Take It or Leave It Challenge - April 2012 - Page 1

For those new to this challenge: More info and monthly index can be found in post #1 of this thread or this TIOLI FAQS wiki.

Simple directions for posting to the wiki can be found at the bottom of each month's wiki page.


...logo by cyderry

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Here we go, TIOLI fans…your challenge for April…

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Challenge #1: Read a book with a title in which the last letter is in rolling alphabetical order (with the option of skipping one letter)***********************************************
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You may want to reread what I just said.

The challenge for April will be much like the alphabetical challenge we did previously. However, the difference will be that the alphabet will be seen at the end of the title instead of the beginning.

Because there are just some letters that won’t work easily, you may choose the next letter or the letter after that (but you cannot skip more than one letter each time). I’m also making this rule so that we don’t have books added to the list just to be “space fillers’. List books that you really want to read.

For example, if the last book listed was Breeding Ground, you may then choose a book whose title ends either with E or with F.

For this challenge only, do not remove your books at any time. This is to keep the alphabetical order intact. I will remove the books not COMPLETED when I do the monthly stats.

You may use main title or main title with subtitle (not both). You may match a book at any time.

For visual cues, please enter the last letter also in parentheses. It is much easier to eyeball it that way:

Amrita (A) – Banana Yoshimoto - bohemima
The Grandmother’s Club (B) – Alan Cheuse – SqueakyChu
Breeding Ground (D) – Sarah Pinborough – Dejah_Thoris
Coraline (E) – Neil Gaiman – alcottacre

In the above example, it was okay to skip the letter “C” and move on to “D”. Moving on to “E” from “B” would have been invalid.

You may work together in order to get the books you want to read listed, but you must do so in the sequence described above.

I think by now you get the idea. Go to it!

Have fun!

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Other Fun Stuff (not part of the TIOLI challenge):

1. The April 2012 TIOLI Meter - Optional page on which you may track your TIOLI reading. FYI: This is not meant to be competitive - only fun!
2. I Know I'm a TIOLI Addict When... - Frog Logo is on this page!
3. Morphidae's List of Previous TIOLI Challenges - You may use this reference (Do a control-F scan) to avoid repeating a previous challenge. If your idea is similar to a previous challenge, just make it unique by adding a new "twist" to it. (Updated 02/04/12)

Challenges #1-6
1. Read a book with a title in which the last letter is in rolling alphabetical order (with the option of skipping one letter) - Msg #1.
2. Read a book by an Italian author or one that is set in Italy for Primavera in Italia - Msg #6
3. Read a young Adult book first published since 2007 - Msg #4
4. Read a book about the Titanic (or a book by or about someone on the Titanic) - Msg #11
5. Read a work in which one of the main characters (fiction) or subject(s) (non fiction) can be described with a word ending in –ologist - Msg #13
6. Read a non-fiction work (essay, memoir, biography, narrative non-fiction, &c. included) which features humor or is written by someone known for their humor - Msg #14

Challenges #7-12
7. Finish a book that you started between January 1, 2012 and March 28, 2012
8. Read a book by a different author that is related to another book you've read for TIOLI
9. Read a book with a title that includes only the vowels in the word "April"
10. Read a book which features people (or groups of people) from different cultures coming into contact with each other - Msg 1:30
11. Read a first person narrative in which the narrator is the opposite sex from the author
12. Read a Sherlock Holmes novel, collection of stories, or another "Sherlockian" work .

Challenges #13-18
13. Read a book that has been adapted into movies multiple times.
14. Read a book with any of these words contained in its title or a tag: statehood, state/states, union, Louisiana, Orleans, 1812, 18/18th (no embedded).
15. Read a book with a wild mammal (no pets) in the title
16. Read a book whose title contains a word from the Tarot's Major Arcana or the book is based on the archetype of the fool's journey
17. Read a book about information
18. Read a book from the 2012 Orange Longlist of nominated books

Challenges #19-23
19. Read a book that has won a literary prize not previously featured on TIOLI (Not: Newberry, Hugo, Orange, Booker, Pulitzer, Nobel, Alex, Lambda Literary Award, Edgar, Nebula, or Agatha)
20. Read a book that has been published in an edition with a flower on the cover
21. Read a book that you acquired or borrowed between 1 January 2012 and 30 March 2012 and that you need to read in April to meet a deadline eg to review, for reading group, non renewable library book
22.
23.
24.

Let me know if you need more wiki pages!

No more new challenges after April 4, 2012.

Am I first again?

Yeah, Madeline!

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Challenge#3
read a Young Adult book first published in the last five years.
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Going to the Wiki now!

Ha!

Man, deern & kidzdoc, you don't even give a girl a chance to finish editing pages!!

Nathalie (Deern) and I have a shared challenge: Read a book by an Italian author or one that is set in Italy for Primavera in Italia (Spring in Italy). I wanted to base a TIOLI challenge on Antonio Tabucchi, the Italian author who died earlier this week, and Nathalie came up with the Primavera in Italia idea.

I'm planning to read these books in April:

The Leopard by Giuseppe di Lampedusa
Little Misunderstandings of No Importance by Antonio Tabucchi
The Missing Head of Damasceno Monteiro by Antonio Tabucchi
The Name of the Rose by Umberto Eco

Madeline, If a letter is skipped, can someone insert the missing letter?

>5 SqueakyChu: LOL! Sorry; I wanted to post our challenge, so that I can get back to my current TIOLI book, Maimonides by Sherwin Nuland.

If a letter is skipped, can someone insert the missing letter?

Nope! It has to be a rolling challenge that moves forward only.

> 8

You know what was funny, Darryl? At first I posted Ciao America! for my own challenge. Then I found a book I thought I'd like better. Then I discovered that the book I was going to use fits your challenge anyway. Great minds...well, you know!

Challenge #4: In honor of the 100th anniversary of the sinking of the Titanic, read a book about the Titanic, or one that is written by or about someone on the Titanic.

The book can be fiction or nonfiction but the Titanic must play a substantial role.

Besides mystery author Jacques Futrelle, I'm not sure that any other authors were onboard but perhaps there were some others.

>10 SqueakyChu: Excellent! Eccellente!

I'm Challenge #5 three months in a row.

Challenge #5: Hooray for –ologists!

Read a work in which one of the main characters (fiction) or subject(s) (non fiction) can be described with a word ending in –ologist. The Please note what kind of –ologist.

Some of the many possibilities include: anthropologist, archaeologist, biologist, cosmetologist, cosmologist, criminologist, demonologist, ecologist, Egyptologist, epidemiologist, geologist, graphologist, meteorologist, musicologist, numerologist, oceanologist, paleontologist, pathologist, primatologist, psychologist, seismologist, theologist, volcanologist and zoologist.

I planning to read a bunch of mysteries for this Challenge.

This challenge might need someone to adjust the wording to make it less cumbersome, but!

Challenge 6: Non-fiction humor - read a work of non-fiction (essay, memoir, auto/biography, narrative non-fiction, &c included) which features humor or is by someone known for humor

So a book by a comedian, even if the book itself isn't strictly humorous is fine. A tongue-in-cheek short piece of narrative non-fiction is also okay. America (the Book) or I Am America (And So Can You) are also good (they kind of walk the fiction/non-fiction line, imo, so books like them will be okay). I'm going to try to read The Wordy Shipmates by Sarah Vowell, who I first heard of because of a humorous radio essay she performed.

#13 Perfect, Dejah. I've had a book about meteorologists that I've been meaning to read for the past 6 months or so. This'll be a bit of added incentive to read Authors of the Storm.

My challenge this month is driven by necessity. It's called Spring Cleaning: Finish a book that you started between January 1, 2012 and March 28, 2012. It's time to clean out the backlog and move into spring with a fresh slate!

I tried to add an h but someone else got in as I was doing it (this keyboard sucks!) Someone now needs to come up with an i or j!

>16 _Zoe_: Thanks, Zoe! I haven't finished God's Philosophers, so this challenge is perfect for me. I'm sure that I'll have other books to add.

Thanks Zoe - I will probably finish two of my 6 books but not the other 4. And I've just realised I'm reading an i,

And I've just realised I'm reading an i

Heh!

If we get there I have an x too!

>18 kidzdoc: You're very welcome! God's Philosophers was one of my chief motivators for that challenge. Though I have at least two other books as well....

I have an x book too! What's your x?

>17 elkiedee: Sorry, elkiedee! I was rather excited to see the "h" free.

>16 _Zoe_: Perfect for me, too, Zoe. Pehaps I really will finish up the ER book...

And Madeline, thanks for posting this today! A very pleasant end to a difficult day.

My pleasure!

Just sitting here eating a soft pretzel with tomatoes and drinking a glass of wine and what should I find - oh, it's a perfect night.

Challenge #8: Read a book by a different author that's related to another book you've read for TIOLI. The books can be on the same topic or have the same characters or the authors can be related to each other in some way. There is an option, if you haven't already read the related book, you can read both for the challenge but can't count either until you've read both. I wanted to do this mainly because I wanted to see how Marge Piercy's husband Ira Wood is as a writer. Say how the books are related. If you've read neither, separate the books by & and put how they're related in parenthesis - then relist the pair in reverse order. If you've read one, separate the books by - and put the relationship, the book and author in parenthesis.

My planned reads for the month:
The Dovekeepers - Alice Hoffman ( I wish I could have got to it in March, but it didn't work out) & ( genre Jewish folklore) Golem: The Story of a Legend - Elie Wiesel) I haven't read either of these books
Flight - Shernman Alexie -(topic Native American history The Journey of Crazy Horse: A Lakota History - Joseph M. Marshall III)
The Kitchen Man - Ira Wood - (married to Marge Piercy - Sex Wars)
Mrs. Dalloway - Virginia Woolf & ( topic suicide/depression) The Hours - Michael Cunningham
Oracle Bones: A Journey Through Time in China - Peter Hessler - (married to Leslie T. Chang -Factory Girls)
Richard the Third - William Shakespeare (characters Richard III The Daughter of Time - Josephine Tey)
Rock Bottom - Erin Brockovich & (topic environmentalism) Sick Puppy - Carl Hiaasen
Soldier Dogs - Maria Goodavage - (topic dogs/war Nubs: The True Story of a Mutt, a Marine & a Miracle, 2010 - Brian Dennis)
Territory - Emma Bull - (characters Doc Holiday Doc - Mary Doria Russell)
Women's Diaries of the Westward Journey - Lillian Schlissel - (topic pioneer women So Much to Be Done: Women Settlers on the Mining and Ranching Frontier - Ruth Barnes Moynihan)

Challenge #9: Read a book with a title that includes only the vowels in the word "April" A's and I's are OK; no E's O's, or U's. Titles with a single vowel are OK, as long as the vowel is A or I!

> 26

Marge Piercy?! I'm reading a book by her right now. That book came into my hands in a strange way, and I bought it right away. I never even heard of that author before. In what context do you know her, Joyce?

Anyway, here's my story about that book. It's called Pesach for the Rest of Us. I was in the Jewish book store buying Haggadahs for our family's upcoming seder. Because some of our guest will be non-Jews, I asked about what would be interesting reading for them. Somehow that book of Piercy's got placed into my hands. I'm not sure if it got there by accident or intention. I turned the book over and saw a blurb on the back written by a rabbi that I know. I figured that if Rabbi Alana Suskin liked that book, I'd buy it right away. It's a great book and one about which I'll write a review when I'm done.

In the back of the book I found a burnt spot. It's right at the crack between the cover and the pages. Now why would a new book that I just bought from a book store have such a thing? I'm mystified by this book now! :)

Whoo!!

My challenge for this month is: Read a first-person narrative in which the narrator is the opposite sex from the author.

Eta: This is Challenge #11.

I'm going to out on a limb here and suggest we'll have more female authors than male. :)

Challenge #10: read a book about people (or groups of people) from different cultures coming into contact with each other. This is partly one of those pick-a-challenge-to-fit-a-book challenges, as I am keen to start reading Rich Relations, about US servicement in the UK during World War Two (the subtitle is 'the American occupation of Britain'). But it's also a subject I am interested in anyway, so I will set up a discussion thread and hope to get some good recommendations!

Oh, Madeline, you're in for a treat. She puts lots of Yiddish phrases in her work, lots of Jewish references even if she's not writing about Judaism, and she combines history and characters to make a great story. The first book I ever read by her was He, She and It which is the first time I ever heard the term "golem". The second book I read by her was Woman on the Edge of Time, which is about a poor Latina woman (another favored group of hers) and time travel with lots of social commentary. The last of her books I read, which I just finished a few days ago is Sex Wars: a novel of Gilded Age New York which is about the rise of the woman's movement in the last half of the 19th century. What are you reading? I hope you love her as much as I do.

> 31

Go back up to message #28, Joyce. I wrote more about why I got the book. It tells all about Passover. It's such a fun book. I'm going to pass it around the seder table so others can enjoy it. Parts of it are informative; other parts are funny. It's chock full of recipes that are completely useless to me because I can't cook without explicit directions, and she doesn't give recipe ingedient amounts. She's a delight to read, though! I don't keep many books, but this will be part of my permanent collection, I believe.

For anyone planning to read The Moon is Down for the Steinbeckathon, I've put it in Challenge #1...

Sorry Madeline, I was writing without looking over the whole list. She is a delight, and maybe now you'll move to some of her fiction?

> 33

Hey, with your recommendation, why not?

33>> Katie someone put The Moon is Down in #13(?)

OK!

Challenge #12: Read a Sherlock Holmes novel or collection of short stories featuring Sherlock Holmes OR another Sherlockian work.

By Sherlockian, I mean a non-Conan Doyle novel or series of stories featuring Holmes and/or Watson; a novel that makes explicit references to Holmes (eg The Sherlockian); a contemporary work like The Baker Street Letters by Michael Robertson, or a work that is in the Holmes/Watson tradition: set in foggy Victorian/Edwardian London, with a Scotland Yard detective and/or a private detective investigating evil doings.

If in doubt, ask!

Note: individual short stories don't count for this on their own. There are several collections, such as The Adventures of Sherlock Holmes and The Return of Sherlock Holmes that count.

>36 cyderry: - I don't see anything under challenge 13....?

> 37

It's still number 13 and still in challenge #1. You can match it there. I have no idea what Cheli was asking either.

>39 SqueakyChu: - I'm confused. I originally put it in Challenge #1 so I don't understand what Cheli was saying. Not a big deal, and I'm tired, so easily confused :)

> 26

Can you change how you requested the listing of the books for your challenge, Joyce, so that both of the primary books show up next to the number (or the number and asterisk)?

Otherwise, the books all seemed jumbled together. :(

Perhaps, for those *pairs* that you haven't read, you could list them twice, the second time in reverse order?

Reason: I want the currently read books all to line up at the hashtag.

Ah, yes. I'll list the second in the pair in reverse order.

38>> I swear to God there was a challenge on the wiki for a book that had either the sun or the moon and they had The moon is Down. Weird...

There was - Crazymamie was added her sun / moon Challenge specifically for The Moon is Down - when she realized that it had already been added to Challenge #1, she quickly removed her Challenge.

> 42

Phew! Thanks!!

Could you stick the Reading at the end (so it sticks out)? That will help me later.

> 44

Haha! That explains it.

It was me - I had entered a challenge for challenge #12 that was to read a book with either the word sun or moon or both in the title, and had entered the Steinbeck book under it, but by the time I figured out how to do it and got it posted (rookie here), that book had already been entered under challenge #1. I just deleted my challenge after that - but it was challenge 12, not 13. I just participated in TIOLI for the first time in March, and had never posted a challenge before. Did I mess something up?

Oh Dejah - thanks. We cross posted!

No mess up, I just thought I was seeing things! LOL ;-)

Joyce, can challengers match your books? If so, how are they to do it?

> 47

You messed up nothing at all except for the minds of a few of us! ;)

I guess challenges could match the way they do with any other challenge, now that I've separated the titles. I think you can only match the first listed book though, not the one it refers too unless you list both. Or, of course, if you've already listed a book that refers to a challenge, you could list the book you want with its own reference. Oh, dear. I don't like making complicated challenges.

They don't call me crazy for nothing!

I think you can only match the first listed book though

That sounds good.

of course, if you've already listed a book that refers to a challenge, you could list the book you want with its own reference.

What?!!

#6: thanks Darryl for adding the challenge! I might be sharing The Leopard with you, although I am not sure I can read 3 Italian books in one month. It's a challenge within the challenge. Oh - forgot I also need to read a Tabucchi, so it would be four.

So far I've added:
- The Moon is Down as shared read for #1
- A Question of Upbringing by Anthony Powell for #1
- The Leopard by Giuseppe di Lampedusa for #2
- The Tartar Steppe by Dino Buzzati for #2
- The Prague Cemetery by Umberto Eco for #2

Edit:
- Pictures from Italy by Charles Dickens for #2
- La Testa Perduta di Damasceno Monteiro by Antonio Tabucchi for #2 which is the Italian edition of Darryl's The Missing Head of Damasceno Monteiro, so it's a shared read.

Challenge 12 - YESSSSSSSS! I am in a very Holmesian mood at the moment (have been watching the BBC Sherlock season two), so very happy to see this ;-)

Joyce, I'm getting into your challenge and editing it to make it easier for others to understand. Hope that's okay. Let me know if it's not.

Wandering star, am glad that worked for you!! I've got to read two of the Holmes short works for my RL book club, wanted to read The Yard of which I just got an ARC, and have had The Sherlockian sitting on my Kindle for eons. I think A Three-Pipe problem by Julian Symons might also fit, and it's on my TBR stack. The challenge was partly inspired by reading The House of Silk earlier this year, which I liked a great deal.

>54 SqueakyChu:, yea, scratch that second part. Edit away as you like.

I got challenge 13:

Read a book that has been adapted into movies multiple times.

I chose Invasion of the Body Snatchers, which has been done four times. I figure that a lot of classical books have had multiple movie adaptations, so this hould be a fairly easy one.

> 59

Joyce, I changed the wording jof the entries just a wee bit to make it easier for challengers to understand.

> 62 (question to Joyce and referring to Joyce's challenge):

(I changed my question to read:)
Do you allowed shared reads without the matching related book or not?

#61 -- yes, I'd love to read The Dovekeepers for this challenge, but can't come up with a related book, however. Am still unclear -- do we have to have a related book of our own, even if it doesn't match that of the original poster??

Chatterbox, I read A Three Pipe Problem a while back and really liked it. Definitely a fit.

If anyone else is reading David Copperfield for the group read this month, I put it under Challenge #13.

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Challenge #14: Statehood Challenge:
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Louisiana was admitted to statehood in the United States of America, 200 years ago, on April 30, 1812, the only state to join the union in that year . Previously the Territory of Orleans, with certain boundary changes, it became the 18th state - Louisiana.

Read a book with any of these words contained in its title or one of its tags: statehood, state/states, union, Louisiana, Orleans, 1812, 18/18th. Embedded words do not count.

Challenge #15: Lions, and Tigers, and Bears, Oh My!

Read a book with a wild mammal in the title. No pets, i.e. dogs, cats, etc. No embedded words. No mythical animals.

Examples:

The Tiger's Wife by Téa Obreht
The Day of the Jackal by Frederick Forsyth
To Touch a Wild Dolphin by Rachel Smolker

Challenge #16: The Fool's Journey

In honor of Fool's Day, read a book detailing the Fool's Journey or one tied to one of the Major Arcana of the Tarot Deck. The title can be a word from the Major Arcana as well.

See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Major_Arcana for a list of the Major Aracana of the Tarot Deck
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Fool_(Tarot_card) The Fool's Journey

Examples:

Emperor by Stephen Baxter
Robin Hobbs's The Fool books
Stardust - Neil Gaiman (The Star)
The Eye of the World - Robert Jordan (The World)

April is Mathematics Awareness Month and this year's theme is:

"Mathematics, Statistics, and the Data Deluge"

In observation of the celebration, I've added

Challenge #17: The Data Deluge

Read a book about information: information science, information theory, information retrieval, information society, information overload, information literacy, etc.

Examples could be:
The Information : a History, a Theory, a Flood by James Gleick
Google and the Digital Divide by Elad Segev
The Gutenberg Galaxy by Marshall McLuhan
The Visual Display of Quantitative Information by Edward R. Tufte
Salsa Dancing into the Social Sciences : Research in an Age of Info-Glut by Kristin Luker

Obviously, all books *contain* information; this challenge is to read a book *about* information.

(Besides, I'm more a librarian than a mathematician. Yeah, I'm fishing for recommendations.)

#68 That soooo fits with the Fool's month, lol, says former math major...

Swynn, would a historical treatment like Reading and Writing in Babylon count? This was cutting-edge information retrieval technology at the time....

>61 SqueakyChu: & 62 Yes, Madeline and Suzanne, you can add a shared read without reading the book to which it refers. It'll be a good time for those of us who weren't able to join in The Dovekeepers March bandwagon.

>69 raidergirl3:: Agreed!

>70 majkia:: Yes.

I expected that if I required a mathematical, statistical, or computational slant the challenge would have a very narrow appeal. On the other hand, many of us are interested in historical or cultural aspects of information, so those approaches are allowed -- encouraged, in fact.

> 72

Hooray! The Dovekeepers looks really interesting. Oh, if only I had more time in my life.

How many of us have ever visited Masada (the setting for The Dovekeepers)?

*raises hand*

Oh, I've been to Masada. I hadn't realized what The Dovekeepers was about; maybe I'll try to read it next month as well.

>69 raidergirl3: Great! I had hoped that someone would post a challenge based on this year's Orange Prize longlist. I'm planning to read The Song of Achilles and Gillespie and I this month.

#73 swynn - here's a recommendation for your challenge:
Salsa Dancing Into The Social Sciences: Research in an Age of Info-Glut - Kristin Luker

>77 VioletBramble:: Thanks, Violet! That looks like more entertaining than the average research handbook.

I've added it as an example above, and to the neverending TBR list.

>74 SqueakyChu: I have also been to Masada but have never read any related books. And I had not heard of The Dovekeepers but I love Alice Hoffman. Turtle Moon is one of my favourites.

So excited about the Sherlock Holmes challenge! I'm reading The Complete Sherlock Holmes. (And you can too--it's only 1200 pages.)

I didn't read a single book in March because of school busy-ness, and I haven't read any fiction since mid-February. I've got some spare time next week, and I'm going to read something fun.

Let's hear it, everyone:

Give me an M!
Give me an A!
Give me a D!
Give me an E!
Give me an L!
Give me an I!
Give me an N!
Give me an E!
What does it spell?
Madeline!
Who do we love?
Madeline!

>44 Dejah_Thoris: and 47 - Aha! Now I get it! Thanks, all :)

Jumping high into the air and waving my pompoms!

Carrie, about your Challenge #9 to Read a book with a title that includes only the vowels in the word "April", I wanted to fit in April Lady. I'm probably too dense this morning after losing sleep wondering whether Madeline was EVER going to post... but, is the 'y' in Lady counted as a vowel?

I was wondering too whether Madeline was EVER going to post. I did not get to bed until 2am, and had to be up at 6am. Before I went to sleep, there was still no April TIOLI thread. When I checked soon after 6am, there it was with about 40 posts already. The only way to catch her is never to go to sleep!

>84 countrylife: According to www.oxforddictionaries.com, the "vowel-ness" of 'y' is rather arbitrary, but generally is considered a vowel when making a vowel sound (myth, my) and a consonant when making a "yuh" sound (young, beyond). By that definition, the 'y' in 'lady' would be a vowel, since it is making a long e sound.

ETA: In all the examples I can find, 'y' is used as a vowel in words that contain no other vowels. So it could be a consonant in 'lady' by virtue of not being the only vowel. (This is only speculation; can we get a linguist to weigh in?)

> 81

LOL!!

That reminds me of my cheerleader days back in nursing school. We (Sinai Hospital School of Nursing - Class of 1968) had a cheerleading squad with the ugliest imaginable outfits. We alternated blue/red stripes with blue/red polka dots. I was one of the cheerleaders. I don't remember if I was in the striped outfit or the dotted one. They were both equally as bad.

Our basketball team (consisting only of women at that time) played other nursing schools in Baltimore, Maryland, USA. One year, our basketball team lost everysingle game! :)

*must look for pictures*

> 83

Which of the two outfits should I get for you, Joyce? :)

> 84

after losing sleep wondering whether Madeline was EVER going to post...

Yeah, countrylife. Blame it on me! :)

> 85

The only way to catch her is never to go to sleep!

Great idea, Genny! I second that. :D

I still can't believe that kidzdoc discovered me putting it up before I even finished editing all the pages. What eagle eyes that man has!

Thanks, casvelyn. Challenge #1 happened to roll around at the right time, so I popped it in there.

ETA: In all the examples I can find, 'y' is used as a vowel in words that contain no other vowels. So it could be a consonant in 'lady' by virtue of not being the only vowel. (This is only speculation; can we get a linguist to weigh in?)

In "Lady", Y is a vowel. It could easily be spelled "ladi" or "ladee" or "ladie", right?

(sorry!)

>91 keristars: I thought it was a vowel, but I wanted to make sure I wasn't missing some obscure rule. I took one semester of linguistics as an undergrad, so I don't know that much about phonetics, and what I do know is quite rusty.

I just finished a book which I can recommend for challenge #10: read a book about people from different cultures coming into contact with each other. Consumption by Kevin Patterson. Set on Rankin Inlet in Nunavut, the novel gives a very interesting look at native life on the unforgiving tundra, the changes in their lifestyle when southerners came up to open mines, or to offer 'help'. There is a medical aspect, as well, since their new closer confines started spreading T.B., and diabetes became a new affliction for them. (PS: It also fits in that hard to fill province of Nunavut, if any one else here is participating in The Canadian Reading Challenge group.)

wandering_star (@30), for your challenge , would you consider saints and sinners 'from different cultures'? (No worries if it doesn't work for you. I'm close to finishing a piddly little freebie ebook that isn't even any good, but thought I'd pop it into a challenge if I could.) Never mind. Duh!-It can go in the started before now challenge.

>87 SqueakyChu: Polka dots all the way please.

> 94

LOL!

I have just added Challenge 19: Everyone Loves A Winner

Read a book that has won a literary prize But it must be a prize not previously featured on TIOLI. I went though the list of previous challenges and the following prizes can't be used for this challenge:

Newberry, Hugo, Orange, Booker, Pulitzer, Nobel, Alex, Lambda Literary Award, Edgar, Nebula and Agatha

I'm looking for the obscure prizes, the ones we don't hear much about.

#96 Every year, as a member of Mystery Readers International, I vote on the Macavity Awards. So, if someone is looking for a mystery to fit Judy's challenge, here are some ideas...

http://www.mysteryreaders.org/macavity.html

Wikipedia has a looooong list of literary awards....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_literary_awards

Just a note re Judy's challenge -- I did one involving the Orwell Prize last May, so that's a non-starter, too, I suspect. And I think there has been a Giller Prize challenge.

>96 DeltaQueen50: - Judy, What about an award like the Neustadt International Prize (thank you, Darryl, for introducing this one to me!) which is given to an author for a body of work (much like the Nobel) as opposed to a single book? Could we read any work by a winning author?

On the plus side: don't forget that there are journalism prizes that offer literary awards. Last year, the Overseas Press Club honored Let our Fame Be Great by Oliver Bullough; More Money than God by Sebastian Mallaby won last year's Loeb Award.

What about books that win a more anonymous award but also a big one? Can we list them for the smaller prize even if they go on to win the Orange or Booker??

#74: I've also been to Masada a few times and am already reading The Dovekeepers. I've taken it off the March TIOLI and added it to the shared read here as despite the setting it just hasn't grabbed me. I've never read Alice Hoffman before.

#60 yoyogood - does the adaptation need to have been a cinema movie or would a TV movie/TV series/TV drama count?

I have just added Challenge #20: Spring blossom: Read a book that has been published in an edition with a flower on the cover. You do not need to read that edition.

103 souloftherose - Sure, TV adaptations work for me.

#105 Thank you! I think I was trying to find a place to fit the book that Dee just created challenge #20 for.

Re: Challenge 19:

- #99 - Thanks Suzanne, I must have missed the Orwell Prize challenge when I went through the list. I did the Control F search for Geller Prize and got no hits so I think the Geller would work for my challenge. Unless someone knows for sure that there was a challenge built around the Geller Prize?

- #100 - Katie, Yes, I think that would certainly work. It's still a literary prize.

- #101 - Suzanne, I think even if a well known prize has been awarded, the book/author would count for the lesser known award.

#107 - Samantha_Kathy - That's exactly the kind of prize I am looking for!

If you go to your profile page, click on statistics and memes, then under common knowlege on the left side of the page, click on awards...and voila! a list of your award winning books. Some of these aren't really awards, (1001 books to read before you die, Oprah's Bookclub)--but still I now have several really good ones to choose from that are currently living on MT TBR.

yoyogod--would a play made into multiple movies (and adaptations--and ballets! and modern retellings!) work for your challenge? Looking for a home for Morphys Magical Read, A MidSummer Night's Dream.

Soupdragon, must it be a *single* flower for your challenge #20?

Oooooh, having so much fun with the prize challenge!! I'm amazed at how many I have; dismayed by how many remain unread. I'm going to have to stop soon, though. There are just too many!!!

>84 countrylife: et al. - I'm not considering Y as a vowel for this challenge - just A, E, I, O, & U.

>111 streamsong: Streamsong - if it won't fit into yoyogod's Challenge, I've been trying to fit it into Challenge #1, but I keep missing M....

>112 countrylife:: No, one or more flowers is fine!

I'm having the same problem as Suz in #113. Way too many options.... and I have gotten absolutely NOTHING done at work today :)

>96 DeltaQueen50: Fabulous idea, Judy! One LT resource for people interested in some (but far from all) of the lesser known prizes is The Prizes group, which lists several dozen awards.

I'm sure that I could fill the month, if not two or three months, with books I own that fit your challenge. Off to check...

Gracious! I had a harder time than usual trying to plug my planned reads into TIOLIs! Thank you to the flower for making way for my last straggler.

>111 streamsong: Sure, a play that was turned into a movie works too.

Yay! Thank you yoyogood!

Here are some recent books I own that are high on my TBR list and ones I could read for challenge 19 (Everyone Loves A Winner), if anyone else is interested:

Brodeck's Report by Phillipe Claudel (2010 Independent Foreign Fiction Prize)
One with Others: a little book of her days by C.D. Wright (2010 National Book Critics Circle Award for Poetry)
The Inheritance of Loss by Kiran Desai (2006 National Book Critics Circle Award for Fiction)
Atonement by Ian McEwan (2002 National Book Critics Circle Award for Fiction)
The Age of Wonder: How the Romantic Generation Discovered the Beauty and Terror of Science by Richard Holmes (2009 National Book Critics Circle Award for General Non-Fiction)
My Name Is Red by Orhan Pamuk (2003 International IMPAC Dublin Literary Award)
The Master by Colm Tóibín (2006 International IMPAC Dublin Literary Award)
De Niro's Game by Rawi Hage (2008 International IMPAC Dublin Literary Award)
Pure by Andrew Miller (2011 Costa Book of the Year)
Turn of Mind by Alice LaPlante (2011 Wellcome Trust Book Prize)
Keeper by Andrea Gillies (2010 Wellcome Trust Book Prize)
Life Ascending: The Ten Great Inventions of Evolution by Nick Lane (2010 Royal Society for Science Books Award)

One book that I'll read this month, if I receive the ARC in time from the UK or find my own advance copy in London, is Three Strong Women by Marie NDiaye, which won the Prix Goncourt in 2009; I'm planning to review it for the upcoming issue of Belletrista. It will be released in the UK on Apr 26. Oh...that reminds me; the first book I bought this year, The Map and the Territory by Michel Houellebecq, won the Prix Goncourt in 2010. So, I'll definitely read that novel for this challenge.

I'm sure I have lots of other books that fit, but I'll start with Turn of Mind and The Map and the Territory, as I have both books on my Kindle, and keep my fingers crossed that I can get my hands on Three Strong Women.

So many great challenges this month! I think I'll call out sick for the next two weeks.

You don't think they will be suspicious???

But I agree, this is a bumper crop of challenges.

>123 Chatterbox: You don't think they will be suspicious???

Yep, especially if I get better just in time to make my flight to London the Friday after next.

#118 - Glad you like the challenge, Darryl! It's amazing how many book awards there are. I even found a Bad Sex Award! (And I've actually read a couple of Bad Sex Award winners - Birdsong and Savage Lands.)

105) mention of tv adaptations caused me to immediately think of Casino Royale, which was on tv before if was made into two different films.

Anyone on a James Bond need could read Casino Royale or Thunderball (made into Thunderball and Never Say Never Again).

I do not currently have any plans to reread either.

Darryl, I'm meant to be reading Pure for my RL book group, and I have a copy of My Name is Red, unread on the TBR shelves, so I will try to get to both those in April if that suits you. I'm off to check how many more obscure prize-winning books are lurking unread in my collection...

I noticed that The Yard by Alex Grecian is listed under two different challenges (5 & 12) and thought I'd mention it in case you wanted to go for the shared read. That book is on my TBR list, but I doubt I'll be able to join you this month. I'll be curious to see what you all think of it!

Madelaine - the link on the first page of the wiki isn't working for #19-24 challenges. I don't know how to fix that.

> 129

Thanks. Fixed.

I'm so excited. I finally got a letter that I needed for Madeline's challenge!

>110 streamsong: Streamsong
What a great idea! I am learning so much about LT that I didn't know. I love these lists, the statistics and memes. Thanks for pointing me here.

#131 Me too, Lori! I was sitting at my computer waiting for X to come around again.

>131 thornton37814: I know what you mean, Lori - there are a few book this month that I may only be able to fit in if I catch the right letter, while a few fit in several. Go figure.

#131 And I'll join you in it.

I've been waiting for N but have to drive home and won't be back on line for another two hours. At this rate, we'll be through the alphabet all over again.

I missed X twice!, but it will fit in the Book Awards challenge now, so I won't wait for it anymore.

I'm glad that I found one that you want to read, Linda. I'm behind on that series, and I'm ready for another one. I've also been trying to figure out how to complete my 12 in 12, so I've identified several books that will fill those holes as well as mysteries I'd targeted to read. I have already bumped a few books down to May or June so that I can work in some shared reads or fill spots on the 12 in 12.

This is a great month of challenges! I'm excited.
I'm supposed to (and will) do a GR of David Copperfield which is, as Lucy would call it, a "chunkster." I'm almost tempted to skip it so I can read more TIOLI books!

I can't believe I keep missing 'z'. I guess Y and A are fairly easy so the 'skipping' rule helps to keep the list g(r)o(w)ing.

For challenge 19, I'll read one of the books I own that won the Gratiaen prize, an award that Michael Ondaatje established with the money he got for the Booker (I think it's named for his mother's maiden name). It's for writing in English by residents of Sri Lanka. I have both Sam's Story and The Road From Elephant Pass, I'll probably read the one I can find first.

Lots of good challenges this month, fortunately it also includes some holidays so I can do a bit more reading!

#93, countrylife... I'm afraid that's not really what I had in mind. Angels and devils meeting would be one thing... (or even angels and humans, as in the excellent The Vintner's Luck) but I think saints and sinners don't really apply!

Oh you guys ♥ - there's a few more additions to my humor non-fiction challenge, and pretty much every single one is one I'd like to read. This sends my heart a-flutter with joy. And all because I saw The Wordy Shipmates on one of my TBR piles and decided to create a challenge around one aspect of it that doesn't fit my usual reading habits, but does mesh well with what I'm in the mood for lately - naturally, so that I could possibly find new things to read.

I'm really curious about Bearded Lady, which chatterbox listed. It's an Amazon Single and free for Prime members, and it's fairly short, so it wouldn't be difficult to add to my reading this month. :D (The trouble is that I don't trust Amazon reviews as much as LT information, of which there's mostly none so far!)

Keri, I shall bump Mara Altman's mini-book up to the top of my reading list, so that you can decide if it's worth a shot! I couldn't resist it...

Another not resistible book on this month's TIOLI was one that was offered as Amazon's Daily Kindle deal as a YA/dystopian title. I'm getting addicted to that list, to the weekend deals (this weekend is Anathem for $1.99) and the 100 books under $3.99 a month for Kindle. Fab deals, a bit eccentric. Still, I'm just as excited about what might be on April's deal list as I am about the TIOLI challenges!

>107 DeltaQueen50: I did the Control F search for Geller Prize and got no hits so I think the Geller would work for my challenge. Unless someone knows for sure that there was a challenge built around the Geller Prize?

I think it was the Giller prize that already had a challenge. Unless there is another prize called the Geller, I think a typo tripped you up. (The Giller is one of the prizes for Canadian writing)

>141 Chatterbox:, Chatterbox--Wow they called Anathem YA? Dystopian, yes, in an alternate universe way, but I definitely would not call it YA. Not that it's beyond some older kids, but they have to be the sort who are willing to bend their heads around some 950 pages of philosophy and quantum physics. Did you buy it? I'd love to hear your take on it. I started it towards the end of February--this month I'll knock it off the TIOLO list!

#143, 141:

I bought Anathem as well, and look forward to reading it.

Yay, majika! It will be fun to talk about it! I had hoped to lurk along with the tutored read, but it didn't generate a lot of discussion. I have it listed under challenge 7.

> 145

I had hoped to lurk along with the tutored read, but it didn't generate a lot of discussion.

I was a lurker there as well. I was sorry that Anathem did not generate more discussion on that tutored thread. I wanted to see if it would be a book I might want to try some time, but I never got the "flavor" of it. I see it mentioned elsewhere all the time, though.

I've been waivering about Anathem but when Suzanne mentioned it's $1.99 on Kindle I went ahead and splurged.
But yikes! at 950 pages when am I going to tackle this?!

> 147

at 950 pages when am I going to tackle this?!

...over the next three months?! ;)

Yeah, I'm doubting I can get it read in April what with other planned reads. OTOH, I whipped through Reamde, so who knows....

#143, sorry i wasn't clear. there was another sale book last week that was YA that I bought on a whim and just found I can use in a challenge.

Swynn --

Does the following count for your Challenge?

Placing History: How Maps, Spatial Data and GIS Are Changing Historical Scholarship

I've been meaning to read this one for ages, and while it's more about the display of data / information I thought it would fit.

#142 Thanks Raidergirl, spelling has never been my strong point! I again went to Morphy's list and did a control-F search for Giller, Giller Prize and Giller Award and got no hits. So I think if someone wants to use a book that has won a Giller Prize it is ok.

My turn to post a thread fthor those books I can't fit in elsewhere - I need to read and review about 7 books this month, and I've fitted 2 into other challenges, but doubt I can do all of them like that. Have you got any books you need to read this month? Other reasons I thought of could include a reading group discussion or a library book you know you won't be able to renew. Or have you got another reason?

I have added a restriction - you should have acquired or borrowed the book this year and before this challenge went up - I've set the date at 30 March.

However, you may match reads outside of these restrictions on the challenge.

>151 Dejah_Thoris:: Definitely!

153 elkiedee> Wow.I had decided to declare APril Bizarro Fiction month on my blog, where I'd be trying to review one work of bizarro fiction there a day, but I had about ten or so books left that I couldn't fit into a category in March or April. I think I should be able to fit most or all of them into your challenge now. Yay!

I'm about to start The Dovekeepers for my related books challenge, #8. I think I've liked almost everything I've read by Alice Hoffman, so I'm looking forward to it. I'm also about to start on my Nook book (great for reading at the gym), The Enchanted April for the Italy challenge. This will be my first ever Elizabeth von Arnim book.

I just finished my first book for the month. April In Paris is a story about a German solider who falls for a French Resistance Fighter in occupied Paris during WW II. This is a short book, but packs a lot of story into it's few pages.

> 157

I really enjoyed that story when I read it as well, DeltaQueen50. I hope you get some others to share that read with you.

I just added my current read to the "spring cleaning" challenge and had a little chuckle - ReadingReadingReadingReadingReadingReading
ListeningReadingReadingReading...

> 159

Yeah. It's amazing to see such an active challenge! Meanwhile, I have no time for reading as I am actually doing spring (AKA Passover) cleaning. :)

The real fun will be in seeing how many of them actually end up completed by the end of the month!

You're right, Zoe! :)

But really, Zoe, it's just 'cause we're so happy to have a challenge that we can immediately fit all the books we didn't finish last month. I admit, it made me chuckle too. ;)

I have a question for Challenge #4. I purchased a Kindle Single called Lifeboat No. 8: An Untold Tale of Love, Loss, and Surviving the Titanic which I wanted to use for this challenge but there is no touchstone for it. Am I still able to use it for this challenge?

164> You probably just need to catalogue it, first. It seems like no one's added it to LT yet is all.

#165 Thanks alot, Keri!! It worked. Learned something new today :0)

If it's about the Totanic, it'd certainly fit the challenge. I was unaware of it and will have to look for it.

Passing through TIOLI: A discussion

Hello, fellow challengers,

One thing I've noticed about our TIOLI challenges is the way LT-ers pass through them. I'm assuming that this is for the same reason that I've tried some other challenges and left them eventually.

There is actually a good thing about this "pass-through" in that, as some people leave, others join, making the TIOLI challenges self-sustaining and keeping them from growing too large for me to handle (which, I admit, had once been a concern of mine). They seem to have stabilized over the past two years at a very pleasant size (small enough for me to handle, yet large enough for there to be great variety in challenges, reading options, and participants). I'm very pleased with how it has sorted itself out. Remember the time when I feared that more than 18 challenges would be "too much" and had to take a poll about limiting the number of challenges? Ha!

So, for our discussion, tell us (any or all) of the following:
1. Why did you join the TIOLI challenges?
2. What have you liked about them?
3. What have you disliked about them?
4. How would you improve them?
5. If you've thought of dropping out of them, what precipated those thoughts?
6. If you've already dropped out (and are still here lurking - I see you!), what caused you to do so?
7. Do you feel that the TIOLI challenges take the spontaneity out of your reading? Why or why not?
8. Have you recommended the TIOLI challenges to others? If so, why?

Thanks for you input!

For now I am enjoying the very short moment where I am top frog with 2 book finished:
- The Missing Head of Damasceno Monteiro by Antonio Tabucchi for challenge #2
- The Moon is Down by John Steinbeck for #1,
both shared reads.
I have to think about those questions for a bit before posting an answer.

1. Why did you join the TIOLI challenges? I like discover the books I own but have not read through the eyes of others.

2. What have you liked about them? I like shared reads. Finding a new way to enjoy books. The comaraderie most of all.

3. What have you disliked about them? Not a thing I dislike.

4. How would you improve them? Nothing to improve.

5. If you've thought of dropping out of them, what precipated those thoughts? Never thought of dropping out.

6. If you've already dropped out (and are still here lurking - I see you!), what caused you to do so? NA

7. Do you feel that the TIOLI challenges take the spontaneity out of your reading? Why or why not? Not at all, I chose which challenges to tryout and also give my self lee way to read other books which may or may not fit a challenge. Sometimes a choose a challenge based on a book I had planned on reading anyway. Or create a challenge that will fit it.

8. Have you recommended the TIOLI challenges to others? If so, why? I have. When I know that someone I talk to is reading the same book I suggest they check out TIOLI and add their book to the challenge.

Thanks so much, Madeline for creating TIOLI. The end of the month has never before been so exciting!!!!

1. Why did you join the TIOLI challenges?
........ The 75 Books Group was mentioned elsewhere in LT, so I came here and lurked awhile, decided I liked the feel of the group, and then joined. I began by following the threads here of earlier LT friends; when I saw their fervor for TIOLI, naturally, I jumped in there, too.

2. What have you liked about them?
........ Love the variety of challenges; there's always some place to play. Love that it expands my reading horizons. When I see books talked about in the threads and piling up on the wikis, I appreciate the links that make it easy to check out a book to see if its one I want to read.

3. What have you disliked about them?
........ Not enough time to fit a book into every challenge! What can you do about that, Madeline? ;)

4. How would you improve them?
........ From a personal standpoint, I wish that adding a challenge had a rule associated with it, to add our challenge to the wiki first, before posting on the main thread, just to avoid confusion about which number it was. But that's just a little nitpicky thing.

5. If you've thought of dropping out of them, what precipated those thoughts?
........ N/A (Though I have dropped out of other groups, I stay here for the fun and reads in common.)

6. If you've already dropped out (and are still here lurking - I see you!), what caused you to do so?
........ N/A

7. Do you feel that the TIOLI challenges take the spontaneity out of your reading? Why or why not?
........ Not for me. The spontaneity is still there. My "hmm, what looks good next" response just finds it's answers more frequently in a TIOLI list, and in this way I'm enjoying a wider variety of books than I had previously.

8. Have you recommended the TIOLI challenges to others? If so, why?
........ Yes, in the same way that someone's thread here sparks something that makes me think they may enjoy, say, the Canadian challenge. Somewhere else, a book discussion about a current TIOLI read might spark me to mention it there. Why? For more discussion about our common books.

#2. I like the sense of community TIOLI creates. I come back over and over because of that. I love the shared reads. I also like the variety of challenges and how that has expanded my own reading landscape. Sometimes I just ignore a challenge if it's not a good fit for me.

#4. What countrylife said.

#7. It has shifted the spontaneity in my reading but not eliminated it. I've learned to embrace the "OLI" part of TIOLI, and that has helped in this regard. As someone who tends toward all-or-nothing thinking, that has been a gift, actually. I can participate without letting it drive the spontaneity and fun out of my reading.

> 170

The end of the month has never before been so exciting!!!!

LOL!! Were you here the month that my computer was down, and people couldn't find me? I think that must have been the most exciting month's end. I was oblivious to everything because I had no internet access. :)

Questions - what fun:)

1. Why did you join the TIOLI challenges? - It looked like fun.

2. What have you liked about them? - They are fun.

3. What have you disliked about them? Absolutely nothing

4. How would you improve them? - I can't think of anyway to improve them

5. If you've thought of dropping out of them, what precipated those thoughts? - I've never thought of dropping out.

6. If you've already dropped out (and are still here lurking - I see you!), what caused you to do so?- N/A

7. Do you feel that the TIOLI challenges take the spontaneity out of your reading? Why or why not? - No my reading is still spontaneous. I have quite a few books unread in the house and the TIOLI helps to narrow down the possibilities but I always feel free to leave a book if it doesn't fit my mood that month.

8. Have you recommended the TIOLI challenges to others? If so, why? Only by mentioning that a book I am reading or have read fits a TIOLI challenge.

> 171

Not enough time to fit a book into every challenge! What can you do about that, Madeline?

I was thinking of making each day into 26 hours. Two hours of TIOLI time. :)

> 4

From a personal standpoint, I wish that adding a challenge had a rule associated with it, to add our challenge to the wiki first, before posting on the main thread, just to avoid confusion about which number it was. But that's just a little nitpicky thing.

Not nitpicky at all. I will only add a challenge to the index once it's posted to the wiki. To avoid confusion about challenge numbers, I would suggest that challengers not number any challenge that is announced on the wiki. That would eliminate number confusion entirely.

> 172

I can participate without letting it drive the spontaneity and fun out of my reading.

Great! I always want the TIOLI challenges to keep the spontaneity of allowing people to choose what they want to read when they want to read and also allowing them to not read books that they suddenly don't want to read (without feeling a compulsion to finish a disliked or boring book).

> 174

my reading is still spontaneous.

Hooray!

1. Why did you join the TIOLI challenges?
When I joined the 75 group I was curious what those interesting TIOLI threads were about. Lurked for some days and then joined. With a single book first, but quickly with many more.

2. What have you liked about them?
I get old tbrs off my shelve and at the same time get many ideas for new reads. And I love the excitement at month end when we are waiting for the new thread to appear. I also like the mixture of easier challenges and the more demanding ones.

3. What have you disliked about them?
Nothing

4. How would you improve them?
No idea.

5. If you've thought of dropping out of them, what precipated those thoughts?
I never thought of dropping out. There were only months where I was too busy with my work to search my shelves for possible reads and where I was sure I wouldn't be able to update the wiki in time. So I am taking little breaks sometimes when I feel I can't take a month's challenge.

6. If you've already dropped out (and are still here lurking - I see you!), what caused you to do so?
--

7. Do you feel that the TIOLI challenges take the spontaneity out of your reading? Why or why not?
It depends on each member. It takes spontaneity out of my reading in the sense that I can plan my reading ahead for the month - which I love to do, so it's a very good thing for me. But instead of planning you can as well just check the wiki when looking for sth. new to read and spontaneously decide - which I have done as well when my tbr stack was finished.

8. Have you recommended the TIOLI challenges to others? If so, why?
Yes, because they are fun and because I love reading challenges and believe others might as well.

1. Why did you join the TIOLI challenges?
Why not? It sounded like fun. Frankly, it's nice to be part of a group to whom the comment "TIOLI challenges sound like fun" makes perfect sense.

2. What have you liked about them?
They help me choose titles from a staggeringly long reading list. They also prompt me to pick up books I'd never otherwise read.

3. What have you disliked about them?
Collectivey: nothing. Individually, I've thought that an individual challenge was too broad or too narrow or unclear or just not appealing. In those cases I just choose "leave it," and it's still all part of the game.

4. How would you improve them?
Clone Madeline to make it easier on her.

5. If you've thought of dropping out of them, what precipated those thoughts?
Oh, every once in awhile I go overboard and I feel that TIOLI is driving all of my reading instead of just being an entertaining adjunct to it. Then I back off for awhile. "Leaving it" is part of the game, right?

6. If you've already dropped out (and are still here lurking - I see you!), what caused you to do so?
N/A

7. Do you feel that the TIOLI challenges take the spontaneity out of your reading? Why or why not?
On the contrary: I go to the library with a plan to pick up a book having property X. I go home with the first interesting book I find having property X ... usually one I didn't even know existed when I woke up that morning. It feels pretty spontaneous to me.

8. Have you recommended the TIOLI challenges to others? If so, why?
Not exactly. I mention them in my thread, but I figure most 75ers know about them already.

> 179

I've thought that an individual challenge was too broad or too narrow or unclear or just not appealing.

I've thought the same thing, but I guess that's what makes it appealing to many people. Some months I dislike more challenges than I like, but then my taste I reading is so different than that of others. If I get really brave (like when I read a Jane Austen book, I actually try some of those categories I think I won't like. I guess that's why we call it a challenge! :)

Clone Madeline to make it easier on her.

It's fine just as it is. Really. Not too demanding, but a pleasant pasttime.

Oh, every once in awhile I go overboard and I feel that TIOLI is driving all of my reading instead of just being an entertaining adjunct to it.

Actually, when I started the TIOLI challenges, I thought that people would pick just one book a month for this. Was I ever wrong! I do wish people would not feel compelled to make all of their monthly reads as TIOLI reads. It is supposed to be an adjunct to your maonth reads (believe it or not!).

Then I back off for awhile. "Leaving it" is part of the game, right?

I actually think this is good so that you don't make all of your reading TIOLI-driven. The point of TIOLI was also shared reads to get people talking to one another. I don't always practice what I preach, though. *blushes*

1. Why did you join the TIOLI challenges?
As a way to prod me to get some books of the TBR mountain faster, for fun, why not??

2. What have you liked about them?
I try to find at least one book per challenge per month, and that drives me to books that may have been low priority, or that I hear people discuss but haven't read. I've discovered a lot of books that I ended up loving via TIOLI that without it I might not have picked up or had already deferred reading for months or years.

3. What have you disliked about them?
It's simply about my reading patterns, rather than TIOLI per se, but I find I'm sometimes less willing to delve into a 600/700 page non-fiction chunkster if it's likely that I won't finish it during the month. But that's behavioral psychology of reading, not TIOLI, that is the issue.

4. How would you improve them?
A very minor issue, but I wouldn't ban all repeat challenges. Admittedly, I don't think we want to see a "book with color in the title" every three or four months, but in the same way we seem to have repeated Orange Prize challenges, I wouldn't mind seeing some challenges repeated. Maybe there's a way to figure out which ones would be worth repeating -- the ones that had the most books posted or the most shared reads in a given month can be repeated after a year or 18 months? There is still a lot of creativity out there, but after a certain point, crafting some challenges that are different will be tricky. (eg, read a mystery set in Africa with a hippo on page 27). On the other side, I can think of "evergreen" challenges, like reading an about-to-be published novel, reading a borrowed book, reading a TBR for longer than two years book, reading a chunkster or work of narrative non-fiction. Again, within parameters.

5. If you've thought of dropping out of them, what precipated those thoughts?
Some rather obnoxious PMs, some from troll accounts, from people who think I lie about how much I read. For the record, I read rapidly and on average, spend five or six hours a day reading.

6. If you've already dropped out (and are still here lurking - I see you!), what caused you to do so?
N/A

7. Do you feel that the TIOLI challenges take the spontaneity out of your reading? Why or why not?
To some extent, but that isn't always a bad thing. And often, especially now that there are 20 or so challenges out there, there is a lot to choose from. For instance, there are 60 books that I could get into a challenge this month and that I want to read. That is 2x the number I will actually read. There's lots of room for spontaneity there. And then there's the "leave it" factor.

8. Have you recommended the TIOLI challenges to others? If so, why?
Nope. Figured if they are interested, they will find it. I did.

> 178

It takes spontaneity out of my reading in the sense that I can plan my reading ahead for the month - which I love to do, so it's a very good thing for me.

Heh! If I planned all my monthly reads ahead of time, I'm sure to *not* read about half of them. For me, that's what takes the spontaneity away. Others, though, like to plan their reads ahead. It sure beats meas to why. *puzzled*

1. Why did you join the TIOLI challenges?
My to read pile has gotten out of hand, and I figured they would be a good way for me to choose which books from it to read.

2. What have you liked about them?
I like that they're open enough that I can usually fit even my weirdest books in somewhere.

3. What have you disliked about them?
Some of the individual challenges are in areas that just don't appeal to me at all, but that's to be expected.

4. How would you improve them?
Get more people with more diverse interests to come up with and participate in challenges.

5. If you've thought of dropping out of them, what precipated those thoughts?
I haven't thought of dropping yet.

6. If you've already dropped out (and are still here lurking - I see you!), what caused you to do so?
I haven't dropped, though I do tend to lurk.

7. Do you feel that the TIOLI challenges take the spontaneity out of your reading? Why or why not?
No, I feel that my reading tends to be divided between books I really want to read and try to fit into a challenge and books I've been meaning to read ad so so because I know they'll fit into a challenge.

8. Have you recommended the TIOLI challenges to others? If so, why?
No

> 181

I've discovered a lot of books that I ended up loving via TIOLI that without it I might not have picked up or had already deferred reading for months or years.

Such a great reason!

I find I'm sometimes less willing to delve into a 600/700 page non-fiction chunkster if it's likely that I won't finish it during the month.

Likewise! Heh!

I wouldn't mind seeing some challenges repeated.

If you've noticed, I've become much more lenient with this issue. That's for two reasons. The most important is that I don't want newbies to be forced to go back and look among all of the challenges that we've been doing to see if it's a repeated. that would surely be a turn-off for them. Secondly, some challenges are actually worth repeating if we don't do them too close together. I want the challenges to be mostly fresh. I think we've been keeping to that.

the ones that had the most books posted or the most shared reads in a given month can be repeated after a year or 18 months?

I'm not going to make a rule about that. I think it will be readily apparent if our challenges become too repetitive. At that point, I might burst in with a plea for more original challenges. At this point, we're getting *very* original!

t after a certain point, crafting some challenges that are different will be tricky

I totally agree! I, the creator of our TIOLI challenges, often can think of no new challenges from month to month (but they always suddenly come to mind as each month ends!).

read a mystery set in Africa with a hippo on page 27

Wasn't I getting close to that in one of my recent challenges? LOL!!

Some rather obnoxious PMs...

Was that issue resolved completely? How were you able to resolve it? Is anyone else being harrassed? If so, I'd like to know about it (by private message only, please).

> 183

I like that they're open enough that I can usually fit even my weirdest books in somewhere.

Ha! I like that!!

Not completely, Madeline, but a combination of replies pointing out that LT has the ability to track ISP addresses and compare to those to members' ISP addresses has caused it to abate a lot. It's now rare vs. once a week or so.

1. Why did you join the TIOLI challenges?
--I discovered LibraryThing right around the same time TIOLI priginally started, so I kind of stumbled into it while exploring LT. I loved the idea of finding suggested reads from a specific list of themes, and I was looking for a way to diversify my own reading which had fallen into a rut
2. What have you liked about them?
--The variety of books
3. What have you disliked about them?
--When challenges are too broad, I don't find them challenging anymore. But those are the ones I simply "leave"
4. How would you improve them?
--I've wondered if putting star reviews on the wiki might help highlight worthy reads. I've been intrigued by challenges and want to know about all of the books in them (like this month's nonfiction humor challenge), but it's not always easy to see what the end result of the book is. If someone put COMPLETED - 4 stars I might look into it more and add it to my wishlist, but I wouldn't bother with a 2 star. Just a thought
5. If you've thought of dropping out of them, what precipated those thoughts?
--I've become less obsessed about making all of my reads TIOLI, which I thought meant I was losing steam on them. But I still like to read the thread, and I still use TIOLI to help choose my reads for the month, but if there is something I WANT to read, I read it regardless
6. If you've already dropped out (and are still here lurking - I see you!), what caused you to do so?
--N/A
7. Do you feel that the TIOLI challenges take the spontaneity out of your reading? Why or why not?
--I get my spontaneity at the beginning of the month. I have bookshelves full of books that I plan to read, and rarely does something leap off the shelf as a "Must Read" right away. So TIOLI helps me pick books from the shelves and gives me a reason to read them now. Reading other reviews, comments, posts help me add items to my wishlist - which I pull up on my phone everytime I enter a bookstore
8. Have you recommended the TIOLI challenges to others? If so, why?
--I'm not very chatty on LT, so I don't think I've lured anyone into the group, but socially I am proud member of LT, and when I find books, I'll tell people I've heard about them on TIOLI

> 186

Not completely

That's so sad.

Was admin ever made aware of the problem, or did you prefer not to go that route?

> 187

When challenges are too broad, I don't find them challenging anymore.

Me, too!

I've wondered if putting star reviews on the wiki might help

Truthfully? I'd rather that you visited the threads of the challengers who read those books that are possibilities for you and there start conversations with them about those particular books. Most people do list books they read, even if they don't do a review. Challengers who have their own threads love visitors who come to talk to them about what they've just read. Trust me.

if there is something I WANT to read, I read it regardless

Ahhhh! The casual TIOLI challenger. So there is such an animal! ;)

socially I am proud member of LT, and when I find books, I'll tell people I've heard about them on TIOLI

Sweet!!

1. Why did you join the TIOLI challenges?
I lurked for a while and it seemed like fun. (Everyone makes TIOLI beginners really welcome)

2. What have you liked about them?
They're a great way to actually get books off the TBR pile. Without TIOLI, I was only ever adding books to the TBR pile and reading the most recent acquisitions! Also, they introduce me to titles outside my reading "rut". I've read so many great books that I would never have picked up, left to my own devices.
I also like the OLI part. I've even begun to discard TBR books that I have read and not much enjoyed - a major miracle as I find de-cluttering a bit of a challenge! I love the variety of challenges and always do some easy and some difficult ones (As a classics grad, I was broken-hearted last month to not find a title with "ides").

3. What have you disliked about them?
Too many books, too many challenges, not enough hours in the month! Also they introduce you to more authors and books to add to the TBR pile!

4. How would you improve them?
Absolutely nothing, although the idea of cloning Madeline has its attractions.

5. If you've thought of dropping out of them, what precipated those thoughts?
No chance

6. If you've already dropped out (and are still here lurking - I see you!), what caused you to do so?
N/A

7. Do you feel that the TIOLI challenges take the spontaneity out of your reading? Why or why not?
No, I still read pretty much what I want to. If I cannot find a suitable challenge, I add one, or just read the book anyway!

8. Have you recommended the TIOLI challenges to others? If so, why?
Not specifically, but I have happily explained them on my thread.

> 189

Oh, I love that idea!

Eeek! That calls for a poll...If so, it would look something like this:

My Losing Season - Pat Conroy - SqueakyChu - COMPLETED (4)

ETA: If star ratings were to be added, this would have to be optional as not all challengers believe in or name star ratings.

> 191

Everyone makes TIOLI beginners really welcome

That's so nice to hear!

they introduce you to more authors and books to add to the TBR pile

Yeah. That's a definite disadvantage.

although the idea of cloning Madeline has its attractions

Not for me! Then I'd have to find two dresses for my younger son's wedding in May. :(

>192 SqueakyChu: I like the idea of stars too - particularly where we disagree!

1. Why did you join the TIOLI challenges?
I can't remember; it was so long ago!

2. What have you liked about them?
They're a fantastic way to guide my reading at any given moment. I love making lists of books to read, and a one-month time frame seems to be perfect for me. The year-long challenges can feel a bit too rigid, but with TIOLI there's always something new. And it's helpful to have some direction when faced with my enormous TBR pile, so that I'm not just overwhelmed.

3. What have you disliked about them?
Nothing that I can think of. Of course there are individual challenges that I don't like for whatever reason, but TIOLI as a whole is great.

4. How would you improve them?
I still hope in vain that everyone will someday take up the idea of counting TIOLI points that they've participated in for the month. It would encourage participation in shared reads and create a different sort of competition that would be winnable even for people who don't read a huge number of books. I know it's a lost cause, though ;)

5. If you've thought of dropping out of them, what precipated those thoughts?
There are sometimes months when I back off either because the challenges aren't particularly appealing, or I have a very fixed idea of what I want to read for the month already, or whatever, but I haven't considered stopping entirely.

7. Do you feel that the TIOLI challenges take the spontaneity out of your reading? Why or why not?
Not at all. I don't feel obligated to stick to my TIOLI plans, and I have no problem with reading a book that doesn't count for TIOLI, so I'm still free to read whatever I want whenever I want. TIOLI just helps me lay out a rough framework for the month's reading.

8. Have you recommended the TIOLI challenges to others? If so, why?
Yes, because I like to tell people about good things!

On a side note, it's horrible that someone would get harassed about their TIOLI reading :(

> 196

I still hope in vain that everyone will someday take up the idea of counting TIOLI points that they've participated in for the month.

I, personally, don't want to count even one more thing! ;)

On a side note, it's horrible that someone would get harassed about their TIOLI reading

Agreed.

Madeline (@175), of course you're the TIOLI queen, and I bow to your wishes, but since you can't reach out and thump me with your scepter, I'm going to risk beheading and say that I disagree about challenge numbers. May I address an appeal to the queen's court? Because not every challenge needs a whole thread devoted to it, and since you don't like to have the notation "@ post xx" added to the wiki, I end up scrolling through the main thread looking for the challenge number associated with the challenge as you've listed them in post 2. Of course the ones with separate threads are easy to find, since you add their links to that list in post 2. But to find more details on the *other* challenges, you have to scroll back or edit/find through the whole thread. Having that challenge number already posted there with its challenge information is a great help. So, if a person adds their challenge to the wiki *first* and then adds their challenge to the thread, they've got the correct number to work with, which they can add to their thread post, it still "eliminates number confusion entirely", and is a big help to anyone digging through these long threads looking for certain challenge parameters. (Alternatively, you could post the link for the individual challenge post along with its challenge in post 2. That would make this discussion moot, but creates more work for you.) I abide by the decision of TIOLI royalty. With a clumsy curtsy, I say, "thank you for hearing my appeal." :)

Since people seem to be pretty evenly split on the star ratings, how about doing it on a trial basis for one month and then rethinking?

>198 countrylife: What countrylife said. I need the numbers!

1. Why did you join the TIOLI challenges? I liked the small number of participants, as compared to the 75ers or 12 in 12 groups. I was also looking for a category challenge that didn't last an entire year (like the 12 in 12) because I get bored easily.

2. What have you liked about them? The really creative categories

3. What have you disliked about them? Nothing whatsoever

4. How would you improve them? No idea. Can't think of anything I'd like to change.

5. If you've thought of dropping out of them, what precipated those thoughts? I "dropped out" of LT and reading completely during the month of March because of crazy grad school busy-ness. But I'm back on LT now, and I'm going to try to get some reading done in the second half of April. I don't foresee myself leaving TIOLI permanently, at least not anytime soon.

6. If you've already dropped out (and are still here lurking - I see you!), what caused you to do so?

7. Do you feel that the TIOLI challenges take the spontaneity out of your reading? Why or why not? If I plan my reading for the month too strictly, I rebel against myself and end up reading something totally different. If I don't plan my reading at all, I get overwhelmed by the ~1200 books on my To Read list and don't read anything. TIOLI helps me plan somewhat while at the same time I know most any book I choose will fit somewhere.

8. Have you recommended the TIOLI challenges to others? If so, why? Nobody I know (in real life, anyway) reads, so no, sadly. Most of the people I interact with her on LT are already quite content with the challenges and groups they've already joined.

1. Why did you join the TIOLI challenges? I kept seeing TIOLI mentioned on other sites like "What are you reading" so I checked it out and stayed because I like the idea of a reading challenge.

2. What have you liked about them? I haven't liked them all, but I do like them when they challenge me to read something I hadn't considered or that I had considered but never got around to reading.

3. What have you disliked about them? I'm not all that fond of specific challenges in which the books have nothing to do with each other.

4. How would you improve them? No improvement necessary. There's such a variety of challenges something always calls out to me. I've completely embraced the OLI part, and it does make the whole experience more comfortable.

5. If you've thought of dropping out of them, what precipitated those thoughts? I haven't

6. If you've already dropped out (and are still here lurking - I see you!), what caused you to do so? NA

7. Do you feel that the TIOLI challenges take the spontaneity out of your reading? Why or why not? As pbadeer said, the spontaneity comes at the beginning of the month when I'm trying to find books to fit the challenges. Also, throughout the month new books come to mind. I like the combination of planned structured reading around a topic and spontaneous additions.

8. Have you recommended the TIOLI challenges to others? If so, why? I used to, then Madeline came up with the first rule of Fight Club is don't talk about Fight Club; so I haven't for a while.

1. Why did you join the TIOLI challenges?
I had thought about something like it the year before it started but I guess Madeline is a better salesperson.

2. What have you liked about them? A different structure every month

3. What have you disliked about them? Some of the newer seem to be a bit too way out for me.

4. How would you improve them? Have a scheduled time for reveal

5. If you've thought of dropping out of them, what precipated those thoughts?
Having to wait to find out what they are

6. If you've already dropped out (and are still here lurking - I see you!), what caused you to do so? NA

7. Do you feel that the TIOLI challenges take the spontaneity out of your reading? Why or why not? I am not a spontaneous reader - I have books that I want to read this year and I use TIOLI as a means to choose the books for each month.

I do like the idea of a schedule time frame for reveal -- if not a specific time (after all, Madeline has a life, too...) Approaching the end of the month, there are always more books I could read for the current month's challenges, and I have to winnow. Being able to "punt" some into next month makes that easier. If I have a rough idea when the next month will be up, that's less stress, fewer days when I go back and forth to check if it's up yet, etc. Even if it's just a note saying: hey folks, it will be posted sometime on the 27th this month.

I also like countrylife's idea re tying the challenge to the post. Lots of challenges don't have threads; it can be a pain to dig through the challenge thread looking for details.

I am not a big fan of posting star rankings beside books. I already feel like I'm logging a lot of stuff -- I note when I'm reading it, when I complete it, I add up the pages, I note which challenge it belongs to -- and it's easy enough to go to the book page or the challenger's page to find the rating & review, if any. And as someone noted, not everyone wants to award stars.

Just my 0.02!!!

> 198

I end up scrolling through the main thread looking for the challenge number associated with the challenge as you've listed them in post 2

I hear you. Rather than add the reference to the wiki, let me add them to the index. That should work for both of us.

Alternatively, you could post the link for the individual challenge post along with its challenge in post 2. That would make this discussion moot, but creates more work for you.

We could try this. I'm game.

Let's do a poll on the issue of challenge numbers:This is in reference to the issue discussed in message #98.

> 199

I'm not sure I want to muddy up the wiki with more information (i.e. star ratings) unless I see that a clear majority of people want that.

> 201

The really creative categories

I love those as well!

I've gotten a bit confused about what message numbers we're referring to. Are you say that the wiki should link to the message in the main talk thread where the challenge is described? I'd say that's not necessary for the vast majority of challenges; ones that are more complicated can have their own dedicated thread, or people can just ask for clarifications.

> 202

I'm not all that fond of specific challenges in which the books have nothing to do with each other.

Heh! To avoid that, you have your own interesting monthly challenges!

the first rule of Fight Club is don't talk about Fight Club; so I haven't for a while.

LOL!!

Here's what I do. If I see that someone has mentioned TIOLI or asks about it, I am forthcoming and offer a gracious invitation to join (mostly through a private message). I don't "spread the word", though. :)

> 203

I had thought about something like it the year before it started but I guess Madeline is a better salesperson.

I never knew that! LOL!!

Some of the newer seem to be a bit too way out for me.

Heh! Those are the exact ones I like. Glad there's something here for everyone.

have a scheduled time for reveal

We've been through this before. One thing that I can guarantee is that such a thing will never happen as long as I am doing the monthly posting.

Having to wait to find out what they are

Here's what you can do. Don't look for the new TIOLI challenge until 12 noon on the last day of the month. In that way, you'll always be able to presdict they'll be there. ;)

> 204

I do like the idea of a schedule time frame for reveal

The time frame is the end of the month. That's really as specific as I want to get as my obligations preclude me from setting a specific date or time. I also don't want to reveal it ahead of time because I think the surprise element is fun.

it can be a pain to dig through the challenge thread looking for details.

I hear you. I'm willing to give this a go.

I am not a big fan of posting star rankings beside books. I already feel like I'm logging a lot of stuff

I agree with you, but I wanted to see how others felt.

> 209

Are you say that the wiki should link to the message in the main talk thread where the challenge is described?

That's exactly what people are asking for.

1. Why did you join the TIOLI challenges?
I joined the 75ers this year and saw a lot of TIOLI talk and figured it out what it was and loved the idea.

2. What have you liked about them? finding new books and a way to organize TBR pile

3. What have you disliked about them? I don't get much feedback or conversation

4. How would you improve them? try to encourage more shared reads

5. If you've thought of dropping out of them, what precipated those thoughts? sometimes it seems like a lot of work, keeping tally and updating the wiki and remaining invisible

6. If you've already dropped out (and are still here lurking - I see you!), what caused you to do so? NA

7. Do you feel that the TIOLI challenges take the spontaneity out of your reading? Why or why not? not all at. It's broadened the way I consider books and it's always fun if you find a particular book that fits a challenge that wouldn't normally catch my eye

8. Have you recommended the TIOLI challenges to others? If so, why? no.

1. Why did you join the TIOLI challenges?
2. What have you liked about them?
3. What have you disliked about them?
4. How would you improve them?
5. If you've thought of dropping out of them, what precipated those thoughts?
6. If you've already dropped out (and are still here lurking - I see you!), what caused you to do so?
7. Do you feel that the TIOLI challenges take the spontaneity out of your reading? Why or why not?
8. Have you recommended the TIOLI challenges to others? If so, why?

1. Because of Zoë. It's all her fault for mentioning it somewhere and me seeing it and thinking "you know, Zoë often has some pretty good ideas" and then realizing that...

2. I tend to get stuck in reading ruts or go for the newest thing that passes my way, but with the TIOLI challenges, I can encourage myself to read something I've had on my TBR for a long time, or maybe try something different if it appeals. I read Nothing to Envy and Swamplandia! at least partly because those books were read for TIOLI and I learned about them here, then moved them higher on my TBR because of a challenge they fit. (And they're two of my favorite books read in 2011.)

5. I like the "Or Leave It" part of the challenge. I was too overwhelmed last autumn with things going on in my life (got a promotion at work with TONS more responsibilities at the same time as I was involved in a lot of crafting in prep for a holiday season trip at the same time as I had a recurrence of depression, all of which made it harder to find time to read), so I just quietly stopped following the TIOLI threads and did my own thing. At the time, some of the overwhelming bits were the rush at the end of the month to find the new challenges, when I was still working on the current ones, and also some of the more finicky challenge themes. But then I started feeling better and got back on my reading-feet, and here I am again.

I've actually changed my reading goals for 2012 to include TIOLI. Instead of a "75 Books in 2012" challenge for myself, I'm set at 1 TBR Pile that I've owned for a while and 1 TIOLI challenge book - it could be the same book, but the point is to both change up what I'm reading (the TIOLI - I go for thematic challenges) and to work through the stacks and stacks of books on my floor that I've not read yet, despite constantly buying new books (some of which I'm reading immediately).

These goals have worked out very well so far - in January, I read a bunch of books about China; in February, it was a couple LGBT books that I always want to read more of, but are so much less common than I'd like; last month, I didn't get to as many books as I'd hoped, but that's mostly because the depression and chronic pain flared up again, and two books (both qualifying for TIOLI challenges, though not read because of TIOLI) took a while to get through. Both those books were a bit outside my easy/candy reading habits, too.

We'll see how April goes - I've got a new theme to explore, and several books listed on the challenge I made (Humor in non-fiction) look appealing, once I finish the TBR book that inspired it. I'm also reading Tristram Shandy for a Tutored Read, though, and that might take up all my reading time - not just because it's a long book, but because I'm stopping a lot to comment on it.

That said...
7. I've always been fairly spontaneous with some of my reading - mostly new acquisitions that I have to read right now. TIOLI both works with that (new books because of TIOLI!) and helps control that impulse and work on the TBR piles.

And I just realized that if I have time this month with Shandy and the Wordy Shipmates (and maybe another humor NF?), there's a book I'm kind of itching to read that will fit the Related Book challenge - Dianna Wynne Jones's Howl's Moving Castle was the subject of an essay in the book I read last month that fit the Mercator challenge. So there's an excuse for a new book not on my TBR stack. Spontaneity! ;)

Here's what you can do. Don't look for the new TIOLI challenge until 12 noon on the last day of the month. In that way, you'll always be able to presdict they'll be there. ;)

Has anyone ever told you, Madeline, that you can be a little bit evil?

> 214

I don't get much feedback or conversation

Think of TIOLI as an ice breaker. My idea is that you now know who is reading what and who is sharing your reads. From there, don't be shy to visit threads of those to whom you want to speak about the books in TIOLI that you find interesting. Everyone here loves talkative visitors to his or her own thread.

try to encourage more shared reads

Heh! I'm trying!!

remaining invisible

I don't want kittenfish to feel invisible. C'mon, challengers! Stop by her thread and talk to her about her reads!!

> 216

Has anyone ever told you, Madeline, that you can be a little bit evil?

No. Are you going to be the first? :)

Thank you :)

> 215

you know, Zoë often has some pretty good ideas

Heh! I like many of Zoe's ideas myself!

I'm also reading Tristram Shandy for a Tutored Read,

That's very exciting. I hope to lurk on your thread.

1. Why did you join the TIOLI challenges?

Curiosity after a few months here and then I was hooked.

2. What have you liked about them?

The challenge of finding a challenge to fit each book into, shared reads

3. What have you disliked about them?

Not much, was sad to hear anyone was getting abused, why are some people so stupid. I don't like reestrictions which may prevent people from joining in with a particular book. For example, the red spine challenge might mean that several people in the US would pick a shared read but people who have another edition with a blue spine can't join in - and this may particularly affect readers in other countries. Last month one challenge specifically excluded ebook editions and audios I think. These restrictions seem a shame in such an international and varied group.

I'm sad sometimes if newness and therefore availability mean it's not possible for all those interested in a book to do a shared read.
c
4. How would you improve them?
.
I would encourage people to check their challenge doesn't exclude people from a shared read unnecessarily

5. If you've thought of dropping out of them, what precipated those thoughts?

N/A - main reason might be a lack of time - I tend to move to a new place online every now and then.

6. If you've already dropped out (and are still here lurking - I see you!), what caused you to d so?

7. Do you feel that the TIOLI challenges take the spontaneity out of your reading? Why or why not?

No, but review commitments sometimes do

8. Have you recommended the TIOLI challenges to others? If so, why?

Yes - to Dee who several time read one or more of the same books as me in the same month.

Well I have to wonder if this conversation was initiated because of a comment about TIOLI I made on another thread last week but whatever the case I will make a couple comments and hope I'm not stoned by the real fans. I was a very early proponent of TIOLI and even remember the first TIOLI challenge (Read a debut novel) which is a far cry from Read a Book with an animal on the right hand page and a beverage on the left which is the main problem I have with TIOLI today. A lot of the challenges are just too bizarre. They take too long to find a book that will fit the challenge. So for the most part, when the challenge is too narrow, I look to see if anyone is reading a book that I can just add as a shared read. If not I just move on.

But that's just me being crabby. I am perfectly happy with the Leave It part of TIOLI and feel no compulsion to read any book for any particular challenge. Admittedly, most of the books I list on the challenges are books I intended to read anyway and they just happened to fit. But there are exceptions. For instance, this month I had no intention of reading The Leopard or The Name of the Rose; that is until I saw Darryl's challenge to Read a Book by an Italian Author. The other three books I have listed for challenges this month I was planning on reading anyway. And whether I read any or all of them is subject to change at the spur of the moment because if someone raves about a book on a thread, and I own it or it's easy to get from the library, I may forgo all reading plans and pick up that book.

It's a miracle I even saw this conversation because, for the most part, I seldom read this thread because there are just so many threads to follow and not enough time. You know, Too many Books Threads, Not Enough Time.

Well, gee. Thought required! Not sure I'm up to it, but will try:

1. Why did you join the TIOLI challenges?
Good way to get some books of the groaning, shuddering shelves; a way to see books I'd never heard of but might be interested in; see what my friends and acquaintances are reading; enjoy if not use unique challenges. And the fun, fun name!

2. What have you liked about them?
Shared reads and new titles/authors; challengers' creativitiy

3. What have you disliked about them?
My own reaction to them.

4. How would you improve them?
I don't know; it would be an internal matter rather than a TIOLI matter.

5. If you've thought about dropping out, what precipitated those thoughts?
The belief that I was allowing TIOLI to take over my reading; this is not to be construed as a fault of TIOLI, but of my own.

6. If you've already dropped out, what caused you to do so?
I put too much pressure on myself, with my "all or nothing" ways, as Ellen noted above.
How did you know I was lurking about? Must have left a trail of books...

7. Do you feel that the TIOLI challenges take the spontaneity out of your reading? Why or Why not?
Well, here again, it's my feeling that it's my own competetiveness, and my own sort of compulsive tendencies that slowly led to a lack of spontaneity in my reading.

8. Have you recommended the TIOLI challenges to others? If so, why?
Yes, I have, because TIOLI is a terrific way to expand one's reading horizons.

And I did drop out for the first quarter of this year, just to get myself back into my own personal reading mode. I'm joining up again this month; almost did last month, but didn't quite make it.

> 221

I would encourage people to check their challenge doesn't exclude people from a shared read unnecessarily

that's really a good thought, and you are correct in your assertions. I'll keep that in mind in future challenges. After all, the idea is to increase shared reads.

No, but review commitments sometimes do

Yeah. Sometimes I feel a bit bogged down by reviews - even though I don't have to do most of them. I like to keep up with them just in case I want to refer back to my own thoughts about something I've read in the past. I do this quite frequently, in fact.

I just acquired Bearded Lady by Mara Altman, even though I don't have a *real* Kindle to read it on (I should've thought to have my mom loan me hers! too late now). I will finish it in the next week or so, thus it's a shared read with Chatterbox. It's short - about 46 pages printed, the page says - so I figured what-the-hey. If anyone else wants to join in and you have a Kindle device + Prime, it's currently free. (Or $1.99 if you don't fit both qualifications, like me.)

It's for the Non-Fiction with Humor (or by/about a person known for their humor) challenge.

> 222

Well I have to wonder if this conversation was initiated because of a comment about TIOLI I made on another thread last week

No, but I often browse threads just to see what people think of the TIOLI challenges and if there are changes I might need to make. I also like to monitor the interest of others to see if it is worthwhile even continuing with the TIOLI challenges. If there is not enough interest or support, I'd probably move on to something else. If there is interest and support, I'd just as soon stay involved.

But that's just me being crabby.

Not really. I get crabby when I see challenges that are too broad. No one hears me, though. That's the beauty of the many, varied challenges. It's important to "leave" the challenges that don't appeal to you - even if that challenge happens to be challenge #1. I like wacky challenges so you might be more inclined to dislike mine and like those of kidzdoc or citizenjoyce. That's quite all right.

there are just so many threads to follow and not enough time.

Agreed. For that reason, I seldom get the chance to visit the threads of other 75-ers. I do have a job in real life!

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The belief that I was allowing TIOLI to take over my reading

I can see that being a problem. Each person has to deal with that issue in his or her own way, though. Perhaps, another time, I'll open that up as a discussion question.

And I did drop out for the first quarter of this year, just to get myself back into my own personal reading mode.

It's interesting to learn about why people join and why they drop out. I appreciate this input.

>209 _Zoe_:, 213. Are you say that the wiki should link to the message in the main talk thread where the challenge is described?

No. Well, not me anyway. Not on the wiki; I know Madeline doesn't want anything extra on the wiki. I'm saying that it would be nice if Madeline's post in #2 of each month's thread where she lists the challenges all together with links to their wiki pages might ALSO have a link to the post in the thread which discusses each particular challenge (or the separate thread link, as she currently does, whichever is needed). The bottom line is that I was just hoping for a better way to find the challenge details within the forest of these long threads.

Luci makes a good point about being flexible with editions, etc. I think Soupdragon's flower challenge did a great job of that this time -- we can read any edition, as long as there is one edition with a flower on the cover. Presumably, it could be the Esperanto edition, but an English version would still work! There are lots of ways to do this -- for instance, with page counts, someone could specify that you can read any version of a book that has more than 350 pages, or match reads of books with red covers, even if your edition is the cyber or audio version and thus doesn't have a cover per se. I'd encourage adopting a kind of standard (like we do for embedded words) where unless the challenger specifically says "no dice", there shouldn't be any restrictions vis a vis different editions, given that we're scattered all around the globe.

I think the reading of new books is always going to be a bit of an issue, as so many of us get galleys and want to read them rapidly (or have to!) There's a similar problem with libraries -- some of us are lucky to live near great libraries and have ready access to lots of copies of books, while others have to wait weeks or months and then can only get a book for 2 or 3 weeks. It's uneven, but I'm not sure there is a lot we can do about that, as long as a book fits a challenge. Personally, I'm always intrigued to see what people are reading. I don't often feel the urge to make something a joint read "just because", but when I see several people have read a book and loved it, I might follow it up the next month.

> 209, 213, 228

I'm saying that it would be nice if Madeline's post in #2 of each month's thread where she lists the challenges all together with links to their wiki pages might ALSO have a link to the post in the thread which discusses each particular challenge

I am willing to do this.

> 229

I'd encourage adopting a kind of standard (like we do for embedded words) where unless the challenger specifically says "no dice", there shouldn't be any restrictions vis a vis different editions, given that we're scattered all around the globe.

The more you talk about this issue, the more sense it seems to make. I'd be willing to try to be a bit more flexible. Let me know if I'm not trying hard enough! :)

Don't we already have a policy that people can match shared reads unless the challenger specifically states otherwise? I thought this was precisely the sort of situation that it was supposed to address.

1. Why did you join the TIOLI challenges?
It looked like fun when Madeline posted the first one and I've stuck around since then

2. What have you liked about them?
Mainly the end-of-month enthusiasm shown by everyone when the new thread goes up and the new challenges appear. This has been one of my main contact points with 75ers whose threads I don't visit that often due to the sheer number of threads out there in the group. It's also as Madeline originally intended a way to find other readers with similar reading tastes. I've enjoyed the book discussion threads, sometimes they never get going but the initial post can have interesting info in it. I've also enjoyed the book cover/author photo threads - pure and simple fun. I like managing to do some shared reads from time to time.

3. What have you disliked about them?
Some of the challenges haven't been that interesting or too open, or too US-centric. But these are personal issues. I found myself continually listing too many books last year and then feeling the pressure to read as many as I could. This year my strategy has been to limit how many I list at the start of the month to around 5 books. Occasionally the discussion about TIOLI itself has become quite charged.

4. How would you improve them?
Nothing really. I agree that some challenges could be repeated from time to time, especially some of the awards ones.

5. If you've thought of dropping out of them, what precipated those thoughts?
When planning to read a few longer books I've thought about dropping TIOLI for a month or so

6. If you've already dropped out (and are still here lurking - I see you!), what caused you to do so? N/A

7. Do you feel that the TIOLI challenges take the spontaneity out of your reading? Why or why not?
No, because I'm happy to embrace the 'OLI' option and go for different book.

8. Have you recommended the TIOLI challenges to others? If so, why?
I've recommended it to a few 75 group newcomers in the past as a way of easing into our group culture. I haven't done this for a while.

> 232

Don't we already have a policy that people can match shared reads unless the challenger specifically states otherwise?

We do. However, it gets ticklish when challengers have different editions that do *not* fit the parameters (e.g. editions that have no flower on the cover, e-readers which do not have page numbers or might have page numbers that change as font size changes!).

Some challenge hosts are stricter with their challenges than others. In the beginning, we were using polls much more often to decide these things. More recently, it seems that challenge host makes a rigid ruling about what's acceptable and what's not. Ultimately, though, we'll have to go with what the host challenger says. I do hear the plea for more leniency, though. Perhaps we should all keep that plea in mind as we go forward.

> 233

Some of the challenges haven't been that interesting or too open, or too US-centric

Gulp! I know I'm guilty of some of those US-centric challenges. I appreciate you pointing that out. Perhaps we can keep that issue in mind as we create challenges in the future.

We do. However, it gets ticklish when challengers have different editions that do *not* fit the parameters (e.g. editions that have no flower on the cover, e-readers which do not have page numbers or might have page numbers that change as font size changes!).

But this is exactly the point of the rule! If the edition matched the criteria, then there would be no question about whether it could be listed.

But I agree that it's better when the challenger chooses leniency (which is the default choice anyway), and there could be some encouragement in that direction.

Folks, I'm going to call it a night as I have to work in the morning. Feel free to continue to post and talk about the above topics, but I won't be able to reply until tomorrow evening at the earliest.

I really appreciate your honesty. I think we can move forward with some improvements in the TIOLI challenges based on your suggestions.

Thank you all so very much!

I see the thread police, so I'll be moving on to a new thread before I hit the sack...

We're zig-zagging a bit between "the challenges are too broad" and "the challenges are too narrow", which suggests to me that we're probably getting it about right.

I can't help but be a bit amused by the objections to the animal / beverage challenge (as an example of too narrow), when I think of how many people found a book that fit. I think that was a case of a challenge looking a lot harder than it rurned out to be! :)

> 239

We're zig-zagging a bit between "the challenges are too broad" and "the challenges are too narrow", which suggests to me that we're probably getting it about right.

Phew!! :)

I think that was a case of a challenge looking a lot harder than it rurned out to be!

Right you are. It seemed to me that there were a gazillion entries on that challenge.

Now for real... G'night all! :)

I have edited my own challenge to allow for matched reads outside the restrictions of the challenge, though I don't expect there to be that many shared reads as many of us, like me, are mostly using it for new and forthcoming books with limited availability, too new for the library or expensive to buy. However, my first book for this challenge is for review for part of a life's work feature - deadline 23 April for review - and Ian Rankin's The Complaints is old enough to be in paperback - don't know what international library availability is lidke, should be quite good here.