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1gangleri
Hi! I found this group today but I did not read any topic so far.
In the past I tagged the books from my collection which relates to series with "Tag: …". There are nearly 3,000 books.
Some minutes ago I tried to look at the series from the user which tagged most books with mathematics (maybe also aliases).
On a short view I could see some of the problems I am experiencing myself:
01a) The character "/" is not suitable for series because the links render differently depending on the context. In "stats/series" the links are broken.
01b) There should be a list of metacharacters related to series:
01b1) "&" can not be used; I am using "and", "und" etc. depending on the language as a replacement.
01b2) "(" and ") have a special meaning; I am using "[" and "]" whereever possibe.
note: In order to avoide touchstone conlicts I entered "&+#91;" and "&+#93;" here.
02) Series: History of Mathematics coexists beside Series: History of mathematics
At http://lccn.loc.gov/96011112 one can see how the series name is suposed to be.
I continue with some additional issues:
03) in some LoC records the article "The" is omited; in other LoC records for the same serie it is present;
04) in some LoC records errors, character substitutions, emmisions may happen;
05) at the beginning of my work on series I found the inclusion of the word "series" some times very ugly; especially if it releted to translations in other languages;
06) series modifiers: there might be many series "Sport" or similar series with short and / or general names; normaly LoC is using modifiers with "(" and ")"; read above about the usage of "[" and "]"
07) meaningless series names; "Collected works" without any reference to the author (or where the reference to the author is at the end):
I imagine that it would be very usefull fo specify a syntax for such complex series names. I am aware that there are different preferences to start with
Paul Celan : foo bar
or
Celan, Paul : foo bar
to use spaces and commas etc.
last but not least:
08) workarounds as redirects
At Insel-Taschenbuch
I have inserted
→ Insel Taschenbuch
I think that makes sense. However there might be better ideas
09) migration
If the community agrees on what is meaningfull and suitable there will be a lot of work to make the changes as for issues related to capitalisation. I hope that nobody is offended.
For myself I am using the format SERIES-NAME (book NO_IF-KNOWN) (YEAR). I do not see any benefit in deleting this information (in order to achive an alphabetical order or for whatever reason).
There might be exceptions as at Series: Teach Yourself Languages but the number of exceptions should be limited (and a note should be available in the description).
btw: re: http://www.librarything.com/work/83307/commonknowledge I do not know if the change of the "Canonical Title" would influence the sort. Maybe a software improuvement (a software change) could offer a "sortkey syntax". This would allow to properly sort volumes using LATIN NUMBERS, (I, II, III, IV, V, ...) and numbers in other scripts if also a "display key" (V=5) would be avilable.
Conclusion:
Is there any interest to work on such gudelines at WikiThing? I thing this would be a better place to provide such a documentation. Please make some url proposals.
Best regards Reinhardt
In the past I tagged the books from my collection which relates to series with "Tag: …". There are nearly 3,000 books.
Some minutes ago I tried to look at the series from the user which tagged most books with mathematics (maybe also aliases).
On a short view I could see some of the problems I am experiencing myself:
01a) The character "/" is not suitable for series because the links render differently depending on the context. In "stats/series" the links are broken.
01b) There should be a list of metacharacters related to series:
01b1) "&" can not be used; I am using "and", "und" etc. depending on the language as a replacement.
01b2) "(" and ") have a special meaning; I am using "[" and "]" whereever possibe.
note: In order to avoide touchstone conlicts I entered "&+#91;" and "&+#93;" here.
02) Series: History of Mathematics coexists beside Series: History of mathematics
At http://lccn.loc.gov/96011112 one can see how the series name is suposed to be.
I continue with some additional issues:
03) in some LoC records the article "The" is omited; in other LoC records for the same serie it is present;
04) in some LoC records errors, character substitutions, emmisions may happen;
05) at the beginning of my work on series I found the inclusion of the word "series" some times very ugly; especially if it releted to translations in other languages;
06) series modifiers: there might be many series "Sport" or similar series with short and / or general names; normaly LoC is using modifiers with "(" and ")"; read above about the usage of "[" and "]"
07) meaningless series names; "Collected works" without any reference to the author (or where the reference to the author is at the end):
I imagine that it would be very usefull fo specify a syntax for such complex series names. I am aware that there are different preferences to start with
Paul Celan : foo bar
or
Celan, Paul : foo bar
to use spaces and commas etc.
last but not least:
08) workarounds as redirects
At Insel-Taschenbuch
I have inserted
→ Insel Taschenbuch
I think that makes sense. However there might be better ideas
09) migration
If the community agrees on what is meaningfull and suitable there will be a lot of work to make the changes as for issues related to capitalisation. I hope that nobody is offended.
For myself I am using the format SERIES-NAME (book NO_IF-KNOWN) (YEAR). I do not see any benefit in deleting this information (in order to achive an alphabetical order or for whatever reason).
There might be exceptions as at Series: Teach Yourself Languages but the number of exceptions should be limited (and a note should be available in the description).
btw: re: http://www.librarything.com/work/83307/commonknowledge I do not know if the change of the "Canonical Title" would influence the sort. Maybe a software improuvement (a software change) could offer a "sortkey syntax". This would allow to properly sort volumes using LATIN NUMBERS, (I, II, III, IV, V, ...) and numbers in other scripts if also a "display key" (V=5) would be avilable.
Conclusion:
Is there any interest to work on such gudelines at WikiThing? I thing this would be a better place to provide such a documentation. Please make some url proposals.
Best regards Reinhardt
2gangleri
posted also http://www.librarything.com/topic/99306 as bug
3fdholt
Reinhardt
Series is handled differently depending on the catalog rules at the time of cataloging. The tags are 440 (now dropped in favor of 490/8XX combo even if exactly the same), 490 and the 8XX MARC tags. Our integrated system at Albright College controls all but the 490.
In 2, the problem with Series: History of Mathematics has more to do with the OPAC display than with the controlled (130 in MARC) series heading. It is correct in OCLC and 1st search. The person inputting the series page used the label for the field as part of the series name.
As far as ommission of articles in #3 (a, an, the and foreign equivalents), some integrated library systems can't handle filing indicators. (And LT does not handle foreign equivalents at all.) Albright College uses BiblioMondo and we have to strip the article to control the series name. (Yes, we could do the 490/8XX but a lot of work! It's easier to change indicator to "0" instead.) So, if you use one of my records from AccessPA, you will not get the article. The fact that LC isn't consistent depends on whether you are looking at 490 or one of the other tags. And since LC is no longer tracing series or making series authority records, you will see stranger things in the future.
5 is the OPAC display problem.
For 6, LC and libraries never use the same name for different series even if the publishers do. They are qualified, either by publisher, city or sometimes date if necessary. Looking at a title page does not help here. (Although the decision by LC to stop with series authorities now puts the burden on catalogers on OCLC - how long they will continue to establish series names is anyone's guess.)
The series, or uniform title, as I think you refer to in 7 is constructed by using the authority for the author along with standard language like Works for collected works, complete works, etc. and Selections for parts of works. If, in same form, Plays, Novels, etc. when the author wrote in more than one genre. Then language if not in the author's language. The publisher can call the series whatever he wants; the uniform title is the controlled name of the series with qualifying info to distinquish. Not pretty but it works for libraries. Not so good for readers.
For 9, libraries will continue to use Dewey's standards of capitalization. I cannot see title case anytime soon in library catalogs.
Fianna
Series is handled differently depending on the catalog rules at the time of cataloging. The tags are 440 (now dropped in favor of 490/8XX combo even if exactly the same), 490 and the 8XX MARC tags. Our integrated system at Albright College controls all but the 490.
In 2, the problem with Series: History of Mathematics has more to do with the OPAC display than with the controlled (130 in MARC) series heading. It is correct in OCLC and 1st search. The person inputting the series page used the label for the field as part of the series name.
As far as ommission of articles in #3 (a, an, the and foreign equivalents), some integrated library systems can't handle filing indicators. (And LT does not handle foreign equivalents at all.) Albright College uses BiblioMondo and we have to strip the article to control the series name. (Yes, we could do the 490/8XX but a lot of work! It's easier to change indicator to "0" instead.) So, if you use one of my records from AccessPA, you will not get the article. The fact that LC isn't consistent depends on whether you are looking at 490 or one of the other tags. And since LC is no longer tracing series or making series authority records, you will see stranger things in the future.
5 is the OPAC display problem.
For 6, LC and libraries never use the same name for different series even if the publishers do. They are qualified, either by publisher, city or sometimes date if necessary. Looking at a title page does not help here. (Although the decision by LC to stop with series authorities now puts the burden on catalogers on OCLC - how long they will continue to establish series names is anyone's guess.)
The series, or uniform title, as I think you refer to in 7 is constructed by using the authority for the author along with standard language like Works for collected works, complete works, etc. and Selections for parts of works. If, in same form, Plays, Novels, etc. when the author wrote in more than one genre. Then language if not in the author's language. The publisher can call the series whatever he wants; the uniform title is the controlled name of the series with qualifying info to distinquish. Not pretty but it works for libraries. Not so good for readers.
For 9, libraries will continue to use Dewey's standards of capitalization. I cannot see title case anytime soon in library catalogs.
Fianna
4gangleri
>3 fdholt: Thanks for the detailed answer. Now I understand some technical issues better. Also many issues related to "automatisation" at LT.
My approach / my questions releted mainly to the "community" aspects (a kind of ant wotk). I will answer in a few days.
FYI: http://www.librarything.com/topic/100032 Topic: implementation related to series synatx changed
My approach / my questions releted mainly to the "community" aspects (a kind of ant wotk). I will answer in a few days.
FYI: http://www.librarything.com/topic/100032 Topic: implementation related to series synatx changed
5Noisy
I've sorted the History of Mathematics series.
I don't understand your usage of '(book)' in the series field.
As a general rule, if you feel the need to make a work part of two different series, then if those two different series aren't 'publication order' and 'series order', then it is very likely that they shouldn't be series at all.
As a consequence, a number of works that you have catalogued in two different series will have the series CK removed. The reason is that when someone looks at their series statistics page and sees that they have a work in a certain series, but don't recognise the series, and if they then go and look at their physical book and find that it is in a different series, then they have every right to remove the 'incorrect' series CK.
ETA: I have gone with 'History of Mathematics', and not 'History of mathematics' because that is what the AMS uses on its series page.
I don't understand your usage of '(book)' in the series field.
As a general rule, if you feel the need to make a work part of two different series, then if those two different series aren't 'publication order' and 'series order', then it is very likely that they shouldn't be series at all.
As a consequence, a number of works that you have catalogued in two different series will have the series CK removed. The reason is that when someone looks at their series statistics page and sees that they have a work in a certain series, but don't recognise the series, and if they then go and look at their physical book and find that it is in a different series, then they have every right to remove the 'incorrect' series CK.
ETA: I have gone with 'History of Mathematics', and not 'History of mathematics' because that is what the AMS uses on its series page.
6gangleri
>5 Noisy: Thanks Noisy for your time. It is quite late here; I can not address all issues. I started to add tags, series, places and characters very latly and many of my tags today relate to "maintenance and migration".
At some point in time I noticed that the old implementation was a) only displaying numbers and b) some series where using series numbers and other years. (However today I learned that some users did not add anything.) I was wondering if I can use the same syntax "foo (bar ) (foobar)" using two "(...)" which can cover all cases. This is the history of "(book OPTIONAL_BOOK_NUMBER)". As I sad the old implementation did ignore anything but numbers.
Regarding case sensitive issues: http://lccn.loc.gov/2001045097 and also http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/231955840 are using lowercase "mathematics" . I mentioned that LoC might be inconsistent sometimes. My opinion is to avoid any capitalization (writing in uppercases) except for misspellings and / or wrong grammar should be avoided. In order not to leave the impression that somebody is offended changes should be done after reaching a case by case consensus.
brief listing of special cases:
I found refferences mentioning that the same edition of books are in multiple series; both relating to books in English or German.
It also might happen that a book is in one series in one language and the translation in another. One could say this does not care but for some language communities the publication of valuable books represents a great effort and needs to be honorated. Not all works are originals; this aplies also for English having classic series.
It might happen that the book title from a translation will be used by LT in the series listing; not the title in the series. In such cases alphabetical order will be broken. Maybe one could use "Canonical Title" to avide these issues.
These are issues I noticed in the latest months and maybe many have been discussed already.
At some point in time I noticed that the old implementation was a) only displaying numbers and b) some series where using series numbers and other years. (However today I learned that some users did not add anything.) I was wondering if I can use the same syntax "foo (bar ) (foobar)" using two "(...)" which can cover all cases. This is the history of "(book OPTIONAL_BOOK_NUMBER)". As I sad the old implementation did ignore anything but numbers.
Regarding case sensitive issues: http://lccn.loc.gov/2001045097 and also http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/231955840 are using lowercase "mathematics" . I mentioned that LoC might be inconsistent sometimes. My opinion is to avoid any capitalization (writing in uppercases) except for misspellings and / or wrong grammar should be avoided. In order not to leave the impression that somebody is offended changes should be done after reaching a case by case consensus.
brief listing of special cases:
I found refferences mentioning that the same edition of books are in multiple series; both relating to books in English or German.
It also might happen that a book is in one series in one language and the translation in another. One could say this does not care but for some language communities the publication of valuable books represents a great effort and needs to be honorated. Not all works are originals; this aplies also for English having classic series.
It might happen that the book title from a translation will be used by LT in the series listing; not the title in the series. In such cases alphabetical order will be broken. Maybe one could use "Canonical Title" to avide these issues.
These are issues I noticed in the latest months and maybe many have been discussed already.
7prosfilaes
#5: As a general rule, if you feel the need to make a work part of two different series, then if those two different series aren't 'publication order' and 'series order', then it is very likely that they shouldn't be series at all.
I disagree. There are many, many books that are subseries of series. You get long running series like the Star Wars novels that have individual series in them (that are series beyond question) that have individual trilogies in them. There are a lot of science-fiction series that have subseries; Pern is one pretty clear example. All the Weyrs of Pern is clearly the sequel to both Dragondrums and The White Dragon.
I disagree. There are many, many books that are subseries of series. You get long running series like the Star Wars novels that have individual series in them (that are series beyond question) that have individual trilogies in them. There are a lot of science-fiction series that have subseries; Pern is one pretty clear example. All the Weyrs of Pern is clearly the sequel to both Dragondrums and The White Dragon.
8rsterling
a) only displaying numbers and b) some series where using series numbers and other years. (However today I learned that some users did not add anything.) I was wondering if I can use the same syntax "foo (bar ) (foobar)" using two "(...)" which can cover all cases. This is the history of "(book OPTIONAL_BOOK_NUMBER)". As I sad the old implementation did ignore anything but numbers.
Actually, it used to display more than just numbers, then at some point it changed to display only numbers. I asked Tim to change it back and he did, a couple of days ago.
It's not possible to add two parentheticals - they won't be parsed properly. More than one kind of parenthetical details should be separated by the vertical bar, within the same parenthetical.
Actually, it used to display more than just numbers, then at some point it changed to display only numbers. I asked Tim to change it back and he did, a couple of days ago.
It's not possible to add two parentheticals - they won't be parsed properly. More than one kind of parenthetical details should be separated by the vertical bar, within the same parenthetical.
9gangleri
>7 prosfilaes: example: http://d-nb.info/551970529
Mehrteiliges Werk (a kind of multiple volume work / set):
Series name at DNB: Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden / Boris Pasternak. LEFT SQUARE BRACKETHrsg. von Fritz MierauRIGHT SQUARE BRACKET
Thinking about the title I proposed Boris Pasternak : Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden
(added as a reminder on more examples)
Note: The documentation of the example needs to escape Touchstone syntax because of the LEFT SQUARE BRACKET (U+005B), here coded as &+#x5b; and RIGHT SQUARE BRACKET (U+005D), here coded as &+#x5b;
test: [ and ] (&+#x5b; and &+#x5d;) can not be generated (left a note at http://www.librarything.com/topic/99459#2254509 )
Mehrteiliges Werk (a kind of multiple volume work / set):
Series name at DNB: Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden / Boris Pasternak. LEFT SQUARE BRACKETHrsg. von Fritz MierauRIGHT SQUARE BRACKET
Thinking about the title I proposed Boris Pasternak : Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden
(added as a reminder on more examples)
Note: The documentation of the example needs to escape Touchstone syntax because of the LEFT SQUARE BRACKET (U+005B), here coded as &+#x5b; and RIGHT SQUARE BRACKET (U+005D), here coded as &+#x5b;
test: [ and ] (&+#x5b; and &+#x5d;) can not be generated (left a note at http://www.librarything.com/topic/99459#2254509 )
10jjwilson61
As usual, gangleri, I have no idea what you're trying to say here. I'd like to make a suggestion about how to communicate better but there's nothing in there that I can even begin to grasp what you're trying to say and how it relates to series.
11shmjay
>9 gangleri: "Meaningless series names" (from message 1)
Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden = Collected Works in Single Volumes
"Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden" is not a very distinctive title for a series, because any publisher could use it for anyone's works. So in the Anglo-American Cataloguing Rules 2, the "uniform title" for this series would likely be something like:
Pasternak, Boris Leonidovich, 1890-1960. Works. 1991
using "1991" because the earliest volume was published in 1991, and with a reference from "Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden".
This would be transcribed in the MARC record for the book as something like
490 1_ Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden / Boris Pasternak
800 10 Pasternak, Boris Leonidovich, 1890-1960. Works. 1991.
This distinguishes these particular "Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden" from the "Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden" of another author, such as Henning Mankell; and also from Pasternak's "Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden" published by different publisher.
***
But this is a complicated cataloguing rule, which requires part of a chapter in AACR2 to explain it. LibraryThing can't force people to follow it. Nor can LibraryThing force people to read any rules before they create series, so there will always be series names that are not consistent with other series names.
As for your title for the series, it is as good as any. I would have called it:
Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden: Boris Pasternak: Aufbau-Verlag
because I suspect people will remember the title first.
I have found that you can use the ":" in LibraryThing as part of the series name to provide further information to differentiate one series from another, though this makes the series name long, which cannot be helped.
Example: http://www.librarything.com/series/Canadian+history+series%3A+Doubleday
Does this answer your question?
Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden = Collected Works in Single Volumes
"Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden" is not a very distinctive title for a series, because any publisher could use it for anyone's works. So in the Anglo-American Cataloguing Rules 2, the "uniform title" for this series would likely be something like:
Pasternak, Boris Leonidovich, 1890-1960. Works. 1991
using "1991" because the earliest volume was published in 1991, and with a reference from "Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden".
This would be transcribed in the MARC record for the book as something like
490 1_ Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden / Boris Pasternak
800 10 Pasternak, Boris Leonidovich, 1890-1960. Works. 1991.
This distinguishes these particular "Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden" from the "Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden" of another author, such as Henning Mankell; and also from Pasternak's "Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden" published by different publisher.
***
But this is a complicated cataloguing rule, which requires part of a chapter in AACR2 to explain it. LibraryThing can't force people to follow it. Nor can LibraryThing force people to read any rules before they create series, so there will always be series names that are not consistent with other series names.
As for your title for the series, it is as good as any. I would have called it:
Gesammelte Werke in Einzelbänden: Boris Pasternak: Aufbau-Verlag
because I suspect people will remember the title first.
I have found that you can use the ":" in LibraryThing as part of the series name to provide further information to differentiate one series from another, though this makes the series name long, which cannot be helped.
Example: http://www.librarything.com/series/Canadian+history+series%3A+Doubleday
Does this answer your question?
12gangleri
>11 shmjay: Thanks for the answer! I was in doubth where to put the author name because one may find "Complete works: ...", "Selected works: ..." and many language variants. Having the author together is one issue; selecting the spelling and "first_name, last_name" versus "first_name, last_name", first_name" order is another.
Normaly in LT such series can be found also via the top level author link.
I am not a librarian and if I have a question then the next one will arive. It would be important to identify the "simple rules" first and identify more complex issues later. One of them is the "general ussage" about spaces after abreviations:
Today we have Series: C.H. Beck Wissen and a help link at Series: C. H. Beck Wissen. However the link only visible at LT in English immediately (for anonymous users caching issues are involved; for other LT's the help link probably will not show up).
fixed typos; reworded
Normaly in LT such series can be found also via the top level author link.
I am not a librarian and if I have a question then the next one will arive. It would be important to identify the "simple rules" first and identify more complex issues later. One of them is the "general ussage" about spaces after abreviations:
Today we have Series: C.H. Beck Wissen and a help link at Series: C. H. Beck Wissen. However the link only visible at LT in English immediately (for anonymous users caching issues are involved; for other LT's the help link probably will not show up).
fixed typos; reworded
13jjwilson61
But series that contain all or even some of an author's works aren't really series in the LibraryThing sense. If these are series put out by a publisher then it is probably that there are other editions of some of the works that aren't in that publishers series. So if you put that work in the series then someone else will complain that their edition isn't in the series.
Plus if you want to see all of an author's works (or at least all that are on LT) then just go to the author page.
Plus if you want to see all of an author's works (or at least all that are on LT) then just go to the author page.
14aulsmith
12: Librarians aren't consistent about spaces in abbreviations, so you're not going to get LT people to agree.
(I guess, technically, we are consistent, but the rules are so bizarre that if you don't know them, it looks like we are totally inconsistent.)
(I guess, technically, we are consistent, but the rules are so bizarre that if you don't know them, it looks like we are totally inconsistent.)
15gangleri
>9 gangleri: re "Example: http://www.librarything.com/series/Canadian+history+series%3A+Doubleday"
I have looked at some series from data source "Koninklijke Bibliotheek":
Wissen & Praxis (using metacharacter "&" which is not supported in series titles)
Kunst & Wissen (idem)
set of series; the titles are not consistent with the usage of Zeiten. Abteilung:; they are using Combined diactitical marks ä ( CDM a+%CC%88 ) and ü ( CDM u+%CC%88 )
Jedermanns Bücherei : Natur aller Länder, Religion und Kultur aller Völker, Wissen und Technik aller Zeiten. Abteilung: Literaturgeschichte
Jedermanns Bücherei : Natur aller Länder, Religion und Kultur aller Völker, Wissen und Technik aller Zeiten. Abteilung: Erziehungswesen
Jedermanns Bücherei : Natur aller Länder, Religion und Kultur aller Völker, Wissen und Technik aller Zeiten. Abteilung: Musik
Jedermanns Bücherei : Natur aller Länder, Religion und Kultur aller Völker, Wissen und Technik aller Zeiten. Abteilung: Philosophie
P.S. Abteilung: should probably be ommited.
Rowohlts deutsche Enzyklopädie : das Wissen des 20. Jahrhunderts im Taschenbuch mit Enzyklopädischem Stichwort
Wissen und Wirken : Einzelschriften zu den Grundfragen des Erkennens und Schaffens
Wissen und Forschen : Schriften zur Einführung in die Philosophie
Das Wissen der Gegenwart : deutsche Universal-Bibliothek für Gebildete
Studien zum Umgang mit Wissen / Deutsches Institut für Internationale Pädagogische Forschung (using metacharacter "/" which is not supported in series titles)
Pädagogische Bibliothek
Das Wissen der Gegenwart. Geisteswissenschaften
Lebendiges Wissen
Rororo wissen (I assume that the series name should be either "rororo wissen" or "rororo Wissen" see Series: rororo hint
Notes:
In the examples a SPACE preceeds every COLON.
The title used at KB.nl are not suitable for LT without Unicode normalisation / UTF-8 normalization. It does not make sense to have different coding variants for the same object ( here series ).
Hints: please copy the character ä ( CDM a+%CC%88 ) and search the page for occurences of it; you may highlight all occurences in FireFox. You may do the same with the character ü ( CDM u+%CC%88 ).
minor fixes and corrections; typos
I have looked at some series from data source "Koninklijke Bibliotheek":
Wissen & Praxis (using metacharacter "&" which is not supported in series titles)
Kunst & Wissen (idem)
set of series; the titles are not consistent with the usage of Zeiten. Abteilung:; they are using Combined diactitical marks ä ( CDM a+%CC%88 ) and ü ( CDM u+%CC%88 )
Jedermanns Bücherei : Natur aller Länder, Religion und Kultur aller Völker, Wissen und Technik aller Zeiten. Abteilung: Literaturgeschichte
Jedermanns Bücherei : Natur aller Länder, Religion und Kultur aller Völker, Wissen und Technik aller Zeiten. Abteilung: Erziehungswesen
Jedermanns Bücherei : Natur aller Länder, Religion und Kultur aller Völker, Wissen und Technik aller Zeiten. Abteilung: Musik
Jedermanns Bücherei : Natur aller Länder, Religion und Kultur aller Völker, Wissen und Technik aller Zeiten. Abteilung: Philosophie
P.S. Abteilung: should probably be ommited.
Rowohlts deutsche Enzyklopädie : das Wissen des 20. Jahrhunderts im Taschenbuch mit Enzyklopädischem Stichwort
Wissen und Wirken : Einzelschriften zu den Grundfragen des Erkennens und Schaffens
Wissen und Forschen : Schriften zur Einführung in die Philosophie
Das Wissen der Gegenwart : deutsche Universal-Bibliothek für Gebildete
Studien zum Umgang mit Wissen / Deutsches Institut für Internationale Pädagogische Forschung (using metacharacter "/" which is not supported in series titles)
Pädagogische Bibliothek
Das Wissen der Gegenwart. Geisteswissenschaften
Lebendiges Wissen
Rororo wissen (I assume that the series name should be either "rororo wissen" or "rororo Wissen" see Series: rororo hint
Notes:
In the examples a SPACE preceeds every COLON.
The title used at KB.nl are not suitable for LT without Unicode normalisation / UTF-8 normalization. It does not make sense to have different coding variants for the same object ( here series ).
Hints: please copy the character ä ( CDM a+%CC%88 ) and search the page for occurences of it; you may highlight all occurences in FireFox. You may do the same with the character ü ( CDM u+%CC%88 ).
minor fixes and corrections; typos
16gangleri
re: Unicode normalisation / UTF-8 normalization
something strange happens here (in talk): in plain text ä ( CDM a+%CC%88 ) and ü ( CDM u+%CC%88 ) are preserved in text but not in link titles; no clue what piece of SW is causing this:
http://opc4.kb.nl/PPN?PPN=863068049
Jedermanns Bücherei : Natur aller Länder, Religion und Kultur aller Völker, Wissen und Technik aller Zeiten. Literaturgeschichte
http://opc4.kb.nl/PPN?PPN=084275464
Jedermanns Bücherei : Natur aller Länder, Religion und Kultur aller Völker, Wissen und Technik aller Zeiten. Abteilung: Erziehungswesen
http://opc4.kb.nl/PPN?PPN=03694825X
Jedermanns Bücherei : Natur aller Länder, Religion und Kultur aller Völker, Wissen und Technik aller Zeiten. Abteilung: Musik
http://opc4.kb.nl/PPN?PPN=052479110
Jedermanns Bücherei : Natur alle Länder, Religion und Kultur alle Völker, Wissen und Technik aller Zeiten. Philosophie
http://opc4.kb.nl/PPN?PPN=822721813
Rowohlts deutsche Enzyklopädie : das Wissen des 20. Jahrhunderts im Taschenbuch mit Enzyklopädischem Stichwort:
sorry: The linux GEDIT editor makes no distinction between ä ( CDM a+%CC%88 ) and the UTF-8 character ä ( %C3%A4 ) in serach.
http://opc4.kb.nl/PPN?PPN=863068049
Jedermanns Bücherei : Natur aller Länder, Religion und Kultur aller Völker, Wissen und Technik aller Zeiten. Literaturgeschichte
http://opc4.kb.nl/PPN?PPN=084275464
Jedermanns Bücherei : Natur aller Länder, Religion und Kultur aller Völker, Wissen und Technik aller Zeiten. Abteilung: Erziehungswesen
http://opc4.kb.nl/PPN?PPN=03694825X
Jedermanns Bücherei : Natur aller Länder, Religion und Kultur aller Völker, Wissen und Technik aller Zeiten. Abteilung: Musik
http://opc4.kb.nl/PPN?PPN=052479110
Jedermanns Bücherei : Natur alle Länder, Religion und Kultur alle Völker, Wissen und Technik aller Zeiten. Philosophie
http://opc4.kb.nl/PPN?PPN=822721813
Rowohlts deutsche Enzyklopädie : das Wissen des 20. Jahrhunderts im Taschenbuch mit Enzyklopädischem Stichwort:
sorry: The linux GEDIT editor makes no distinction between ä ( CDM a+%CC%88 ) and the UTF-8 character ä ( %C3%A4 ) in serach.
17Felagund
>15 gangleri:
Rororo is clearly a publisher series, so it should not be part of the Common Knowledge! Do not add any more books to this already long series, it will make it easier for the others to delete it...
Rororo is clearly a publisher series, so it should not be part of the Common Knowledge! Do not add any more books to this already long series, it will make it easier for the others to delete it...
18jjwilson61
You seem to be under the mistaken belief that the Series field in a MARC record has anything to do with the Series field in LT. It does not. The rules for what is and isn't a Series and for the format of the name are completely different.
19gangleri
>18 jjwilson61: "The rules for what is and isn't a Series and for the format of the name are completely different."
I noticed that it is not possible to map MARC series one to one. I try to find out how closed LT series could be to series reffered outside LT.
Series: Text und Kritik relates to http://d-nb.info/011169125 using book numbers and supplementary prints called "Sonderband", "Spezinummer", etc.
The series is using "+" which is a metacharacter; no cloe how it could be escaped; same about "&".
I wounder if "Text und Kritik (65535|Sonderband 1994)" at work Franz Kafka , CK, CK history is valid and stable syntax.
P.S. reediting a post brakes existing Touchstones ; test Franz Kafka; it toggeled: first post did generate clickable touchstone; second not, third yes
reminder links:65,534, 65,535
I noticed that it is not possible to map MARC series one to one. I try to find out how closed LT series could be to series reffered outside LT.
Series: Text und Kritik relates to http://d-nb.info/011169125 using book numbers and supplementary prints called "Sonderband", "Spezinummer", etc.
The series is using "+" which is a metacharacter; no cloe how it could be escaped; same about "&".
I wounder if "Text und Kritik (65535|Sonderband 1994)" at work Franz Kafka , CK, CK history is valid and stable syntax.
P.S. reediting a post brakes existing Touchstones ; test Franz Kafka; it toggeled: first post did generate clickable touchstone; second not, third yes
reminder links:65,534, 65,535
20staffordcastle
Since the series information in LT is entirely supplied by the members, there will be absolutely no correlation between it and any outside library source. Members occasionally refer to websites that list all the parts of a series, like www.fantasticfiction.co.uk, but these are rarely if ever library sources. I think I can safely say that MARC never comes into it.
21fdholt
I have to agree with #17 and #20. The 440, 490, 8XX should not be used in LT as a series. As a librarian, if I want them as the approved LC authority form in personal or church library catalog, I use the comments field. Most series can be safely ignored.
And #14, if the abbreviations are controlled by an authority, there should be a space:
Lewis, C. S. (Clives Staples), 1898-1963.
but
R.L. Polk & Co. and some corporate headings are in this format and some are not.
Go figure!
If used in a "statement of responsibility" it can be anything and usually is.
And #14, if the abbreviations are controlled by an authority, there should be a space:
Lewis, C. S. (Clives Staples), 1898-1963.
but
R.L. Polk & Co. and some corporate headings are in this format and some are not.
Go figure!
If used in a "statement of responsibility" it can be anything and usually is.
22aulsmith
21: Read AACR2 more carefully. The space between the C. and the S. in the Lewis example was introduced by OCLC to facilitate the long ago author codes. AACR2 calls for no spaces in authority controlled fields (but following the usage in transcribed fields)
And the catalog users are supposed to figure this out how??
And the catalog users are supposed to figure this out how??
23Nicole_VanK
What are you on about??????
24staffordcastle
It's librarian geek-talk, Matt - AACR is the Anglo-American Cataloging Rules, and the 2 stands for the last major revision.
26Nicole_VanK
> 24 / 25: Never mind me. I'm just a library / book user, not a librarian. ;-) But you had totally lost me there. Carry on.
