? We still know nothing about his work and haven't met any co-workers yet.
Re. Gypsy Jones: when I listened to the audio last year, I completely missed the 'couch incident' and even this time I had to read the paragraph twice because it was so subtly expressed. It made me a bit sad to see Gypsy as this girl who just lets things happen, knowing she isn't even liked by the men she sleeps with. For me she doesn't feel like a strong woman living a free life, it's more like she is used to being used.
19kaggsy
I'm also struggling a little to get going with this and am making my way slowly through. Nick is a very formal kind of narrator so I just find I have to adjust to his mindset. I may run on into next month but will try and catch up!
20LizzieD
Well, what happened to my last post? Shoot. I'll duplicate what I can remember.....I did finish.
I think that since the books aren't really about Nick, he doesn't feel any need to enlighten us about his own everyday life. Of course, I have the advantage of knowing who they are really about!
I think that Barnby said the most helpful thing about Gypsy Jones. She really is middle class and a bit lost.
That is the world's most subtle seduction scene, isn't it?
And don't you love that Widmerpool tells Nick that they know each other well enough to use first names, and then calls him "Nicholas"?
This is not one of my favorite volumes, so I'm looking forward to moving on to The Acceptance World!
I think that since the books aren't really about Nick, he doesn't feel any need to enlighten us about his own everyday life. Of course, I have the advantage of knowing who they are really about!
I think that Barnby said the most helpful thing about Gypsy Jones. She really is middle class and a bit lost.
That is the world's most subtle seduction scene, isn't it?
And don't you love that Widmerpool tells Nick that they know each other well enough to use first names, and then calls him "Nicholas"?
This is not one of my favorite volumes, so I'm looking forward to moving on to The Acceptance World!
21kaggsy
Finally finished this (a little late) and my review is here:
https://kaggsysbookishramblings.wordpress.com/2013/03/08/recent-reads-a-buyers-m...
https://kaggsysbookishramblings.wordpress.com/2013/03/08/recent-reads-a-buyers-m...
22Deern
Wonderful review and great quotes. Makes me almost want to reread the book already. :-)
Spoilers coming:
Widmerpool's surprise appearance in the dungeon is hilarious!
I wasn't 100% sure about the pregnancy - sure he paid for the abortion, but I understood from Barnby's hints that either there was no pregnancy (and Gypsy was just after the money) or that it wasn't granted W. was the father - he was just the one most likely to pay.
Spoilers coming:
Widmerpool's surprise appearance in the dungeon is hilarious!
I wasn't 100% sure about the pregnancy - sure he paid for the abortion, but I understood from Barnby's hints that either there was no pregnancy (and Gypsy was just after the money) or that it wasn't granted W. was the father - he was just the one most likely to pay.
