The Thistle and the Rose

Margaret Tudor (Henry VIII’s older sister) was sent to Scotland when she was 12 or 13 to marry King James IV. She fell immediately in love when she met him, but he died young, in battle. In the years to come, she would fall easily in love and eventually be disappointed. But, she always had her and James’ son, James V, to fight for the crown for.

I don’t remember reading anything about Margaret before (though it appears that I have, but it was a number of years ago), so this was quite interesting. It’s funny, with all I’ve read about Henry (and a little bit about their youngest sister, Mary), I always thought Margaret was kind of boring, but Plaidy made her interesting to me. That may be more because she focused on her personal show more life than on the politics, though. Of course, the politics always came in to play to determine how her life would go. Of the few by Plaidy I’ve read, this might be one of my favourites. show less

Margaret Tudor is a fascinating woman who is overshadowed by her larger than life younger brother, Henry VIII, King of England. While he was beheading his wives, Margaret is setting precedents in Scotland like a true girlboss. Still, she can't be boiled down to a stereotype. She's a complex woman who, like her brother, is searching for love and trying to hold onto her throne for her son, but it is difficult for a monarch to achieve both goals. Jean Plaidy shows just how much Margaret struggled, even if I sometimes felt there was a note of derision in the narration.

Margaret's life is extremely eventful, even for a royal. After leaving England at 13 to meet her groom, the King of Scotland, she grows up in a foreign land. She is barraged show more by sorrows as one child after another dies. Finally, she has two healthy sons, but her husband is unfaithful, which devastates her notion of romance. That said, an unfaithful husband is better than a dead one. This is when Margaret's life spirals out of control. She marries twice more, both times thinking it's for love only to be deceived again. She travels back and forth to England to seek refuge. She procures a scandalous divorce and liberates herself when women were often the victims being divorced. Her story is as empowering as it is tragic.

Plaidy mainly focuses on Margaret's love affairs rather than her dogged efforts to be with her son and control his education. For the most part, it seems that Plaidy pins everything bad that happens to Margaret on her inability to control her passions. I've also read Philippa Gregory's Three Sisters, Three Queens novel, which also focuses on Margaret but with a more empowering spin, I feel. I like to think that, while love was important to Margaret, sexual and romantic love didn't guide her in everything. She is a tenacious woman, and I wish Plaidy had focused more on that. This is why I docked it a star.

That said, Plaidy's novel ends more realistically than Gregory's. Gregory leads readers to believe that the third time's the charm and that Margaret will live happily ever after in her final marriage. Not so, and Plaidy makes sure her readers realize this sad course of events. It really is sad, and you sympathize for Margaret, even though it seems like Plaidy is trying to moralize a bit and blame Margaret for causing her own unhappiness.

This novel was written in 3rd person POV. Generally, I find that Plaidy's novels that do this are weaker than her novels that focus on a single character. However, I felt like this novel was pretty strong. I understood a good amount of Scottish and English politics, and it didn't feel overwhelming ever. It's a quick read too, not even 300 pages. Highly recommend this book to anyone who loves the Tudors. This tenacious woman should not be overlooked. After all, she ultimately wins the war of succession, as it's her great-grandson who eventually rules over both England and Scotland. show less

Since I've rarely found the history of Merry Olde slave trading England to be compelling reading,
it was welcome to find Margaret Tudor an intriguing and unusual woman for her times.

While her husband, James II of Scotland, waffled around with his mistresses and poor border war decisions,
she grew in confidence as a Queen, though not in her odd (for that time) expectations to be loved by a faithful man.
The horrors she endured in childbirth remind readers of the good in modern medicine!

A map would have been really welcome, as would more details about how poor people and farmers actually lived,
plus a call-out on animal cruelty.

I've definitely got mixed feelings about this one. This author churned out over 200 works in her lifetime (under pseudonyms like Victoria Holt and Philippa Carr) so one assumes that some, like this one, can't be super deep. On the one hand, the fact that it was very juvenilely written makes it a great way to quickly and easily learn some basics of Tudor history. On the other hand, the story reads more like a transcription of ordered events than a novel read for pleasure. I decided to take the book as a simple introduction to this branch of the family but will be looking for something more detailed and interesting in the future.

Margaret was portrayed as a very simple and naive woman. I found it hard to believe that she would not be aware show more of her first husband, the King's, children and reputation with women prior to marrying him. I highly doubt her childhood was innocent and idyllic enough to leave her ignorant to his reputation and politics, in general. In this account, Margaret turned desperate fast and lived desperately until she died---always in need of a man's attentions. I'm not totally sure this was really the case since, according to this account, she willingly left her husbands on multiple occasions.

To sum it up, there was a lot of summing it up in this story. At one point, I read something like "she had not seen him for several years", when she'd actually been with him just two pages earlier. Lots of skipping ahead and "wrapping it up". Lots of flippant attitudes: So and so child died---oh well, there would be others.

I don't know that I'll actively seek out this author again but if I come across something that seems interesting, I might talk myself into it. show less

Decent story, covering events and a period I am not really familiar with, namely the life of Margaret Tudor in Scotland. However, far too much emphasis on sex and Margaret's love life for my liking.
Not that there was anything graphic, it was just tiresome for her falling for one handsome man after another, and incessantly being reminded of how 'passionate' she was.
As such, it was hard to sympathize or relate to her as a whiny, sex-mad overgrown spoiled brat who seemed incapable of realizing the damaging consequences of her own decisions, and having spent most of her life chasing men- yet always wanting men to 'love' her for who she was. If the fictional depiction was anything to go by- there was nothing much to love.

Also, her show more attitudes and values, and those of other characters did not seem very plausible for the time period- she seemed far too liberal in her attitude to divorce and sexuality for the time, and hardly cared for religion at all. Labelling of preachers as 'fanatical' also did not seem very authentic for the time.

Overall, not a satisfying read- more one I wanted to get finished with. I would have liked more of an overview of major political events and perhaps more developed well-rounded characters, or some notion of their personality and motivations. In spite of many good reviews elsewhere this was certainly not my favourite Plaidy. show less

For a book that was number 8 in a series I'd never heard of before, this actually worked very well as a stand alone book. This is the story of Margaret of Scotland, older sister of King Henry VIII of England. You generally don't see too many books about her, so this one was rather refreshing. She'd be considered a fairly modern woman by our standards, 3 marriages, 2 in defiance of her much married brother, & of the Crown of Scotland to boot. However, all 3 of those were doomed to failure, as the poor woman had to endure disappointment in the guise of her husbands' infidelities & children by those dalliances. She had children of her own, James V of Scotland, by her first husband James IV, Lady Margaret Douglas, by her 2nd husband Angus show more Douglas, & 2 by her third & last husband, Henry(Harry) Stuart, but it never gave their names or what happened to them in the story.

I also learned that this author is but one of three pen names the ACTUAL author used to write under, & she was VERY prolific. I really enjoyed this, since I'm a history geek, & a fan of historical romance, & I'm going to HAVE to go read more of her books! show less

Thoroughly enjoyed this book. Told a deep dive story into the life of Princess Margaret (Henry VIII's eldest sister) and her life. It reflects her struggles, hopes and many disappointments along the way. The book portrays her as desperately wanting love in her life and never achieving it. It shows her difficult struggles in trying to obtain divorces, claim regency of her son and what an exhausting life she had (although much of it was caused by her imo). It did seem that the book went at a nice pace but then near the end it was a race to the finish and I don't know why but I loved the book as I seem to do with all Jean Plaidy novels.