Some authors can't be combined: This author is no longer in the system
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1r.orrison
I want to combine
http://www.librarything.com/author/amadoleacutevyvalens
with
http://www.librarything.com/author/leacutevyvalensieacu
(See report in Combiners! group - http://www.librarything.com/topic/99615)
From the first page, you can search for Valensi and get this page
http://www.librarything.com/search_author.php?searchbox=Valensi&combinewith=...
The one to combine is the next-to-last line, "Éliane Amado Lévy-Valensi", but if you click the combine link you get a page that just says "This author is no longer in the system". But clearly, both are in the system because they both show up in the search.
http://www.librarything.com/author/amadoleacutevyvalens
with
http://www.librarything.com/author/leacutevyvalensieacu
(See report in Combiners! group - http://www.librarything.com/topic/99615)
From the first page, you can search for Valensi and get this page
http://www.librarything.com/search_author.php?searchbox=Valensi&combinewith=...
The one to combine is the next-to-last line, "Éliane Amado Lévy-Valensi", but if you click the combine link you get a page that just says "This author is no longer in the system". But clearly, both are in the system because they both show up in the search.
3eromsted
My impression is that authors not currently associated with any books are deemed "no longer in the system." But it seems that no authors are ever removed from the search results. Or it may be that these phantom authors are associated with zero copy editions and that keeps them around
You can repopulate the empty author by adding a new book and then combine authors and delete the book.
But is there a reason to keep people from combining these empty authors?
You can repopulate the empty author by adding a new book and then combine authors and delete the book.
But is there a reason to keep people from combining these empty authors?
4lilithcat
Well, what's odd is this. Let's say you have "author A" and "author A2" and you want to combine them. I have had it happen that when I am on Author A's page, and try to combine him with Author A2, I am told that the latter is no longer in the system. But then, if I go to Author A2's page, and try to combine with Author A, I am told that Author A is no longer in the system.
What's even more frustrating is that often the one who is "no longer in the system" continues to show up as a suggested combination, yet cannot be combined or "never combined".
What's even more frustrating is that often the one who is "no longer in the system" continues to show up as a suggested combination, yet cannot be combined or "never combined".
5gangleri
As mentioned at http://www.librarything.com/topic/99615 Topic: author combining: dormant author urls, shadow author urls
there are some unpredictible events related to work editing, work combining (maybe also others).
These zero work authors and also works with zero copies get reactivated. I beleive the safest way would be to combine them (especially the authors).
What is very odd is that the link correlation is broken:
Imagine that you have a work which is actualy "owned" by another author url. It can happen that in catalog.php you click on "your" author but it does not indicate any work.
The same may happen everywhere:
a) in series, characters, places, events
b) when searching works (mybe the indication if you own the work is deactivated now; I remember that some indication was present in the past)
there are some unpredictible events related to work editing, work combining (maybe also others).
These zero work authors and also works with zero copies get reactivated. I beleive the safest way would be to combine them (especially the authors).
What is very odd is that the link correlation is broken:
Imagine that you have a work which is actualy "owned" by another author url. It can happen that in catalog.php you click on "your" author but it does not indicate any work.
The same may happen everywhere:
a) in series, characters, places, events
b) when searching works (mybe the indication if you own the work is deactivated now; I remember that some indication was present in the past)
6theapparatus
>"You can repopulate the empty author by adding a new book and then combine authors and delete the book."
Hmm, have to remember that. I see this 2-3 times a day. Hate that error because I hate leaving the empty error out there.
Hmm, have to remember that. I see this 2-3 times a day. Hate that error because I hate leaving the empty error out there.
7gangleri
>6 theapparatus: "repopulating"
a) The different bokk sources behave differntly / they may generate different author urls for the same author.
b) I noticed that depending on the "hunted" author url sometimes an attempt for combining the author is indicated before the first edit and sometimes not. I experimented with dummy edits (either in the tag or in the comment fields).
a) The different bokk sources behave differntly / they may generate different author urls for the same author.
b) I noticed that depending on the "hunted" author url sometimes an attempt for combining the author is indicated before the first edit and sometimes not. I experimented with dummy edits (either in the tag or in the comment fields).
8keristars
7> I don't see why you couldn't repopulate the author by assigning a work an author name that exactly matches the url that's currently "no longer in the system". So if the no-longer-in-the-system author is "eacutexamplename", then that's what you stick in as the author, not "éxample, name"
9gangleri
>7 gangleri: You are right. The problem is that there are hundered of such urls. Please keep an eye on "workaround" .
one example: I combined
baezfernando because some minor edits allowed me to combine one dormant url. I conjected on the third url. But it is necessary to migrate also common knowledge, sometimes pictures etc. so 15 min / author will be fast.
P.S. 2010.12.02 expanded "workaround" link with additional parameters "&startNum=0&stepNum=599" - now internationalized / internationalised i.e. without hardcoded "www.librarything.com"
one example: I combined
baezfernando because some minor edits allowed me to combine one dormant url. I conjected on the third url. But it is necessary to migrate also common knowledge, sometimes pictures etc. so 15 min / author will be fast.
P.S. 2010.12.02 expanded "workaround" link with additional parameters "&startNum=0&stepNum=599" - now internationalized / internationalised i.e. without hardcoded "www.librarything.com"
10theapparatus
Just to make this confusing, I just combined two zero book authors into an author with titles.
http://www.librarything.com/author/mannsally
Looks like it works on occasion.
http://www.librarything.com/author/mannsally
Looks like it works on occasion.
11keristars
10> Isn't that different? 0 book authors could have copies that have been combined with others and moved off the author page OR they could be authors without any copies with their name. It's the second type that are the No longer in system, I thought.
12timspalding
Assign to Casey.
13gangleri
testcases:
http://www.librarything.com/author/camusschriftstellerf
combine with
http://www.librarything.com/author/camusalbert&norefer=1&all=1 Albert Camus
and
http://www.librarything.com/author/markskarl
http://www.librarything.com/author/markxkarl
http://www.librarything.com/author/805595324
http://www.librarything.com/author/2748482541
combine with
http://www.librarything.com/author/marxkarl&norefer=1&all=1 Karl Marx
http://www.librarything.com/author/camusschriftstellerf
combine with
http://www.librarything.com/author/camusalbert&norefer=1&all=1 Albert Camus
and
http://www.librarything.com/author/markskarl
http://www.librarything.com/author/markxkarl
http://www.librarything.com/author/805595324
http://www.librarything.com/author/2748482541
combine with
http://www.librarything.com/author/marxkarl&norefer=1&all=1 Karl Marx
152wonderY
#14
I had the same problem with another book recently, and solved it by adding it manually with the author's name entered as it should be.
The other page still exists, but I care less now.
I had the same problem with another book recently, and solved it by adding it manually with the author's name entered as it should be.
The other page still exists, but I care less now.
16Nicole_VanK
> 14: Yeah, that happens too. It's because - if you look at editions for that work http://www.librarything.com/work/10444453/editions - the copies aren't really attached to that author. But somehow they do still stick there. I think this happens after user correction of the author data.
I think it's a different bug, and will report it as such. Please leave as is for now, because it's a clear example.
I think it's a different bug, and will report it as such. Please leave as is for now, because it's a clear example.
18Nicole_VanK
Reported as separate bug here : http://www.librarything.com/topic/100101
19Nicole_VanK
Tim says "deferred" (http://www.librarything.com/topic/100101#2236350), so I'm fixing the example.
(Please note : that's for the separated bug report - not for this thread.)
(Please note : that's for the separated bug report - not for this thread.)
20timspalding
Narrowing this down to message 1 and assigning to Casey.
21r.orrison
See also http://www.librarything.com/topic/103524 where the system actually suggests a combination that it won't let you do.
22timspalding
Fixed. Thanks.
23keristars
I don't know if it was this fix that caused it or not, but within the last ten hours, something went really weird on Haruki Murakami's author page, and he's suddenly combined with a few "Anon"s and spam authors and also the Disney Imagineers: http://www.librarything.com/topic/103587
24timspalding
Yup.
25Noisy
This is patently not fixed. The question posed in the OP has not been resolved. You cannot combine the two authors.
26keristars
I was going to post about that recently, because I came across it with author "kakifly" and the katakana version of the name, but when I clicked the "recalculate author/title" on the books which showed the katakana author name, it switched to the regular one, and now it really doesn't have any books.
27r.orrison
Another case of the system suggesting a combination that it cannot do:
http://www.librarything.com/author/adlemanroberth
suggests
http://www.librarything.com/author/roberthcolgeorgewalt
But if you try the (combine) link from the first page, you get
"This author, or form of author, does not currently have any books in LibraryThing. (continue)."
(And yes, I know they shouldn't be combined. It's a test case, please don't Never them or anything.)
As Noisy said, "patently not fixed".
http://www.librarything.com/author/adlemanroberth
suggests
http://www.librarything.com/author/roberthcolgeorgewalt
But if you try the (combine) link from the first page, you get
"This author, or form of author, does not currently have any books in LibraryThing. (continue)."
(And yes, I know they shouldn't be combined. It's a test case, please don't Never them or anything.)
As Noisy said, "patently not fixed".
29timspalding
>28 Collectorator:
I've removed the "Never?" link when there are no potential combinations. If you don't have combinations you can't never.
I've removed the "Never?" link when there are no potential combinations. If you don't have combinations you can't never.
30timspalding
I can't find any other examples. Anyone have one?
31gangleri
>30 timspalding: Dear Tim! I have a long to do list (227 results) at workaround. I collected these mainly on author url where html entity characters are involved.
If I own related works I normaly make a dummy edit and click later on "Recalculate title/author". In more then 80% of the cases the work is then attributed to the author url without the "fooacute", "fooring", "foouml". (Note: "Recalculate title/author" will not have this affect if I do not own that work.)
Special cases: It happens that an apostrophe (character 27hex, 39decimal) is part of an author name. The LT system and "Recalculate title/author" will then generate two (numerical) author urls. An example can be seen at CK item=4709799. The folowing author urls are in the system: /author/1721432478 and /author/1471930365. (note: During the original import a character encoding of format &+x+nnn; is causing / triggering this behavior.
What to do: As soon as a suitable function is available a I planed to clean the items in the "workaround" working with three bowser tabs because the CK of a combined author url is not accessible after combine (except that the content is preserved in a parallel browser tab).
Maybe it would be worth to try to offer a privileged function or url syntax to experienced users to enforce these author combinations.
Regards Reinhardt
If I own related works I normaly make a dummy edit and click later on "Recalculate title/author". In more then 80% of the cases the work is then attributed to the author url without the "fooacute", "fooring", "foouml". (Note: "Recalculate title/author" will not have this affect if I do not own that work.)
Special cases: It happens that an apostrophe (character 27hex, 39decimal) is part of an author name. The LT system and "Recalculate title/author" will then generate two (numerical) author urls. An example can be seen at CK item=4709799. The folowing author urls are in the system: /author/1721432478 and /author/1471930365. (note: During the original import a character encoding of format &+x+nnn; is causing / triggering this behavior.
What to do: As soon as a suitable function is available a I planed to clean the items in the "workaround" working with three bowser tabs because the CK of a combined author url is not accessible after combine (except that the content is preserved in a parallel browser tab).
Maybe it would be worth to try to offer a privileged function or url syntax to experienced users to enforce these author combinations.
Regards Reinhardt
32gangleri
>31 gangleri: P.S. There might be several subsequent errors related to this bug (missing author url combination):
a) "/profile/ ...foo... /stats/gender" will normally list the author urls without works as ones with missing gender information.
b) /catalog may provide strange results
a) "/profile/ ...foo... /stats/gender" will normally list the author urls without works as ones with missing gender information.
b) /catalog may provide strange results
33gangleri
>30 timspalding:: not a trivial example:
/author/moumlssingeringrid shows 2 works. It should be combined with
/author/mossingeringrid which shows 8 works.
/author/moumlssingeringrid shows 2 works. It should be combined with
/author/mossingeringrid which shows 8 works.
34eromsted
>33 gangleri:
This is an example where you use the Recalculate title/author link on the bottom right of the work page. Recalculating moved both works off of the moumlssingeringrid author page and onto the mossingeringrid author page.
How did I know to do this? Both works had one copy and two editions, one of them zero-copy.
When someone edits author info on a unique work the system-wide assignment fails to update and the book stays on the author page indicated by the original, now zero copy, edition. If after editing there are no non-zero copies with a particular author spelling, LT will claim that the author is no longer in system, even though works still appear on that author page.
Recalculating the works fixes this problem.
This is an example where you use the Recalculate title/author link on the bottom right of the work page. Recalculating moved both works off of the moumlssingeringrid author page and onto the mossingeringrid author page.
How did I know to do this? Both works had one copy and two editions, one of them zero-copy.
When someone edits author info on a unique work the system-wide assignment fails to update and the book stays on the author page indicated by the original, now zero copy, edition. If after editing there are no non-zero copies with a particular author spelling, LT will claim that the author is no longer in system, even though works still appear on that author page.
Recalculating the works fixes this problem.
35gangleri
>34 eromsted: Thanks for the hint and for the help.
not a trivial example:
I used the "Recalculate title/author" link at www, ru and de LT for a):
a) /author/maroacuteczygeacuteza which still shows one work
b) /author/maroczygeza which shows one work.
I was not able to combine a) and b) via url syntax. Not shure if the author picture will show up at /authorgallery/gangleri .
Note: For me (this might be a OS, browser version, JavaScript etc. issue) the "Recalculate title/author" link works only on books I own (not at works from other members. Example: /author/pioslashioslashrn where ø ( oslas) is used. With "Recalculate title/author" the works shold move regardless if I own that work or not.
minor fix (added space)
not a trivial example:
I used the "Recalculate title/author" link at www, ru and de LT for a):
a) /author/maroacuteczygeacuteza which still shows one work
b) /author/maroczygeza which shows one work.
I was not able to combine a) and b) via url syntax. Not shure if the author picture will show up at /authorgallery/gangleri .
Note: For me (this might be a OS, browser version, JavaScript etc. issue) the "Recalculate title/author" link works only on books I own (not at works from other members. Example: /author/pioslashioslashrn where ø ( oslas) is used. With "Recalculate title/author" the works shold move regardless if I own that work or not.
minor fix (added space)
36gangleri
> 34 Not shure if the author picture will show up at /authorgallery/gangleri
The picture is shown there. However my user name is not shown at a) /author/maroczygeza (this is the main / to level author url).
The picture is shown there. However my user name is not shown at a) /author/maroczygeza (this is the main / to level author url).
37eromsted
>35 gangleri:
The work that needed to be recaluculated was A ||kezdő sakkozó vezérkönyve on the maroacuteczygeacuteza page. It moved to the maroczygeza page when I hit the recalculate title/author link on the work page.
And yes, the recalculate button should function on any work page, regardless of whether you have the work in your catalog. I don't think it could be a browser issue. I'm not sure what to make of your example. /author/pioslashioslashrn has already been combined with /author/piirn. The only work under the pioslashioslashrn author spelling is Allverdens ordspråk. There is only one edition of that work, so there is nothing to recalculate.
To staff, if anyone is reading this-
Why not just let us combine authors names even when there are no copies of books currently assigned to them? Why have this roadblock with the "author no longer in the system" message?
Yes, problems can be fixed by recalculating, but it takes significant inside info to understand what's going on. And I would think zero copy author variations should be combined for the same reason zero copy works are combined – someone may use that author spelling in the future, and we want the books to go to the right place when that happens.
The work that needed to be recaluculated was A ||kezdő sakkozó vezérkönyve on the maroacuteczygeacuteza page. It moved to the maroczygeza page when I hit the recalculate title/author link on the work page.
And yes, the recalculate button should function on any work page, regardless of whether you have the work in your catalog. I don't think it could be a browser issue. I'm not sure what to make of your example. /author/pioslashioslashrn has already been combined with /author/piirn. The only work under the pioslashioslashrn author spelling is Allverdens ordspråk. There is only one edition of that work, so there is nothing to recalculate.
To staff, if anyone is reading this-
Why not just let us combine authors names even when there are no copies of books currently assigned to them? Why have this roadblock with the "author no longer in the system" message?
Yes, problems can be fixed by recalculating, but it takes significant inside info to understand what's going on. And I would think zero copy author variations should be combined for the same reason zero copy works are combined – someone may use that author spelling in the future, and we want the books to go to the right place when that happens.
