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1countrylife
Have been a member since April 30, when I first started inputting my books. Had some questions, so went to groups for answers. What a mess! THAT is a most unwieldy part of LT! It took DAYS to get through that list to find what I was interested in. (Yes, I tried "search", but some people word their group names in rather obscure ways, so still needed to read through that list.)
Well, I ran into Tim's post, wherein he actually listed LT's competitors, and in my frustration over "groups", I tried MANY of them. And, like so many of you have noted as well, I came back here. LibraryThing is definitely the BEST!
But that "groups" page! It gave me a headache every time I went there. Finally, I determined to see if I could possibly categorize them myself. If it was something that the powers-that-be were considering doing, anyway, perhaps it would be a jump-start. About two thirds of the way through the job, I found the discussion “grouping groups”, begun by Morphidae. I was really excited to think that the nightmare of “Groups” was going to be straightened out. Morphidae had such a great start, and so many excellent ideas showed up in that conversation. But, then it appeared that she decided to drop the task since it was going to be handled eventually, anyway. Well, at THAT point, I was so far along, I wanted to see how it turned out. So, I incorporated the ideas from that discussion into my notes, and kept going.
Well, I ran into Tim's post, wherein he actually listed LT's competitors, and in my frustration over "groups", I tried MANY of them. And, like so many of you have noted as well, I came back here. LibraryThing is definitely the BEST!
But that "groups" page! It gave me a headache every time I went there. Finally, I determined to see if I could possibly categorize them myself. If it was something that the powers-that-be were considering doing, anyway, perhaps it would be a jump-start. About two thirds of the way through the job, I found the discussion “grouping groups”, begun by Morphidae. I was really excited to think that the nightmare of “Groups” was going to be straightened out. Morphidae had such a great start, and so many excellent ideas showed up in that conversation. But, then it appeared that she decided to drop the task since it was going to be handled eventually, anyway. Well, at THAT point, I was so far along, I wanted to see how it turned out. So, I incorporated the ideas from that discussion into my notes, and kept going.
2countrylife
My goal was to figure out from the clues given in the group names/descriptions, how those groups might want to classify themselves, and then to create categories based on that information.
Made snap judgments based on the name of the group, or if necessary, clicking on the link to read their own introduction to themselves, so of course, much room for error.
As I progressed, and it became clear that there should be separate categories for groups which I had previously classed elsewhere, I did not go back to reclassify previous ones; just let the information continue to define the structure on which I was working.
I am not commenting on putting restrictions on new users or any of the other talk which I’ve read pertaining to groups. I am addressing here only the divisions of groups for the purpose of finding things more easily. And, I am not trying to force groups into the categories with which I labeled them, this exercise was just for the sake of getting things grouped on paper, in order to have possible categories for the groups themselves to choose from.
Made snap judgments based on the name of the group, or if necessary, clicking on the link to read their own introduction to themselves, so of course, much room for error.
As I progressed, and it became clear that there should be separate categories for groups which I had previously classed elsewhere, I did not go back to reclassify previous ones; just let the information continue to define the structure on which I was working.
I am not commenting on putting restrictions on new users or any of the other talk which I’ve read pertaining to groups. I am addressing here only the divisions of groups for the purpose of finding things more easily. And, I am not trying to force groups into the categories with which I labeled them, this exercise was just for the sake of getting things grouped on paper, in order to have possible categories for the groups themselves to choose from.
3countrylife
I finished the job today. I originally cut & pasted that list into Excel on June 4, at which time there were 2,172 groups. As I added up my numbers today, I count 2,170, so I messed up somewhere along the way. But, at least it gives a bit of an idea what’s there in “Groups”. If anyone would like to see my Categories list, or the spreadsheet with the finished groups sorted (and will tell me how to do so), I will be happy to share it with you. (Although, after hubby gets home, I shan’t be online, so will check this thread tomorrow.) As far as BROAD categories went, they fell like this:
Groups defined by Topics Discussed: 1182
Library Thing: 75
Books: 513
Disciplines: 130
Socio-Political: 181
Leisure & Personal: 283
Groups defined by Membership: 963
Deleted groups or couldn’t translate: 25
Groups defined by Topics Discussed: 1182
Library Thing: 75
Books: 513
Disciplines: 130
Socio-Political: 181
Leisure & Personal: 283
Groups defined by Membership: 963
Deleted groups or couldn’t translate: 25
4countrylife
A suggestion for LibraryThing:
Begin with a fresh “page” which is seen when someone clicks on "groups", saying that each new group formed must first use the handy search to see if their proposed group already exists. THEN they may create a new group, choosing one or two categories from the list provided, under which to identify itself, thereby making future groups self-sorting. Give current groups one or two months to choose their categories, after which, they will have categories chosen FOR them.
Begin with a fresh “page” which is seen when someone clicks on "groups", saying that each new group formed must first use the handy search to see if their proposed group already exists. THEN they may create a new group, choosing one or two categories from the list provided, under which to identify itself, thereby making future groups self-sorting. Give current groups one or two months to choose their categories, after which, they will have categories chosen FOR them.
5countrylife
Personally, I don’t really care what the categories are. If LT decides to start utilizing Cutter classification (or anything else) somehow, perhaps align some group categories along those lines. LT powers may already have some sort of a list, or they can mess with mine. My wish is just to have it easier to use that part of LT. Phhhewww, now that THAT’s off my mind .... I can go back to adding books!
7timspalding
I'm certainly impressed by the industry here. What a job. I'm amazed. Humbled, even.
But I think readafew is right. Tags are a powerful way to organize things that don't fit perfectly into boxes. Since almost nothing does—except other boxes—well...
Anyone else?
But I think readafew is right. Tags are a powerful way to organize things that don't fit perfectly into boxes. Since almost nothing does—except other boxes—well...
Anyone else?
8infiniteletters
What about them there boxes of tag bundles? :)
9reading_fox
But finding an existing group through tags (assuming you give only the creator the freedom to tag as they feel fit) produces the same issue as you currently have - that you have to allow for every individual idiosyncracy in your search terms.
the search works correctly, IF you know what to search for.
I like tags, and a group tag page, and LT group tag cloud would be good things.
But I feel that this may be one small area where some form of imposed structure may actually be beneficial.
the search works correctly, IF you know what to search for.
I like tags, and a group tag page, and LT group tag cloud would be good things.
But I feel that this may be one small area where some form of imposed structure may actually be beneficial.
10timspalding
But I wonder about categories. I have no interest in the (huge) category "groups about things." I'm interested in the things...
11bluesalamanders
All the discussions I've seen on this subject keep going back to tags, tags, tags. And I agree - I think that is the best option. We tried, in another discussion, to come up with a more complete set - or more subsets, I guess - of group catagories, and ended up with lots of dissention.
(Edited to finish an, er, incomplete sentence)
(Edited to finish an, er, incomplete sentence)
12myshelves
If being under a category for "things" (not under one for "people") helped you to find the "things," where's the problem?
Or how about recruiting some LT librarians to propose tags for the groups, subject to Abby's approval as official LT Librarian?
Or how about recruiting some LT librarians to propose tags for the groups, subject to Abby's approval as official LT Librarian?
13bluesalamanders
myshelves -
Really? I mean, you really think a few librarians should go through 2,000+ groups and tag them, and that Abby should have to approve all of the tags? That seems like an awful lot of work for both the librarians and for Abby. Why not given each group a maximum number of tags that they can use (say, 10 or something) and let the group owners tag them?
Really? I mean, you really think a few librarians should go through 2,000+ groups and tag them, and that Abby should have to approve all of the tags? That seems like an awful lot of work for both the librarians and for Abby. Why not given each group a maximum number of tags that they can use (say, 10 or something) and let the group owners tag them?
14myshelves
#12
Did I say "should"? I don't think I did. I suggested that they could be asked.
Do you think that a bunch of combiners "should" spend hours trying to straighten out the messes on author pages, only to have someone come along and re-create the messes. You sure as hell couldn't pay me to do it, but we do strange things as volunteers.
Edited to add that countrylife, one person, went through all of the groups on his/her own, out of a desire to improve the site.
Did I say "should"? I don't think I did. I suggested that they could be asked.
Do you think that a bunch of combiners "should" spend hours trying to straighten out the messes on author pages, only to have someone come along and re-create the messes. You sure as hell couldn't pay me to do it, but we do strange things as volunteers.
Edited to add that countrylife, one person, went through all of the groups on his/her own, out of a desire to improve the site.
15jmnlman
I also shutter to think of what sort of creative tags some of the political groups for example will get. Considering some of the Amazon examples Tim wrote about in an earlier blog post.
17bluesalamanders
14 myshelves
Ok, let me rephrase that.
As the owner (term used loosely, of course) of two groups, I wouldn't want someone else, who may or may not be a member, who may or may not understand the topic or purpose of them, to try to tag them.
Ok, let me rephrase that.
As the owner (term used loosely, of course) of two groups, I wouldn't want someone else, who may or may not be a member, who may or may not understand the topic or purpose of them, to try to tag them.
18myshelves
#17
I think that's a different point.
If the group descriptions can't be understood by a librarian or other literate person, I guess they could be tagged "Other." We'd be no worse off than we are now.
No reason that owners couldn't suggest tags for their groups. But some owners may no longer be active on LT. And some who are currently very, if randomly, active might not be the best ones to do it.
I think that's a different point.
If the group descriptions can't be understood by a librarian or other literate person, I guess they could be tagged "Other." We'd be no worse off than we are now.
No reason that owners couldn't suggest tags for their groups. But some owners may no longer be active on LT. And some who are currently very, if randomly, active might not be the best ones to do it.
19bluesalamanders
18 myshelves
Just out of curiosity, what's with your numbers?
And it's not a different point - at least, it's essentially what I meant the first time, I just phrased it badly. Just because the description of a group is understandable to a librarian or other literate person doesn't mean they'd know what sort of tags would be appropriate. Would you know what sort of tags, for instance, to put on a jewelry-related-books group?
Just out of curiosity, what's with your numbers?
And it's not a different point - at least, it's essentially what I meant the first time, I just phrased it badly. Just because the description of a group is understandable to a librarian or other literate person doesn't mean they'd know what sort of tags would be appropriate. Would you know what sort of tags, for instance, to put on a jewelry-related-books group?
20myshelves
#19,
Didn't look closely enough for the number to reference. I'll edit.
Not having read the description, I might start out with "jewelry." The description might give a clue for more tags ---designing or collecting or whatever, but "jewelry" alone would probably be a big help to someone looking for jewelry-related books groups.
I thought librarians might do a better job because they'd know the subjects used for such books.
Didn't look closely enough for the number to reference. I'll edit.
Not having read the description, I might start out with "jewelry." The description might give a clue for more tags ---designing or collecting or whatever, but "jewelry" alone would probably be a big help to someone looking for jewelry-related books groups.
I thought librarians might do a better job because they'd know the subjects used for such books.
21infiniteletters
Trust me, you don't want Library of Congress Subject Headings on Groups.
Really.
Really.
23infiniteletters
Cookery, anyone?
24bluesalamanders
20 myshelves
That's my point. Jewelry is a good start, but I could come up with probably a dozen other tags off the top of my head that people would use to try to find it - starting with jewellery.
That's my point. Jewelry is a good start, but I could come up with probably a dozen other tags off the top of my head that people would use to try to find it - starting with jewellery.
25countrylife
Speaking of tags (or categories for tags), here are the categories, as I saw them shaping up during my project. (I am going to copy/paste from excel, so not sure how this will look.)
26countrylife
GROUPS DEFINED BY TOPICS DISCUSSED:
LIBRARYTHING:
LIBRARYTHING site specific talk
FAQs & FYI faq's, fyi, helps & helpers, LT issue specific - taxonomy, combining, tagging, outreach, etc.
LT improvements changes we'd like to see, bugs to report
Games on LT group writes, haunted soda, etc.
LT other programs, taxonomy, tests, workers & their work, outside
LT social talk library comparisons, orphans; romance; LT changed me, affected life, where LT leads,
LT translating & language
LIBRARYTHING:
LIBRARYTHING site specific talk
FAQs & FYI faq's, fyi, helps & helpers, LT issue specific - taxonomy, combining, tagging, outreach, etc.
LT improvements changes we'd like to see, bugs to report
Games on LT group writes, haunted soda, etc.
LT other programs, taxonomy, tests, workers & their work, outside
LT social talk library comparisons, orphans; romance; LT changed me, affected life, where LT leads,
LT translating & language
27countrylife
BOOKS:
AUTHORS, ILLUSTRATORS & OTHER BOOK-MAKERS Groups talking about a specific author, group or type of authors. Also groups of writers and new authors.
Author specific fans of a particular author
Authors - groups & types female authors, one hit wonders, literary cemetary, etc.
New Writers new writers, fanfic, getting published, desktop publishing
Other folks in the book-making process Illustrators & graphic designers, copywriters, editors & editing, researchers, translators
BOOK SPECIFIC About specific books, titles, series, publishers; or magazines.
Book specific
Series or character specific
Publisher specific
Magazine specific
BOOK GENERAL General book talk
Booklists canon, suggested reading lists, wishlists, etc.
Catch-all catch-all, book events
Playing with books book spotting, one-liners, passages, quotes
Reading reading games & projects, group reads, what we're reading, book reading discussions
Recommendations
Reviews, blurbs
Specialist books first eds, book collectors, rare, literary prizes
What was that book? help remembering the title
BOOK PHYSICAL (THAT PHYSICAL ITEM - A BOOK) Groups talking about libraries, ways of getting books, book care & repair.
About the physical book covers, typography, book care & repair, history of the book
Methods of acquiring books swapping, library sales, thrift stores
Fun with books and book things bookish things - book marks, book shelves & libraries, things found in books,
GENRES & TYPES
AUTHORS, ILLUSTRATORS & OTHER BOOK-MAKERS Groups talking about a specific author, group or type of authors. Also groups of writers and new authors.
Author specific fans of a particular author
Authors - groups & types female authors, one hit wonders, literary cemetary, etc.
New Writers new writers, fanfic, getting published, desktop publishing
Other folks in the book-making process Illustrators & graphic designers, copywriters, editors & editing, researchers, translators
BOOK SPECIFIC About specific books, titles, series, publishers; or magazines.
Book specific
Series or character specific
Publisher specific
Magazine specific
BOOK GENERAL General book talk
Booklists canon, suggested reading lists, wishlists, etc.
Catch-all catch-all, book events
Playing with books book spotting, one-liners, passages, quotes
Reading reading games & projects, group reads, what we're reading, book reading discussions
Recommendations
Reviews, blurbs
Specialist books first eds, book collectors, rare, literary prizes
What was that book? help remembering the title
BOOK PHYSICAL (THAT PHYSICAL ITEM - A BOOK) Groups talking about libraries, ways of getting books, book care & repair.
About the physical book covers, typography, book care & repair, history of the book
Methods of acquiring books swapping, library sales, thrift stores
Fun with books and book things bookish things - book marks, book shelves & libraries, things found in books,
GENRES & TYPES
28countrylife
DISCIPLINES (combine with genres?):
DISCIPLINES IN CAREER OR EDUCATION If you think of it as work, or an educational field, look for groups talking about it here.
(careers/ profession / occupation / field / lifework / vocation / labor / employment )
Geography
Sociology, social sciences, anthropology conflict management? Futurists?
Law
Education
Language & Literature
Science & nature
Medicine & psychology
Agriculture, Ecology, Environment
Technology, Engineering, Computer computer, knowledge management, disaster buffs
Planning, marketing, networking
Military, Naval & War
Library Science librarians & booksellers
DISCIPLINES IN CAREER OR EDUCATION If you think of it as work, or an educational field, look for groups talking about it here.
(careers/ profession / occupation / field / lifework / vocation / labor / employment )
Geography
Sociology, social sciences, anthropology conflict management? Futurists?
Law
Education
Language & Literature
Science & nature
Medicine & psychology
Agriculture, Ecology, Environment
Technology, Engineering, Computer computer, knowledge management, disaster buffs
Planning, marketing, networking
Military, Naval & War
Library Science librarians & booksellers
29countrylife
SOCIO-POLITICAL:
BELIEFS (includes religion / spirituality / non-theists / philosophy / occult / )
Philosophy & philosophers
Religion
POLITICS & political movements
SOCIAL & CIVIC
Social Topics adoption, addiction, obesity, fuel, war
Civic civic/social groups, institutions - masons, girl scouts, peace corp., social entrepeneurs
Global Society, international relations hands across the sea, etc.
Cultural japanese tea ceremony
BELIEFS (includes religion / spirituality / non-theists / philosophy / occult / )
Philosophy & philosophers
Religion
POLITICS & political movements
SOCIAL & CIVIC
Social Topics adoption, addiction, obesity, fuel, war
Civic civic/social groups, institutions - masons, girl scouts, peace corp., social entrepeneurs
Global Society, international relations hands across the sea, etc.
Cultural japanese tea ceremony
30countrylife
LEISURE & PERSONAL:
SPORTS & LEISURE (the creative - per Morphidae)
Hobbies birding, games & online gamers, geneology, photography, reenacting, SCA, collecting, storytelling
crafting - beading, jewelry, needlework, papercraft
Sports Yep, groups talking about sports.
Social networking \ combine? Vox, MySpace, Blogging, internet communities, etc.
On-Line & On-Air stuff / fans of particular websites (wikipedia, cartoon sites) or radio programs (BBC, NPR), podcasting
Travel travel, outdoor adventures, hunting/fishing, amusement parks
HOMELIFE & PERSONAL home, food, clothing, health, pets
Home, garden, pets & auto pets, gardening, home
Food & Clothing Groups talking about food or drink, dining, cookbooks, etc. & clothing, inc. jewelry, body art…
Health & wellness Health & body, pregnancy, productivity
Relationships & Family Parenting, caregiving, geneology, personality types, etiquette
ARTS & ENTERTAINMENT Groups talking about movies, tv, music, art, etc.
Art
Movies & actors
Music & artists
TV
Theatre
A&E - other Writer, director, producer, creator, cross-platform, artsblog
SPORTS & LEISURE (the creative - per Morphidae)
Hobbies birding, games & online gamers, geneology, photography, reenacting, SCA, collecting, storytelling
crafting - beading, jewelry, needlework, papercraft
Sports Yep, groups talking about sports.
Social networking \ combine? Vox, MySpace, Blogging, internet communities, etc.
On-Line & On-Air stuff / fans of particular websites (wikipedia, cartoon sites) or radio programs (BBC, NPR), podcasting
Travel travel, outdoor adventures, hunting/fishing, amusement parks
HOMELIFE & PERSONAL home, food, clothing, health, pets
Home, garden, pets & auto pets, gardening, home
Food & Clothing Groups talking about food or drink, dining, cookbooks, etc. & clothing, inc. jewelry, body art…
Health & wellness Health & body, pregnancy, productivity
Relationships & Family Parenting, caregiving, geneology, personality types, etiquette
ARTS & ENTERTAINMENT Groups talking about movies, tv, music, art, etc.
Art
Movies & actors
Music & artists
TV
Theatre
A&E - other Writer, director, producer, creator, cross-platform, artsblog
31countrylife
GROUPS DEFINED BY MEMBERSHIP:
MEMBERSHIP DEFINED
Families & Friends groups
Private by invitation only
Offsite groups These are the LT versions of off-site groups (book clubs, online groups, work groups, etc.)
Universities & schools inc. homeschools, fraternities, teachers groups, etc.
Libraries
Service - Arms of Service Marines,
General Unknown / difficult to define, misc. silliness & very general groups - need to be categorized
By Age Defined by age of groups members - teens, over 60, under 30
Ethnicity latin, black,
Geographical & language Groups talking ABOUT a specific area, country, city, etc. Or groups FROM a specific area, country, city, etc. talking about anything!
Self-described labels singles, rednecks, mensa, otherkin, eclectic,
Sex & gender inc. gender identity, alternative sexuality, feminists
Shared experience holocaust, native, DIY
MEMBERSHIP DEFINED
Families & Friends groups
Private by invitation only
Offsite groups These are the LT versions of off-site groups (book clubs, online groups, work groups, etc.)
Universities & schools inc. homeschools, fraternities, teachers groups, etc.
Libraries
Service - Arms of Service Marines,
General Unknown / difficult to define, misc. silliness & very general groups - need to be categorized
By Age Defined by age of groups members - teens, over 60, under 30
Ethnicity latin, black,
Geographical & language Groups talking ABOUT a specific area, country, city, etc. Or groups FROM a specific area, country, city, etc. talking about anything!
Self-described labels singles, rednecks, mensa, otherkin, eclectic,
Sex & gender inc. gender identity, alternative sexuality, feminists
Shared experience holocaust, native, DIY
32countrylife
Well, it doesn't look as clear as it does on excel. The subcategories & secondary descriptions kind of look garbled. But, that's the end of my list!
33myshelves
Speaking of jewelry/jewellery or genealogy/geneology, isn't it possible to have a search that is not so rigid?
Google search corrects my spelling all the time "Did you mean ___?" and genealogy sites use a soundex search that will find most variants of a word. A search for "jewel" or "gene" should also bring up both versions.
countrylife,
I don't think I saw history or archaeology anywhere in there.
Google search corrects my spelling all the time "Did you mean ___?" and genealogy sites use a soundex search that will find most variants of a word. A search for "jewel" or "gene" should also bring up both versions.
countrylife,
I don't think I saw history or archaeology anywhere in there.
34bluesalamanders
countrylife -
This is why I think tags would be better. I looked for Art and Jewelry under Disciplines. They're not just hobbies, though obviously that is one catagory they fall under.
This is why I think tags would be better. I looked for Art and Jewelry under Disciplines. They're not just hobbies, though obviously that is one catagory they fall under.
35_Zoe_
I think tags would work, but only if they could be applied by anyone. The tagging system for books works well, and books end up with relevant tags and tag clouds because everyone can contribute. I'd like to have a field on each group page where I can enter my own tags for the group, and then each group could have a tag cloud like books do.
37countrylife
#33 and #34,
I wasn’t trying to be all-inclusive here; I just wanted to see how groups “fell” into place (in my own mind, anyway!). Obviously, there could be many more than even the categories you mentioned. And, as I said before, I don’t really care what the categories are. I would just like to see the Groups page cleaned up. It is the saddest part of LT, and almost kept me away from joining. I am just a plain old mother of five, who was so put off by “Groups”, that I wanted to do something about it, so that others wouldn’t be.
But, it sounds like tagging is the way to go. I just don’t see how that would clean up the Groups mess. I wonder if it would be possible to funnel groups into a few broad categories, wherein they can tag away. But seekers could find groups more easily, if there was SOME kind of sorting.
I wasn’t trying to be all-inclusive here; I just wanted to see how groups “fell” into place (in my own mind, anyway!). Obviously, there could be many more than even the categories you mentioned. And, as I said before, I don’t really care what the categories are. I would just like to see the Groups page cleaned up. It is the saddest part of LT, and almost kept me away from joining. I am just a plain old mother of five, who was so put off by “Groups”, that I wanted to do something about it, so that others wouldn’t be.
But, it sounds like tagging is the way to go. I just don’t see how that would clean up the Groups mess. I wonder if it would be possible to funnel groups into a few broad categories, wherein they can tag away. But seekers could find groups more easily, if there was SOME kind of sorting.
38countrylife
Maybe just 5 very broad groups:
“LIBRARYTHING” – site specific talk (FAQs, improvements, translating, social talk, games, etc.) (75).
“BOOKS” – including (1) groups talking about specific books, authors, illustrators, publishers, etc.; (2) general book talk (what we’re reading, recommendations, reviews, booklists, etc.; (3) Other bookish things (care & repair, typography, bookshelves, bookmarks); (4) Genres and types. (513)
“DISCIPLINES & SOCIO-POLITICAL” – including things like science & nature; education; ecology, environment & agriculture; military, naval & war; law; medicine; etc. and also things like philosophy & religion; politics; social topics and civic items. (311)
“LEISURE & PERSONAL” – groups talking about (1) “sports and leisure” (hobbies, sports, travel & outdoor adventure, social networking & online & onair stuff), (2) “homelife & personal” (home & garden, food & clothing, health & wellness, relationships, family & pets), (3) “arts and entertainment” (movies, music, theatre, art, tv ...) (283)
“GROUPS DEFINED BY MEMBERSHIP ATTRIBUTES”, wherein one would find groups of “families and friends” (117), “private” (208), “universities and schools” (151), “offsite groups” (real book clubs, groups from work, etc.) (165), “geographical, language & ethnic groups” (Ireland, latin, Floridians, etc.) (233), and other “self-described labels” (rednecks, teens, singles, gays, mensa...) (40), etc. (963 altogether)
countrylife.key groups mess
“LIBRARYTHING” – site specific talk (FAQs, improvements, translating, social talk, games, etc.) (75).
“BOOKS” – including (1) groups talking about specific books, authors, illustrators, publishers, etc.; (2) general book talk (what we’re reading, recommendations, reviews, booklists, etc.; (3) Other bookish things (care & repair, typography, bookshelves, bookmarks); (4) Genres and types. (513)
“DISCIPLINES & SOCIO-POLITICAL” – including things like science & nature; education; ecology, environment & agriculture; military, naval & war; law; medicine; etc. and also things like philosophy & religion; politics; social topics and civic items. (311)
“LEISURE & PERSONAL” – groups talking about (1) “sports and leisure” (hobbies, sports, travel & outdoor adventure, social networking & online & onair stuff), (2) “homelife & personal” (home & garden, food & clothing, health & wellness, relationships, family & pets), (3) “arts and entertainment” (movies, music, theatre, art, tv ...) (283)
“GROUPS DEFINED BY MEMBERSHIP ATTRIBUTES”, wherein one would find groups of “families and friends” (117), “private” (208), “universities and schools” (151), “offsite groups” (real book clubs, groups from work, etc.) (165), “geographical, language & ethnic groups” (Ireland, latin, Floridians, etc.) (233), and other “self-described labels” (rednecks, teens, singles, gays, mensa...) (40), etc. (963 altogether)
countrylife.key groups mess
39countrylife
The numbers are from my project, and just to help us “see” how things might flow. Groups might choose different tags. My descriptions are just for the sake of discussion.
40myshelves
I do like the thought of an option to view a list of groups (with or without tags) under broad categories. When the current number of groups doubles, then doubles again, we'll need all the help we can get.
41mvrdrk
I agree there needs to be some kind of sorting. Search is wonderful, but I find it isn't as serendipitous.
42myshelves
Just noticed a new group for posting your favorite quotes/quotations.
How many does that make, countrylife? 4? 5?
Wouldn't it be nice if they could have found the existing groups more easily, and would all join up?
How many does that make, countrylife? 4? 5?
Wouldn't it be nice if they could have found the existing groups more easily, and would all join up?
43lilypadma
Tags would be nice; I'd like to see them. But categories would make it easier to stumble on something interesting that I didn't think of searching for.
44readafew
Well I would 'assume' that if tags were implemented there would be a Tag Cloud for the groups as well, to browse for interesting things.
45infiniteletters
Browse and Search are different; they each have their pros and cons, but there's nothing wrong with having both.
46ForrestFamily
As someone who searched for a group for a particular interest, using various word combinations, and didn't find it, only to set up my own group and THEN be told that there was already a group for that topic, I would love to see something that makes searching more accurate. Whether that is group catagories I don't know.
47lquilter
... were any conclusions ever reached?
i still think tags for groups would be useful. having played with ravelry a bit today (finally in!) confirmed me in that opinion and made me wish for tags here again.
a very limited set of categories could also be useful, a la #38 countrylife's suggestion. i would suggest, however, instead of #38's "five" that we go simply to "four":
(1) LIBRARYTHING
(2) BOOKS
(3) SUBJECTS or perhaps "interests" or "topics" or "passions" or "disciplines" (including disciplines, socio-political, interests, etc.; because, frankly, one person's "hobby" is another's discipline)
(4) PEOPLE / affinity / membership groups.
This isn't conceptually perfect but it seems workable. (Conceptual problems include (a) distingushing between #3 and #4; e.g., "New York Yankees fans" and "New York Yankees research"; and (b) the fact that "BOOKS" is certainly going to blur with the other categories in #3 and #4.)
i still think tags for groups would be useful. having played with ravelry a bit today (finally in!) confirmed me in that opinion and made me wish for tags here again.
a very limited set of categories could also be useful, a la #38 countrylife's suggestion. i would suggest, however, instead of #38's "five" that we go simply to "four":
(1) LIBRARYTHING
(2) BOOKS
(3) SUBJECTS or perhaps "interests" or "topics" or "passions" or "disciplines" (including disciplines, socio-political, interests, etc.; because, frankly, one person's "hobby" is another's discipline)
(4) PEOPLE / affinity / membership groups.
This isn't conceptually perfect but it seems workable. (Conceptual problems include (a) distingushing between #3 and #4; e.g., "New York Yankees fans" and "New York Yankees research"; and (b) the fact that "BOOKS" is certainly going to blur with the other categories in #3 and #4.)
48timepiece
If we boil it down to 4 or 5 categories, couldn't we just ask the group creator to choose one of the categories for his/her group, and then tag for any more specific attributes? That way, at least someone searching could get the list pared down reasonably well by just selecting a category to look at. I like the divisions in message 38 myself.
On one of my other sites, Ask Metafilter, they divide posts in both these ways - you pick a general category, then add your own tags. You can see both displayed in the box on the right side of this page.
On one of my other sites, Ask Metafilter, they divide posts in both these ways - you pick a general category, then add your own tags. You can see both displayed in the box on the right side of this page.
